Yr 1, bright child - help - where do we go from here?

[Tanzie]

DD1 is supposed to be v bright and her teacher wants her to have an assessment by the G & T co-ordinator. For a variety of reasons (sick leave etc) the assessment keeps slipping and has not been done yet. DD keeps telling me she is bored at school and is now saying that she doesn't want to go to school as all she does is play (she is very anorakky child!). I mentioned this to her teacher yesterday and she said she really did not know what more to do - she has "extended" DD as much as she can, but she still needs more. We were told on Monday that the G & T assessment would be done this week, but once again it hasn't been. I do not want to be a pushy parent, and am not convinced she is "gifted and talented" - she is just a bit brighter than the rest and needs more work, but her teacher seems to be saying she can't give her anything more until this assessment is done. I don't want to go flouncing into the headmistress like Mrs Pushy Parent, but I don't want DD getting more and more reluctant to go to school because she is bored - any advice?

For sork read work - she gets it all from me....

Isn't KS1 a bit young for Gin & Tonic?

That's just for us mums

Gin and Tonic is my first thought as well!!
I'll have mine with ice and a slice of lime please. Oh, and can it be Bombay Sapphire gin please?

I know it's early, but it is Monday...

Thanks for the update Tanzie - sounds positive.

Tanzie, Roisin, can I ask about your thoughts on alternatives to acceleration?

School has today suggested accelerating dd (4 and a half, now in transition class between nursery and reception - October birthday, so one of the oldest) - but that would mean her skipping reception altogether & going into Year 1 before she's 5. I feel uncertain how to take this - I know she's a very able & forward child, & socially takes everything in her stride; but this particular acceleration idea seems like an enormous step. Any clever ideas of compromises/other approaches?

Hi binkie

Why would she have to skip reception? Why don't they put her into reception now, see how she copes and then make a decision?

On the plus side, it's good that the school have suggested it, as most won't even discuss acceleration, even for some subjects. On the other hand, I'm very glad we didn't do it for dd1, as I don't think it would have been good for her socially. But then again, she's a summer birthday, so one of the youngest in the class. No easy answers to this one, really.

If she's that far ahead, might you be looking to move her to a different school at7+?

A test term in reception is a very good idea - the relaxedness of summer term will probably balance well against the fact she might be thrown a year ahead in work terms. I will float that when we meet with school.

Don't know about moving her - I've always thought how well this school suits her - really like the teachers, the other parents, mix of children, and so on. It is meant to do well with very bright children, though perhaps better with conventionally bright kids (like dd) than with oddball brainboxes like ds. I am thinking of moving him.

I have been wondering about this - dd is 2.5, I always thought she was fairly forward for her age, took her for 2.5 check the other week and they said that she was incredibly advanced and that I had to be careful that she didn't get bored etc.

Have started her in nursery, how do I ensure she isn't bored? Not too worried for now, the class is 2.5 to 5 so she gets all sorts of stuff at different levels. But later, if it is still the case (I gather a lot of children who are advanced early kind of even out, is this right?) - what should I do?

She is early sept birthday so would be one of the eldest anyway - should I be thinking about starting her at school earlier?

I was similar, and even though I went to a very good school and was put up a year when I was 5 or 6, I was still bored as I used to grasp stuff quickly and then just muck around as I was fed up with waiting for everyone else. I don't want dd to feel like this, neither do I want her in a class of children much older than her. Am I worrying too early about this?

CD, I think my dd might have been insufferable this year if she had still been in a simple nursery environment - this "transition" class system has been a godsend. What schools are you thinking of for your dd? Do any of them have that system?

CD some schools do mixed year group classes so that they can meet the maximum of 30 per class. Perhaps your dd would benefit from entering school into a Reception/Year 1 group for which she'd be a likely candidate anyway as one of the eldest.

Also if you were considering private, you may find more flexibility as regards assessing your dd for entry to "the year ahead". A friend of mine successfully did this with her mid-Sept born dd so she started Reception just as she was about to turn 4.

We were offered the option of starting DD in Reception a year early this time last year. After much debate (Roisin was great!) we decided to keep her with her peers. The school she attended was moderately academic and we assumed that having identified her ability they would support her appropriately whichever "class" she was in.

