Young Carer - Grammar School admission

[busySunflower]

My elder son who is a young carer has qualified for grammar school, the admission criteria says:
"Children who have exceptional medical or social needs (e.g. registered young carers), which can be met only at this school, supported by written evidence from a doctor, social worker, educational welfare officer or other appropriate person. "
Can some here guide me how do we mention that this school can only met the needs ?
Has anyone been through this journey, do we need to fill EMSAR ? EMSAR considers only one grammar school and it has to be top preference, our 3rd preference specifically prioratise young carer but we realised this very late.

This is for Bucks

All schools cater for the general pastoral needs of young carers. Some may do it better than others, just as some may be better at maths or art or sport than others, but that doesn't give every young carer in the area the right to expect privileged access to the school with the best reputation.

There is simply nothing exceptional about the op's case. If their young carer duties required them to go to a specific school in order to get home in time to do something critical, such as administering medicine, then they might have the beginnings of a case, but they would need evidence of the need from a medical professional.

Tbf, sometimes appeals do work for whatever reason. I worked with a family who, imo had no chance of the support they wanted, but they were granted it anyway. Not all LAs will be as scrupulous at applying the rules as you are suggesting.

The op isn't lodging an appeal, she's applying for exceptional circumstances. It's completely different.

I meant appeals in the broadest sense - asking for special circumstances like this, applying for grants, asking for certain ehc provision, whatever. I know it's not a formal appeal here - i just mean asking for something. Sometimes it works even when you think they have no chance.

I’m slightly confused @busySunflower. Your son passed the 11+ back in October and so, if you live in Bucks, he is eligible for a grammar school. Which specific grammar schools depends on your location. You would have then listed those grammar schools on your application form in your order of preference. The LA then run through each school in the order of preference applying the admissions rules to see if you meet then. For most schools in Bucks, distance is usually the determining factor. You will found out which grammar school you have national offer day but unless you are on a boundary, you can often take an educated guess before that.
So which school did you put down as your first choice and are you still happy with that? Or are you only now exploring which grammar school might best support a young career? If this, then I suggest starting a thread asking about support for young carers in Bucks grammar schools.

For appeals yes, for Exceptional Circumstances no. Unlike appeals, the EC criteria is not decided on the balance of human judgement. It is decided consistently, based on strict criteria, which the op simply doesn't meet.

to me it looks like criteria is written intentionally that way

@busySunflower Are you in catchment for either of the grammars you listed or is this a punt from way out of catchment? Do dc near you go to either of these schools?

We are in border, the farthest allocation made last year is 1mile away for one of the gs 3 miles away for another we never thought of moving closer to the GS, becuase of additional needs of the other child, we always wanted younger son to get the right support, meanwhile with less/zero preperation elderone got qualified while submitting the CAF we clearly mentioned where we are why we are not quite cloer to the school.

Bucks CC asked us to sumbit the EMSAR, we hardly had anytime to think about all we provided evidence is why we couldnt move or will never ever move.

We learned hardway in the month november that RLS(ONLY...yes they only) prioratis young carer as a last but one rule which works in our favour but that wanst our top prefered school and the rule says it has to be top preferenced once only and as a mum I am trying to give my best in these difficult cirmustances and there is nothing else.

I am not too sure if the rule is applied independent of preference

The national schools admissions code says:

1.16 If admission authorities decide to use social and medical need as an oversubscription criterion, they must set out in their arrangements how they will define this need and give clear details about what supporting evidence will be required (e.g. a letter from a doctor or social worker) and then make consistent decisions based on the evidence provided.

This is very different decision to the Appeals Code, which says:

"Second stage – balancing the arguments
3.8 The panel must balance the prejudice to the school against the appellant’s case
for the child to be admitted to the school. It must take into account the appellant’s
reasons for expressing a preference for the school, including what that school can offer
the child that the allocated or other schools cannot. If the panel considers that the
appellant’s case outweighs the prejudice to the school, it must uphold the appeal."

The first is a black and white decision - i.e. do they meet the letter of the criterion or not? The second is a more nuanced decision based on human judgement.

This case is more suited to an appeal than to exceptional circumstances.

AGS says social and medical need must be exceptional and can only be met by that school. Therefore I don’t see that at straightforward either.

Mileage alters. AGS was 11 miles last year but 2023 was 14 miles. I honestly think you just have to wait and see. I do not think order of preference matters. I assume you are further from the Floyd.

@OhDear111 , sadly our application got rejected saying the needs can be meet in any school. I am gearing up for an apeal

OP I think you have to take this up with the school themselves. While your points are valid obviously, I'm 99% sure that "young carer" is not a priority admissions criterion, in terms of the national government issued priority admissions criteria in England.

The paragraph above, saying
"Children who have exceptional medical or social needs (e.g. registered young carers), which can be met only at this school, supported by written evidence from a doctor, social worker, educational welfare officer or other appropriate person. "
Is something that this school have decided to put in themselves. They are perfectly allowed to do this, but only someone who knows how this school have written and chose to apply this criterion would be able to answer your question. I also think it would be the school individually who would need to accept your son, because the Education Authority who would be generally allocating all places, would not know to take it into account as it is not a national criterion that has to be applied to all schools.

@busySunflower I’m not surprised because it’s true. Bucks considers its secondary schools all ability too. On offer day, see what you get. If it’s a grammar, take it.

