How much support is realistic?

[purpleheartsandroses]

Hi,

I just want to gauge opinions. I've got a meeting with school next week but not sure if I'm being unrealistic with my expectations. (I'm an ex-teachers so know what I would have done).

Y11 boy. Underachieving in all subjects. Drastically underachieving e.g. predicted a 7 and got a 1 in the latest mocks. November mocks was underachieving by roughly 2 grades in most subjects, achieving target in 1 subject, exceeding target in 1 subject. End of Y10, underachieving on paper because they sat actual papers and hadn't covered a lot, but teachers were all happy he would be on track.

Well behaved generally, the odd demerit for organisation (when they changed the timetable so PE days changed) and little things but behaviour has never been an issue. Happy at home. Social. Sporty. I won't rule out MH, but certainly doesn't seem it on the surface.

What would you expect from school in these circumstances?

For transparency: It is a fee-paying state school (yes, they exist. The education is free but fees are mandatory for the co-curricular program and/or boarding. Cheaper than private school but the same level of facilities).

Why does he think he’s underachieving?

First question is, how aspirational are the targets? I would ask the school how they arrived at them if you don't already know. If they're stretch targets then really being 2 grades off them in November isn't that bad.

What happened between November mocks and the more recent mocks? Did he do any revision for either?

What would you like the school to do? I'm not clear from your post whether he just needs to knuckle down and do some work? At this point in year 11, most successful students will be doing 1.5- 2 hours per week of homework and self study (combined) per subject.

Does he have a revision timetable? Does he know how to revise? Those are fairly straightforward things to support with yourself at home. Aim for active revision involving plenty of practice questions, self marking and filling in gaps.

The targets were completely realistic when they were set at the beginning of y10. They don't seem realistic now.

He did more revision for the latest mocks than he did for November mocks. A lot more. He easily does 1 hr+ most evenings, including practice papers that either I mark or if it's a subject I can't, he will ask his teacher to mark. He also attends school revision sessions several times a week.

I do think revision technique is something to work on. He is opposed to making revision cards. His preferred methods are reading/highlighting revision guides and notes + doing practice questions/papers.

His big weakness is exam technique - which is something I'd expect school to address, not me. I taught primary so am not sufficiently knowledgable about GCSE requirements. Also time, which was an issue that's been brought up at every parent's evening in most subjects, for years and years and years. But nothing has been done. I've also raised it with HOY and tutor multiple times.

I would have expected school to step in with interventions much sooner. Actual targeted interventions, not general, relaxed after-school group revision.
I would have expected teachers to share their concerns and not not gloss over his results with excuses that made it seem it wasn't a big deal, he'd be fine.
And I would expect a more formal meeting with head of academics to share concerns and come up with a shared plan.

Does he board @purpleheartsandroses or is he a day student – which would give you perhaps a better steer on how much work he is doing?

If he is getting 1s in all his mocks now (ie mocks sat in Feb do you mean?) then I would hope the school will suggest some targeted support to the key subjects. Ideally he needs maths, English, science and then anything he plans to take forward if relevant (MFL, geog, history. PE, DT). Anything else is not essential so I would suggest focus on the core subjects he needs.

Six GCSEs is all you need. But yes, does he know how to revise? What kind of work is he doing?

If he is a boarder, what sort of support does the school offer to its year 11s – I would imagine there would be quite a high level of possible support as in extra small group sessions, revision guidance, etc.

ETA: I see I have x-posted and you have answered a lot of my queries.

Id also want to know if anyone has any SEN concerns as it's not a normal progress trajectory.

By exam technique, do you mean he is losing marks bc he isn’t answering the question as needed? Eng lang is a big example of this where the MS gives the details but the candidate needs to use the right terminology, not just "look I wrote loads".

If he has an issue with time, do you mean he runs out of time? Is there a possibility of ND (such as ADHD) or processing issues or visual disruption such as dyslexia? Trouble is it might be too late to get a diagnosis and support with extra time for example.

@claryHe's a day pupil.
Latest grades: 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 4, 5
Target grades: 7, 7, 6, 6, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7

Yes sorry I gathered that – I took too long to write as usual!

