Can a school replace a permanent exclusion with a managed move?

[Anthisan2012]

My son has just been permanently excluded from secondary school, the school and local authority are trying to force me into a managed move where they will remove the exclusion. Are they allowed to do this?

Although LAs try to get away with it, on its own, maths and English tuition would not be sufficient provision.

OP I’m sorry - I’m really struggling to believe that nothing else at all has happened to warrant this situation.

The only incident I’ve heard of from an ex-colleague that came close was a student bringing a weapon into school and threatening to use it. Within two hours of the threat being made the child was permanently excluded.

If you genuinely don’t know of any other incidents then I suggest you put in a freedom of information request asking for all information relating to your child. This will give you every email, form and comment on various systems about your child and will give you a full understanding of the situation you’re in.

@scoopofmintchocchipicecream the guidance you've quoted doesn't apply to PEX that have already been issued. It can 'feel' like off rolling even when it isn't.

It could still apply when a PEX has already taken place but an ultimatum around rescinding it has been put on table. Since there isn’t one legal definition of what off-rolling is, it would be down to the judgement on the day.

Honestly, this is the only incident other than missing homework or being late a couple of times over a few years. He has had a couple of removals from classroom due to messing about or talking to much - there genuinely is nothing else as I have all of the information on his record as this was requested when a formal complaint was made.

it was a one off incident for a fight after school, which was recorded by other students and can be seen that they are both throwing punches from the start. The other student was waiting to attack him after school and blocked his route home. I have the video evidence of this. I have made a lot of complaints about this school and uncovered many breaches of policy which are all documented, including failing to safeguard my son and follow the proper procedures regarding an inappropriate teacher and failing to report this to LADO. This is why it feels underhand and that they would rather remove him and his history as they are due an Ofsted inspection any day.

Have you had him assessed op?

Ive been in a similar situation although not quite at the stage of permanent exclusion. A lot of my DC issues were due to undiagnosed SEN needs. Getting constant suspensions, detentions, isolations due to his “naughty’ behaviour. I knew he had SEND needs but was waiting to get a diagnosis. They also knew he had SEND needs but tried to kick the can down the road by thinking if they fobbed him off at another school for off site direction with a view to a permanent managed move then he would no longer be their problem. Of course they didn’t directly say this and tried to dress it up as a “fresh start” as if the off site direction would somehow give him a whole new personality transplant and his SEN would somehow disappear overnight.

Turned out he struggled with his lessons, fidgeted, struggled to process what was said to him and his way of dealing with this was to disrupt lessons. I now have a diagnosis for him and school have now had to put support in place for him. With this support he is now managing to turn things around and they can no longer suspend him for obvious SEN issues. So I completely understand what you’re saying and why it’s a worry. Just sending to another mainstream school when they are clearly already struggling in a mainstream school is not the best idea.

You need to get an EHCP asap. It won't help you right now but will protect him in future, especially if things go even more south.

They can't do a managed move without your consent https://childlawadvice.org.uk/information-pages/managed-moves/ being pressured into it could well be viewed as off-rolling. There's no reason why support can't be put in place immediately so anyone saying it requires two months assessment would put me right off.

If he's Px'd the LA become responsible for providing suitable full time education under section 19 of the Education Act 1996. This could be via another school, PRU or other alternative provision (which despite someone's comment above often does exist without many people knowing about it).

Respectfully, PEX doesn't work like that. Having a fight outside of school means that he has been involved in a one off incident. In addition, if both young people were in uniform, the school can.add the clause of 'bringing the school into disrepute'
The school can't add evidence to create a PEX.
They can't suspend and then change to a PEX either.
They won't tell you if the other young person is also facing a PEX

The reason would have been physical assault.
If you go to the GDC meeting (the panel meeting where the governors decide whether they uphold the headteachers decision or not) then the evidence of them both fighting will be played to the panel.

At the moment, you have 2 options

1. Allow the PEX process to continue and whatever the outcome is will be the outcome.
2. Accept the managed move offer.

The managed move offer won't remain once the GDC meeting is set and is taking place.

Thank you - and I think what people don’t understand is how long it takes for these things to be put in place - it’s taken 3 years to get to where we are and without the agreement of these things being place from the start at the new school - it feels as though we are starting at rock bottom again. But this time with a child whose anxiety is making them ill, and he’s at the end of his limit when it comes to being able to cope. I don’t want him to have to go and suffer for 2 months before it can actually be identified as to what he needs - and then the amount of time to put this in place - he is also currently on a bespoke timetable due to the fact that he can’t cope and putting him in a new school in full time days will literally lead to a full break down and I really don’t want that and hence why I don’t have the enthusiasm of this ‘new start’

I feel your pain op. It’s disgusting how we have to constantly fight for our children at school. I have no advice as my DC hasn’t been manage moved as he failed the off site direction placement so they sent him back to his own school. We haven’t got to the stage of him being excluded so it’s hard to advise what the process is. But you have my absolute sympathy in what you’re going through. All these pp’s saying it will give him a “fresh start”. It won’t. That only works for neurotypical kids. The only thing that I can see happening is that he gets fobbed off to another school and the issues continue… until the new school decide to fob him off somewhere else or PEX him. Just sending him for a “fresh start” sounds all rosey and good. But it will make his anxiety worse and like you say, he won’t be able to cope.

I really hope you get this resolved asap 🌺

yes he was involved in the fight, but the school have a responsibility to consider the context. They also have made a lot of errors when investigating this incident - including stating my son was taking too long to write his statement (due to his Sen) and they would carry on writing it for him and have then added their own version rather than my sons. They also phoned me and pretended that the police had asked me to give them my son’s passcode for his phone.

Yes - they can.