Socially we made the right decision, DD doesn't always "get" other kids (it's hard to describe) and by staying with her peers she's defo come to manage situations better. In terms of her educational development (or whatever you want to call it), we got it wrong. She was bored, the school felt that by offering to accelerate her they'd done their bit and we'd turned them down. DD wasn't unhappy but she was frustrated.

We've recently moved and she's started a new school, the classes are much smaller (12 max, 2 qualified teachers) and she's already commenting on the differences (Mummy, they let me write stories!) so hopefully things will work out for the best. It's difficult to get the balance right at pre-school age (IME), esp as encouraging
reading/writing risks the dreaded pushy parent label, but in our case we have a child who has "taught herself" to a great extent and to her reading is as much fun as as playing with her dolls house.

Should add that I was put forward a year at school (despite being the youngest in my own age-group) and loved it. The probs started when we moved and the new school insisted I had to be with my peers. As there is a chance we will move again before DD's school days are over I didn't want to risk her ending up in that position (which was truly miserable for me).

Just wanted to add that my son is Y5, and works with the Y6 children, and absolutly thrives with the harder challenge, and is still in the top group with a few Y6, so I have been really pleased with this. He now has his L5 maths etc, but teacher has advised that they can't do harder work with him in Y6 (L6) but will use it as a revision year, which I am a bit concerned about. He also sits his 11+ this next time. He adores maths and science, but don't know really what else I can do for him in Y6 to push him if school can't?

Sorry to hijack the thread temporarily

CD
Did your DD have her 2.5 year check at Sheen health centre? I remember that you are local to me.

I'm asking because DS also had one a couple of weeks ago (he is early sept too) and I was also told he was very clever.

They also mentioned that because he looks older than he is he might have problems at school. For that reason I have been also deliberating what to do re: starting school. Do I start him early or let him be the oldest in the class. I don't want him to be a geeky misfit IYKWIM. I posted about this and got some replies but ultimately I guess it depends on the individual.
Sigh - so many decisions to make and I don't know what to do.

Binkie - Hi! I didn't realise you had two little bright sparks
My ds2 is more 'conventionally' bright too, unlike ds1, so that's a huge relief to me

I'm not a huge fan of accelleration, and in isolation IMO it often achieves little. Many 'bright' children are working at a level at least 2-3 yrs above their chronological age, and progressing at a much faster rate, so going up a year doesn't help much.

However, I think there is a case to be made particularly for autumn-born children, especially emotionally and socially-mature girls. It does depend on the school, but some reception classes can be pretty horrific for highly able children. If a girl starts a reception class when she is almost 5, and has already been reading fluently for some time, then it's easy to see how carpet-time sessions for the first week concentrating on the letters a s d p i n and the number 1 can be excruciating.

If the school are considering accelleration I think it's worth asking the question as to what are the possibilities for the future in that school, and feeder schools. Will she have to re-do a year at some point? Having said that I do think KS1 classes, teaching and curriculum are the most difficult for highly able children. As it is very hard for the teachers to provide stretching and challenging within an inflexible system.

My boys are - fortunately in this case - summer born, and emotionally immature, so for them accelleration would never be appropriate. But I do sometimes wonder how they would have coped in Reception and yr1 if they'd been 10 months older. It was difficult enough as it was.

Sorry I have wittered on for a long time. I didn't know you were thinking about moving ds? I thought things were going OK for him. Feel free to email me to fill me in if you'd prefer.

Agree with roisin that acceleration by a year may not solve anything for a v. high-achieving child -- would have been a waste of time academically for my dd1, with the added disadvantage of her feeling 'different'. The private sector may be more flexible than state schools about 'out of year' children, but it would be worth checking whether it's likely to cause problems later, since out of year kids may mess up a school's GCSE statistics.

How do you think your dd will feel about the fact that she'd be having the 'wrong' birthday compared with the rest of her year group? ie. being 5 when everyone else is having their 6th birthdays. Or having all her baby teeth when everyone else is comparing notes on the tooth fairy? It sounds silly, but some kids could get very worked up about these things. Thing is, you never know whether she'll blame you more for letting her be bored, or making her be the odd one out.

FWIW I have (reluctantly) come to the conclusion that there are worse things than being bored in school, as long as the child feels supported at home and has lots of other input. My dd1 could easily have turned into quite an odd little bunny, but is now a confident and relaxed, starting to be teenagery 10yo. Her ed psych's report commented on how mature, friendly and at ease she was, which tbh pleased me more than all the silly numbers.