Those grades are somewhat alarming for sure. What subjects are the 33345?

Ex maths teacher.

that’s a hell of difference. I have never seen a student with predicteds of 7 or similar get a 1 unless they literally walked into the exam and basically didn’t do anything except the first two questions.

i’d be more inclined to ask him what on earth happened? That’s way way beyond Sen having an impact and into totally refused to answer any questions.

Have SEND needs been discussed before?

English language he actually got a 7 in Nov, but down to a 5 this time. It's his strongest subject.
Humanities is where I think he doesn't write "in the exam way" to get the marks.

But also not reading questions properly, the maths papers I've marked he loses marks for not paying attention to units or doing the inverse.

He's always run out of time on tests. I've brought it up God knows how many times but nothing's been done. I know extra time for GCSE is more strict than extra time for SATs so I trusted them to know what is/isn't allowed.

I know any SEN investigation won't be in time for GCSE but would be necessary for A level (if he even gets on to the course at this rate!) but his trajectory just seems so wrong, I'd have expected it to be flagged.

You say he got mostly two grades below expected in his November mocks.

so if his expected grades are 7s he mostly got 5s.

so between the November mocks and now he’s dropped from 5s to 1s or 2s?

I would not be seeing this as an academic issue to be honest. I taught maths for many years, including to students who had autism and learning difficulties and the maths you need to get a grade 1 at gcse is what is expected of most 7 year olds in year 3.
there is no way his maths is really at that level if he got a 5 in the November mock.

was he very anxious about the mocks? Have you seen his papers? (Ie did he actually even write stuff down?)

No. Never. No concerns.

He was always an avid reader, tailed off a bit in secondary but still happy to sit in the garden and read in the summer. Definitely not dyslexic. ADHD seems very unlikely, his focus has never been an issue and definitely not hyperactive. He's incredibly laid back.

ASD unlikely, but 2 siblings with ASD (1 disabled).

Maths is his biggest weakness but I still don't think dyscalculia. I think more the mental block of "maths is hard". He was in set 2 until Y11.

You need to start by talking to the school about what they think is happening. That big a drop in marks means that something is going very very wrong. You need some idea of what he is not doing before you ca even start with an intervention.

Does he live with you or is he boarding?

Has he started smoking weed or something? I don't understand how he can be getting a 1 if school think he should be at a 7.

You seem to be blaming the school, but not asking any questions of him and why he's doing so badly. Is he pulling the wool over your eyes and not doing any work/ up to no good?

The students I know with the kind of trajectory were usually involved in drugs or school refusing and becoming reclusive. It doesn't quite fit with a happy sporty friendly child who is trying hard. Is this the first time you've had concerns?

Science here - I would assume he doesn’t know or understand the content, isn’t using keywords and the right phrasing in answering questions. Data questions and applied questions would be a struggle if he didn’t have the analytical skills required.

with regards revision techniques it looks like he’s missing out some important steps in his revision and going straight from passive revision to questions. He needs to be doing active revision - mind maps, flashcards, small question and answer sessions etc etc before looking at papers

With the questions it may also be more useful for him to mark them himself so he can see where he’s going wrong and see where the phrasing and keywords are key to getting marks.

at this stage are the school talking about moving him to foundation papers rather than higher? If he’s getting lower than a 4 on higher paper he won’t grade at all in the summer so they may enter him for foundation papers.

It sounds like he needs targeted intervention but whether he has enough time to pull things around across the board I would be very unsure at this point.

He got a 4 in maths in Nov. A 2 this time. Predicted a 6.

He got a scaled score of 103 in Y6 SATs (COVID years but they sat a past paper). So he should have been >2 even then?

I haven't seen the papers, they're not allowed to bring them home. He's been moved down to foundation so he's been doing foundation papers at home and getting around 60%. The mock was a higher paper in Nov and Feb.

And just read the updates … agree trajectory is very concerning especially drop since November. Would it be possible to get copies of his mock papers ( both Nov and latest ones) to try and see what is going on?