Your alternative is the PEx will stand, then the LA will place within a certain time frame. You get even less control.

For physical violence, you next to no chance of winning reinstatement, especially because I suspect (from your other posts) that this is very much a 'last' offence, not first.

School aren't failing your child.

If you think he needs special provision, then he needs an EHCP. Have you or school started this process? If not, then it will take months - so take the managed move as it is not everyone who gets offered one and it is a chance to start to get things in place.
Students are not PEX’d for one fight so there is more to this I expect.

This is the first and only incident and yes school have without doubt failed my child and I have several email confirming where they have failed to follow the correct procedures, failed to conduct Sen reviews, failed to safeguard my son, removed him incorrectly from the Sen register - so yes school have failed my son and have even admitted it themselves hence why there rushing around to give whatever I wanted when the formal complaint was made

Yes this is in process and has just been submitted

So he is at a school that offers what he needs, but it still didn’t work and he got into a fight, sounds like he needs a new start to address if he is the issue or the people he is hanging around with are.

No school have only just put in place what he needs after months and months of fighting for this

I would love to know though, if this is a “last” offence, then what are all the other offences for. I mean, if you read the countless threads on other people who have kids with SEN and looking at my own experiences with my DC, then mainstream schools (mostly secondary schools) just suspend, use isolation and detentions at the drop of a hat. There is a string of “offences” my son had supposed to have done before his diagnosis where he was just labelled as the “naughty” kid because it was just easier than looking into the root cause. I mean, yes I agree actions do have consequences but when your kid doesn’t understand why his brain is causing these actions or understand why he was being punished for stuff he couldn’t help, then yes just simply fobbing off to a new school wont work. I know in some areas if a kid is PEX’d, a lot get placed in PRUs or alternative provisions until a new school place is found as that is the case in my area.

My son is now diagnosed and they can’t just suspend him for his SEN issues and label him as a naughty kid anymore or fob him off to another school for a “fresh start”. They have to put the support in place now instead. And strangely enough he’s doing much better since. But it does make me wonder how many “offences” in the op’s case are down to SEN needs.

@Flyingintotheunknown are you aware of how impossibly difficult it is for schools to access SEND provision?

Before our council will even add a student to their three year long waitlist we have to provide extensive evidence of all the ways we’ve been supporting that student as if they have a diagnosis of that need already. As in we have to be providing one to one TA support without the funding provided by the EHCP for years before that child will even be assessed, let alone the process completed.

Granted, some adjustments can be made at a whole class level that work for students like this but for many students who will ultimately be awarded an EHCP they need much more specific, specialist interventions that require significant funds.

We try our best to do right by our students but the resources just aren’t there - my school will be running at a deficit next year and we try hard for all our students. Many who should by rights have been excluded a long time ago are still with us because my Head feels so strongly that it needs to be the very last option, even when this has cost him the support of some staff as the situation is so challenging.

Have you looked at what alternative provision is in your area ?
Because if you refuse the managed move ,you could be a while getting him back in to education
Are you prepared to be home with him ? During the day ..do you work ?
Because if you refuse the managed move ,he won't be in school ,you will be looking after him at home in stead of going to work.
Those points aside ,I do agree with you ,I totally get your point of view and I'd be feeling the same in your shoes .
Have you got a SENDASS in your area ..they could give you free advice.
My son got expelled and the EHCP was done in super quick time while he was home with me .lea pulled out all the stops and he was in a special school fairly quickly..but by that point I'd involved the police and reported the school to social services and Ofsted so there was no going back.
I do think you need some advice
How near are you with CAMHs to any diagnosis?
I'm pretty sure it's a whole different ball game if they expel a child with a diagnosis,as apposed to one without ..think that's why our EHCP was done quite quickly

OP, if the permanent exclusion is relating to a single incident, then the years of the school not putting support in place for other issues will have no bearing on the outcome of the PEX hearing.
the panel will look at whether the decision was lawful - reasonable, proportionate, and in line with their policy.

the panel should ask whether you consider your DC to have a disability - you can give your evidence to this point. BUT - you’d need to show that, for example, the incident only happened because the school had agreed specific support and then failed to provide the support.

It sounds more like the incident would have happened either way?
you feel DC’s needs were not taken into consideration during the investigation of the incident, but the school don’t necessarily agree that DC has needs?

I am absolutely aware how difficult it is.
My point is… just simply constantly punishing a child with SEN needs does not work! Fobbing them off to another school on a managed move for a “fresh start” also does not work! They don’t all of a sudden develop a new personality or have their SEN issues disappear just by being sent to a new school for a “fresh start”. I get the op’s point and I feel her pain. It’s like hitting a brick wall.

Thank you for this it is such a relief for someone to understand how I feel. I am more than happy to support home learning with him, and we are lucky enough to be in a position for me to be at home with him or I can work alongside this if needed. I already have diagnoses although there is possibly more, and he is currently under the paediatrician aswell. I have worked with SENDIASS before and I have been attempting to contact them today - and will try again tomorrow.

Yes the school knows he has needs including a learning specialist report and several educational reports and official diagnosis

So that's really positive
Have you got ..or do you know who your LEA officer is ?
Have you tried explaining to them exactly what you wrote here ,and why you don't think the managed move is a good idea ?
It's always better to try to work with them ,and keep a good relationship going ,if at all possible.
The other thing you could do ..if you know which school they are trying to do a manager move to ...you could go for an appointment and be brutally honest about the support your son needs ..I expect the LEA have glossed over a lot of issues..the school need the full picture before accepting him.
With the full picture,they may choose not to accept him.
You really do need the diagnosis and the EHCP ..
Try ringing CAMHS and getting an appointment..they are usually more likely to see children not in school imho