changing from private to state, coul you go on a waiting list for a good state school ?

[mummyloveslucy]

If a child is at a private school but needs to change to a state school for year 1 (about 5.5 years old) can they go on a waiting list for any school neer them or will they just be allocated to whatever school has a place?
Friends of ours have a daughter in a private school and they have to take her out but are worried that she could be sent anywere.
They could possibly keep her there another term or so untill a place at a school became availabe.
I told her I'd try to find out what I could.

She is 5 years old and half way through reception at the moment.

They can, as far as I am aware (and certainly true here) put her name on the waiting list for any schools they choose. If there is pressing need, the LEA will allocate a place at a school with places, but there is no onus on the parents to take that place up. The individual schools should be able to give an idea of waiting list movement.

There may be a difference with faith schools though.

Oh that's good. I don't think they particulally want a faith school but they would like one close to home.
Can they go on a waiting list for more than one school ?

Yes - as many as they like as far as I am aware. Actually, know of people who have done this (multiple waiting lists) with no difficulty.

Thank you, that will help to put her mind to rest. She is very upset at having to take her daughter out of the school at the moment. It'll be good to tell her something positive.

State schools don't have "waiting lists". They have an allocation list whereby the names of children who meet the criteria are put until a place comes up - if a new name is added to the list who perhaps lives nearer the school that child jumps to the top of the allocation list.

Depends on the LEA - ours doesn't have waiting lists. You have to apply for a school by a given date (you can list 3 schools) but if you transfer in at any other time you can contact the LEA or the school direct and ask to apply. If they have any places then you're in. If not then they will advise you of other schools with places in that year group.

That's good then as they want somewhere close to home.

Yes ZB - that's what I mean. But a waiting list like an allocation list. The only criteria in local states schools here are:

• in care of the state
• statement for special needs
• Sibling
• proximity.

The first 3 are usually addressed/dealt with pretty quickly. As a result of which the outstanding allocation lists are generally dealt with on proximity grounds alone. DD is still on the waiting list for the school up the road (she is in yr 1 now). We have gone from 18th to 2nd and now down to 4th, as people move away or move into the area. (not that bothered though as she has settled well where she is). My point is though that she could be on 2 or 3 or more other allocation lists, moving up and down depending upon whether other people more or less adequately meet the criteria and as and when spaces come up.

zanzibarmum is right - although certainly at secondary, there is a degree of 'place becomes available - Head quickly telephones that nice family who registered an interest a couple of months ago, before the LEA spots the vacancy & parachutes in some headbanger recently excluded from A.N. Other School'.

But yes, technically, she can go on a waiting list, but can be displaced by another child (in care/SEN/siblings at school/lives closer) should one also apply before a place becomes vacant.

Thanks everyone. That will help.

Look I really think your friend is kidding herself.

She is not going to get on a waiting list for a good primary school. If it is a good school you just have to live in the catchment area or go to the local church for 2 years before you apply.

If she has to come out of a pivate school - just rent a house near the best state school she can find and live there. Its the only way of getting what you want.

If she goes to the LEA they will put her in whatever school is nearest that has no waiting list. That could be a hell hole.

Why is she kidding herself betadad?

She may, for all we know, live immediately next door to (or within close distance of) an outstanding school, but just happen at the moment to send her dd to a private school. I know people who do this - choose private over state regardless of proximity/excellence of the state option. Madness IMO but that is a whole different thread

MLL has specifically said that they want one close to home. The good schools round here are hard to get into, but there is a fair amount of movement after the year has begun. Last year in reception, in a nearby school, at total of 5 children left. Also the waiting list dramatically shrank as people on the waiting list similarly moved out of the area (though some moved in to replace them on the list).

re the "friend" ..... Perhaps you should show them how much info you are getting on their behalf.

The main poiint would be, why does the child have to come out of the independent school?
If it is due to money, all such schools require a term's notice of leaving: ie, pay a term's fees if you take the child out without giving notice. Otherwise, give a term's notice of taking the child out. So, if a place came up at a state school suddenly, the child would need to take the place up to prevent it going to the next child on the waiting list, but your friend could find herself stuck with a lot of money paid in advance , if she had given a term's notice, which would not be refunded, or else take the child out, not hvingnnotice, but then have to pay a term's fees.

Decent schools would waive stringent notice conditions in really, genuine, exceptional circumstances such as bereavement or serious illness causing a change in family circumstances. I do not think that general being made redundant counts as "exceptional".

II'minterested to know how your friend equates a state education with the school her child is already at: has she seen a state school that has made her think less of the existing one?I would advise caution- quality is hard to find.