What does he say happened? That’s a remarkable difference between prediction and mocks. Is there any anxiety? If he is trying to retain information in the test that he has learned and processing questions at the same time, it reduces his working memory so perhaps he needs to take notes to remember facts when he goes in to increase WM capacity.

Interventions at lunch and after school would be in place where we are but exam technique is crucial. Would he be prepared to sit next to you and do a past paper so you can see what happens? It would also help you to see his process. I’d also suggest that he reads the questions out loud before answering because you may find he isn’t actually reading the critical bit.

The other method is to time how long it takes him to answer questions. Sometimes you can then see they are getting caught up on a particular type and then help them to think about structure. Most subjects have a preferred way to answer questions, many of which are seen in YouTube videos so that may be worth looking into.

It is too late to do anything with regards to Access Arrangements but if you raise concerns with the school, they should investigate by at the very least contacting teachers to see if they have noticed concerns.

Have you spoken with his Head of Year or form tutor?

Sorry, that should say that they can investigate concerns and highlight for future exam access screening if required.

OK so the subjects that have gone from PG 7 to mock grade 1 – can you look at those papers? I agree with @Octavia64 that that is such a massive drop that he must have written almost nothing – it’s either a wilful refusal (which I have seen) or spending an excessive amount of time on one question, or panic, or something. What is his explanation?

Re SEN: if he has two siblings with ASC then it is very likely that he has some level of ND. And being an avid reader does not mean he is not dyslexic. You can be a great reader but still have visual intrusion and it can manifest in terms of organisational and memory skills.

Until August, I worked at the school so he'd come home with me so no suspicions of drugs. Even since September, I pick him up most days. I was a bit off the rails as a teen, so not naive. No smell of weed on his clothes/hair. Nothing untoward in pockets when I do the washing. No hidden stashes in his room. He's always coherent and normal amount of alertness.

I'm angry at the school for down-playing it, and not informing me or putting any interventions in place. A trajectory this bad should be spotted and parents brought in, not wait for parents to make contact.

His study area at home is either dining table or desk on the landing so I can see him revising. He is putting the work in, but it doesn't seem to be going in.

Not read full thread, but it seems like his revision is wrong. Reading, highlighting and copying notes are all far too passive. These have been proven time and again to be the least effective revision strategies. He needs to ‘think hard’ to cement knowledge into his long term memory so that he can easily pull the necessary information into his working memory quickly and actually during an exam. This is why he’s not answering the questions properly - the isn’t secure in his long-term memory. He needs to use more active retrieval strategies to properly learn the information. Information looking familiar is not enough.

Ok, yes a 103 scaled score at sats is higher than a grade 2 at gcse.

however - there are subtleties and it sounds like he has hit them.

in maths (and science) you can do the foundation or the higher paper. You say he did the higher paper in the mocks. The grades available on the higher paper are 987654.

it is quite common for students who are borderline higher/foundation to basically “drop off” the higher paper because they can’t do any of the questions (because it does NOT include the easier questions that the foundation paper does).

at my school we get these kids to double sit - they do both the higher paper and the foundation paper to see which they do best on.

sounds like your kid walked in and either couldn’t or wouldn’t answer the questions. You can’t actually get a grade 2 on the higher paper so it sounds like school have just given him a grade because in reality if he sat the higher paper and didn’t get enough marks for a 4 he’d get a U - ungraded - lower than a grade 1.

so what you need to do, at least for maths and probably science as well is ask for scanned copies of his papers, to try to confirm whether he actually answered any questions at all.

then I’d suggest getting school to allow him to sit the foundation papers for those subjects and see what he gets.

At our school, every lesson for year 11s is supported targeted revision. There are after school top up sessions for every subject. Each pupil will have a revision timetable, especially now they know when each exam is. Teachers are available to help students. You are a teacher, so you will know how things have been going. We have 2 months until GCSEs start, so only a few weeks. Encourage him to work as hard as he can. If he doesn’t, he will soon realise he will need a plan B. It’s not the end of the world. Just flipping frustrating.