But it is a tough call, and I guess the solution will vary according to the child.

roisin, I love the image of the gruesome carpet time! - and you are right. She is also that bouncy child who wants to answer every question - so I can just imagine how continually she would be being told no, this isn't for you, we need to let the other children have a go - pretty demoralising, in the end.

This really is food for thought, now.

frogs, cross-posted. Your questions about whether she'd feel the odd one out are exactly why I thought your idea of doing this term in reception as a trial was so good. I just don't know - to date she's been one of those cheery children who's just at ease in the world, but maybe that's the result of always having been one of the oldest, and so never having been out of her depth?

Binkie, I would ask how flexible the school can be. DS1 is in Y1, he's a January birthday. He mixes with a variety of year groups depending on what he is doing, most of the time he is with his own class, which is great because he is quite immature socially.

He does his literacy with Y2,and is on the 'top' table in the Y2 group, but although the reading work is fine, he struggles physically with the writing, but they allow him quite a lot of leeway.

He attends a reading group with Y3 and Y4 children which he really enjoys.

For maths he usually does work which is fairly open ended and extends the topic that everyone else is working on.

When he was in reception his teacher had someone to help her plan for him and he was taken out every week to do stuff, both to help his social skills and co-ordination, and to challenge him academically.

He goes to two clubs, Board Games and Chess, where he mixes with children from reception to Year 6, and drama which is year 1 and 2. I think the clubs are really helping him.

The school are already talking about approaching local secondary schools for help when he gets to KS2.

Question for everyone on this thread. From September I will be Gifted and Talented Co-ordinator at the school where I teach. What would you like to be offered to you and children if the school could offer you anything you wanted?!!!

Hee hee - what a question Doddle! I will come back to you on that, but am short of time now.

Frogs - great to hear you sounding so positive about dd

Tanzie I am so sorry to hijack your thread! I wish I had some answers for you but have no experience yet.

Blimey I have no idea if the school has this transition thing. I haven't even started looking at schools properly, I have her down for one little local private one (Unicorn in Kew) plus was going to send her for the test things at Putney High junior school, but I was kind of hoping that she would go to the local primary as they are all excellent around here. If they are going to be looking at the letter A and the number 1, tbh I think she would be bored NOW, let alone aged 5! We are not teaching her to read/write but she is SO nosey, everywhere we go she shouts "Look mummy, an S" etc and is forever asking what letters are what, same with numbers. Then she draws them herself!

So should I be talking to the local primaries now do you think? She is in nursery, only just started (we had a nanny before) and she seems to be really enjoying it, comes home with a new song every day etc! Should I mention it to them? I just have this overwhelming fear of seeming like a pushy parent, I am not, I really don't want her to be pushed AT ALL! But on the other hand I don't want her to go through what I went through, always in trouble at school for being naughty when in fact I was just bored - it set a pattern for my whole school life, I didn't achieve anywhere near my potential academically (though acutally it hasn't mattered a scrap and I have a much better job than a lot of my v. swotty peers ) I can remember feeling victimised and not being able to understand why I couldn't answer the questions if no-one else knew the answer. They even took me out of the spelling bee sessions as I always got 100% and that was considered unseemly

She is a very bouncy and responsive girl, I don't want that crushed out of her. What is this G&T co-ordinator (do they give you a G&T?!). I wouldn't say she is scarily abnormally bright in a weird way IYKWIM, she just absorbs stuff incredibly fast.

Moggymummy yes she did! It was so funny - they asked dd to pass the green cup and she said "no, the tea's a bit hot at the moment, you can have it when it's cooled down" and then asked the HV if she wanted sugar! Then she picked up the book with the animals in it (wrapped around letters) and read out most of the bloody letters instead of the animals. AARRRGGGGHHHHHHHH

Wow! CD your DD sounds veeery bright indeed. What a bright little spark. She sounds delightful!

I can't really relate to that at all as DS is more the "engineer" type IYKWIM . Actually I'm not even sure he could be classified as advanced. But it was nice to hear someone say that DS was clever - makes you feel like you are doing something right

CD - ds1 is breathing down my neck for the PC, so haven't got long!

I can whole-heartedly recommend this book ... Personally I don't like the title, but it is a fabulous book - focusing as it does on U8s, including pre-schoolers.

I will come back to this later.