Another possible option for them would be to take her out of the independent school and home educate her until they get a place at a state school they would be happy with. That way they can pick a date and give the required notice to the school, without having to have the state school place lined up.

Obviously that depends on one of the parents, or another family member etc, being avaiable in the daytime.

I don't know why you are being so ahrd

for all we know OP's frined could live next door / within walkable distance of three good schools thata re full and be unable to take on independent fees long term becuase she is severely ill / redundant (unusual no, damned shame yes) or somesuch

She might have enough cash saved for 2 terms and know that if she can sort it in the span of one term she can pay 'contract breaker' charges of one term fees.

There's no reason here I can see to get funny (bar it being a MN post about private schools obv that doesn't fall into either camp of pro private ot pro state).

I hope your friend gets this sorted OP.

In London here, but know of several people who have done this in recent months. A couple have gone on to home-ed for up to a term in order to wait for a place at their school of choice rather than accept whatever the LEA happens to offer. Waiting lists can change very quickly - one girl was initially 18th on the list for a Year 4 place. When a space came up she went to 1st place (as preusmably many of the others on the waiting list were not that interested in moving when it came to it).

It is also worth noting that Year 3 upwards are not limited to class size of 30 and this seems to have been a good entry point.

Thank you everyone. My friend does live close to 2 good state schools.
She wanted her daughter to go to the school she went to as she was so happy there. I think she went to see her local state school and said it was o.k but you can't compare it to the school she's at.
Her husband has been made redundant so they need to take her out. They are both very sad about it but realise it has to be done.
I've mentioned to them that she could perhaps put her daughter back in the private school for secondery instead when they are better off.
It's a good point about home ed, I'll definately mention to her all you've said. I keep telling her she should join Mumsnet.

mummyloveslucy

Look I really am not being mean here but your friend is going to get walked on if she is not careful.

There are a lot of desperate people out there who are trying to get their kids into good state schools and like your friend a lot of them are coming out of private schools into state because they have bene made redundant, run out of money, cannot afford fees etc.

Waiting in a queue and hoping she will get a call from the council telling her she can send her daughter to the nice school down the road is just not going to work.

She has to learn the system and start working out a strategy to get what she wants.

I really do wish her the best - being made redundant is a horrible experience.

Depends on LEA but where we are if you are applying after the inital allocation at Reception stage you simply contact the school direct to see if they have a space. I had to do this last year with DS, LEA said they didn't get involved, it's up to the parent to trawl round schools and see which have places.

verylapsedrunner

Yes - see my post above. She has to start working the phones. She has to start hussling and hassling. It is not going to work by magic. She has to get in touch with parents who know the system, she has to work the system, sweat blood, work 24/7 until she gets what she wants.

I know she'd be willing to do anything to get her in to a good school but I don't think she has any idea of how to go about it. They are such a lovely familly, I do feel sorry for them as they'd do anything for their daughter.
They'll need to do a bit of research.

mummyloveslucy

I think you really need to give your friend a lot of support here. Maybe even do the initial phoning for her if you can. She sounds like she might be pretty vulnerable right now and kind of expecting someone to give her a helping hand and that 'the nice lady from the council' will make sure everything is OK. It will not happen that way - she really is not thinking straight. Sadly being a 'lovely family' is the last thing she wants to be right now.

She is about to enter a world of hate and pain - I am truely shocked by the things people admit to me that they did to get their kids into good schools.

Does anyone else agree - disagree with my point of view?

Tell me what they admit too. I'd love to know.

mmummyloveslucy

Well of course there is the usual crowd who went to church for two years before their kid is due to go into reception at the local state school.

Then of course there was the woman that had two houses. She lived one but rented the other out but pretened to be living in both the one that was rented out and also the one she really lived in. The two houses were in different catchment areas for two really good schools. That way she doubled her chances but the LEAs never cross check.

BUT these strategies will be far too long term for your friend to pursue.

Of course the main crieteria is making sure she knows exactly where the boundaries are for the catchement areas and make sure she is living within them. Then she needs to find out exactly who is above her in the lists and what their circumstances are. She has to keep phoning to make sure she is not slipping down the list. If possible get on two lists for two good schools.

I heard some people use their parents or her parents in law who live next to a really good state school. They just 'swap houses' with them for a while and make sure they get their names on the voters role and council tax register. that is what the LEA checks apparently.

One woman I heard systematically worked out who was on the list and then went and shopped all the ones who were not 'really living in the catchment area' so they got chucked off the list.

Some people try the special educational needs route and get the child 'statemented' and that takes money. I hear there are educational consultants that do this and some have lower critera than others - you just need to find the right one.

Of course I have never ever condone these methods and am not recommending them as my kids do not go to state school. Its just what I have heard from others.