@OhDear111 You are so kind thanks for all the help and guidence
If we dont get a gramar school, would you recomend any solicitor for appeal process

You won’t get a place if dc doesn’t meet admissions Criteria. That will probably come down to distance now and that defends on where other qualifying dc live. I’m not sure you will have grounds for appeal. I’m sorry, but I don’t know any solicitors. However I suspect you would have to prove maladministration, and I cannot see that,

Your advice on this is incorrect. Appeals do not need to prove maladministration. They need to convince the appeal panel that the case for a place is stronger than the case for the school being full.

OP, you don't need a solicitor for an appeal, just a persuasive case.

Young carers are also eligible under fair access policy ("Childrens who are carers) that allows school to go over PAN, is my understanding correct ?

No, you need to re-read my previous answers in relation to the Exceptional Medical & Social Need criterion.

Fair Access Protocol is something completely different to EM&S need.

Kind of but it's not as straight forward as
Young carer = eligible under FAP = school allowed/required to go over PAN

FAP is about ensuring that a child who finds it extremely difficult to get a school place which meets there needs, is not turned away from a school that could take them and could meet their, simply because that school has reached PAN. If there are
a) no schools with spaces that could reasonably meet the child's needs
b) a school without space that could reasonably meet the child's needs
c) the school without official space, could go over PAN to fit the child in, without causing significant difficulties for other children or staff, such as the class being too big for the room, there being lack of space for facilities for a class that size, or the exits etc not meeting fire safety requirements for a class that size.

The reality is that FAP would ONLY be relevant in helping the young carer get a place if there was sufficient evidence that:

• the school in question could meet the child's needs
• the alternative places offered couldn't meet their needs.
• the school in question could safely exceed PAN

I guess the question in your situation is would traveling to a further be so problematic for the young carer, that the disadvantages for the nearer school in going over PAN are significantly less. If the grammar school he can travel to can actually meet his needs than FAP is irrelevant because he has a suitable school place without any school exceeding PAN which means no school needs to.

Gently what I think you need to remember OP, is that being a young carer in itself, is NOT a general priority criteria for school entry, either for the particular school or in terms of distance travelled being reduced. Therefore no school, other than a private one (who can set whatever entrance criteria they want) is going to be likely to just say your child can get a priority place simply because they are a young carer.

If there is real evidence (probably backed up by Drs/EP reports) that the mental health of your child as a result of being a young carer, means he is much more likely to thrive in one school, but not in another, he may get a place on Special Educational Need. He is unlikely to get a place based on other aspects of his caring responsibilities, because they will not fit the critrea relevant to school admission.

Unless you go for a private school where being a young carer is a priority criterion for entry, it's likely that your child would appropriately meet the criteria of entry for other schools as well as the one you would prefer, so FAP would never kick in.

understood.

Do you live in Bucks or are you in a bordering county @busySunflower ?
If you're in Bucks and he passed the 11 plus he should get a grammar place, is my understanding. If you don't live in Bucks then it seems they don't tend to give out places on appeal.

@stichguru I suspect the grammar the op wants is further away than the local school. Dc has scored sufficiently for a grammar but Bucks are not giving an automatic place based on dc being a carer. So dc will have to wait to see if a place is allocated on 2 March. Usually this comes down to distance from school and who lives nearer gets in but other criteria apply earlier in the admissions m the admissions process but Bucks won’t accept caring as a criterion leap frog into a grammar.

14% of appeals are successful, and most out of county appeals fail for the grammars because they are full. They also say distance is not a factor in an appeal as a parent has the responsibility to get dc to school. So wanting a certain school because it’s more convenient doesn’t work. We know they think all their schools can meet the needs of dc, so if the op lives out of. Bucks, this is difficult.

Last year 105 people appealed for a grammar having dc who had attained the pass mark. 7 were successful. However the op doesn’t yet know if they have a place or not. I’m assuming they think they are too far away on distance and probably don’t live in Bucks, so won’t get a place.

Applying under the exceptional medical or social needs admission rule (EMSAR) | Buckinghamshire Council https://share.google/jwS9isDpUh9vTDuze

Looking at this, the scope of the panel is to judge whether an application to a school which fall under its remit and actually has 'EMS needs' as an oversubscription criterion (and is the applicant's first preference school, plus one lower ranked upper school where the first preference is a grammar) should or should not be ranked under this criterion. It's not, 'should a school which doesn't have this as an oversubscription criterion be told to give this child priority'.

I don't know whether there panel is told that the school(s) is / are the highest preference(s), but presumably not, if the school the OP submitted evidence for is their third preference grammar, the only one with such an oversubscription criterion, and the response from the panel was 'Evidence does not meet threshold', rather than, 'We're not looking at this, because the named school doesn't have this criterion', or 'We're not looking at this, because although the named school does have this criterion, it was not the applicant's highest ranked grammar school on their CAF?

@busySunflower you say that you put your reasons in the free text box, but for the school which does include the EMS criterion in its admissions policy, was there not a question on the CAF, once you selected the school, along the lines of, 'Are you applying under criterion X? If so, you need to do this...?

If you are not applying from within Buckinghamshire County Council, then I can see that there might be an issue, but there should have been something in your home LA's 'essential information for parents' regarding checking each school's policy for any additional paperwork to be submitted

Admissions law allows parents to state any reason they like as to why they want a particular school, but equally, it restricts schools to only using its published oversubscription criteria to rank applications.