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Original poster

Student teacher insisting ds does his homework at lunchtime.

74 replies

cornsilk · 21/05/2008 19:38

My ds is very disorganised about his homework and often comes home without worksheets etc. School realise this, were advised by ed psych to use organisational cards 2 years ago, which they didn't do. Anyway he has a student teacher at the moment. She has said he has to stay in tomorrow lunchtime to do a maths worksheet. I know for a fact he didn't bring it home as I always check his bag, but she is insisting he had it.
So, can she insist he uses his lunchhour for homework?
Isn't it her responsibility to ensure he has his homework sheet etc if she is enforcing it?
He is 10 by the way.

OP posts:
Original poster
cornsilk · 21/05/2008 20:08

Yes, Humphrey good point. Sanctioning a child for being poorly organised when poor organisation is part of their recognised difficulties is discrimination.

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pointydog · 21/05/2008 20:10

I don't see how your beef can be with the student teacher, rather than the school's permanent staff. Unless there's a lot more you;re not saying.

Original poster
cornsilk · 21/05/2008 20:13

No nothing more than that to say. My beef is that she is giving him a lunchtime detention, for being poorly organised, when poor organisational skills are part of his difficulties. Why didn't she just send the sheet home with him tonight?

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Sanctuary · 21/05/2008 20:14

Its the student teacher that has dished out the Lunch time detention .
She most know whats going on in her class !!

CORNSILK
If you drop of Your Ds in the morning could you not nip in and have a word with her?

Vivace · 21/05/2008 20:16

I would personally talk to the head if no joy with the student teacher. Think this is an unacceptable punishment for a child with special needs who didn't have the sheet so couldn't have worked on it.
If he was blind he wouldn't be punished for bumping into things, would he?

Hulababy · 21/05/2008 20:16

Dn't blame the student teacher. They are just doing their job, following the "right" way of doing things.

I speak from experience when I see that most student teachers will not have been old about individual children's needs and arrangements in place for specific children.

A student teacher is not really supposed to be left alone with a class and should be supervised at all times. therefore the normal classteacher or someone in a similar position should be with this teacher, observing and monitoring all they do. Therefpre, someone at the school must have accepted that this was an okay thing for the student teacher to do. If they deny this s the case them question whya student teacher is in the classroom alone long enough to do this.

It sounds like it is the school who is at fault here, and his normal class teacher.

Sanctuary · 21/05/2008 20:19

How long has the student teacher been in his class ?

Original poster
cornsilk · 21/05/2008 20:27

She's been there for the half term. Don't know what year she's in. I think she is left alone with the class from what ds says but couldn't guarantee it. He likes her, he has no problem with her at all. She has been nice to him I think up till this. Sounds like she's doing an ok job, but this has annoyed me. Are they really not meant to be left alone? Didn't know that. (I was!)

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pointydog · 21/05/2008 20:28

They can be left alone. Up here anyway

Hulababy · 21/05/2008 20:28

When I was last in teaching - so 2 years or so ago - they weren't no. Not even in final year. I know this is often something that is overlooked though.

I still think this is something you should take up with the normal class teacher rather than the student teacher.

Original poster
cornsilk · 21/05/2008 20:30

Yes I wouldn't speak to her about it. Was going to ring the head or send in a letter to his classteacher.

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kritur · 21/05/2008 21:05

I feel quite sorry for the student teacher here. She is just following up a student who didn't do homework using a common sanction. I expect she is treating your son as she treats everyone else in the class. If your sons regular class teacher had a problem with it then I am sure s/he would have intervened. He is at the age where he should be working hard to overcome his difficulties in preparation for secondary school. As a secondary school teacher I regularly put students in detention for not doing homework, they will try everything for an excuse including I lost the sheet. They know my rule is that if they lose the sheet they need to get one from me or a friend before the hand in date or they get a DT. This rule applies for those with SN as well (although I have been known to staple homework sheets into their homework diaries so they can't claim they lost them). I suggest you speak to the regular class teacher as s/he has the ultimate responsibility for this. Please remember, the student teacher is exactly that, a student and therefore still learning (like your son). Part of this learning process is making mistakes (although I personally think she is right with this) and dealing with the fallout. Don't be too harsh on her.

BoneyBackJefferson · 21/05/2008 21:33

and parents wonder why there is no discipline in schools

Original poster
cornsilk · 21/05/2008 21:33

kritur - It's not a common sanction though. I have never known this sanction used before in this school.
Also, sanctioning a child with SEN for poor organisation is wrong IMO if poor organisation is one of their recognised difficulties. The teacher needs to cater for this in their everyday organisation and classroom management.
Your rule might be if you loose the sheet they get detention but it is certainly not the rule in this school. If you staple worksheets into the diaries of SEN chn then you are differentiating in your classroom management - fair enough. In this case that differentiation hasn't occured.

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fizzbuzz · 21/05/2008 21:34

They can be left alone as long as you are nearby and let them know where you are. I am a teacher, and when the current student is covering my lessons I sit in an office just across the corridot. His lecturers are fully aware of this and it is OK, it is often done like this.

A student teacher is trying to do everything right, and trying to be tough which is entirly normal and considered the best way in teaching practice.

I teach secondary, and know which pupils need help with making sure hwk is in planner. However if I was teaching this pupil, I would have given him another sheet, and told him to bring it next day.

Organisation is a HUGE issue for some kids, they lose or forget everything. Write a letter saying, if this happens again can he just have another sheet. If I kept in every kid with orgainsation problems I'd never get any lunch!!

Original poster
cornsilk · 21/05/2008 21:38

Thanks fizzbuzz - I don't understand why another sheet wasn't sent home tonight. I pick him up so it could easily have been handed over to me. I

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Original poster
cornsilk · 21/05/2008 21:40

Boneyback - what does that mean then?

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BoneyBackJefferson · 21/05/2008 21:52

I teach several pupils with organisational issues, most of their parents won't let them do an after school detention (or in some cases any detentions at all) as its not their pfb s fault. excuses so far have been that they didn't have the homework sheet, pages have been ripped from their homework diaries (after I have argued with the pupil so that I can write the homework in) by "friends" and there have been many others.

By not backing the teacher/school you undermine the position of both the school and the teacher, in most cases this will lead to badly behaved pupils who believe that the rules don't apply to them.

By all means have a word with the head or teacher but let the consequence stand, otherwise how will the children learn that there are consequences to their actions?

slayerette · 21/05/2008 21:58

I am a secondary teacher and have some students with poor organisation (although they are not SEN - just disorganised). I keep them in at lunchtime not as a punishment but to ensure work that does not seem to be completed anywhere else can be completed under my supervision and guidance. Might this be what this student teacher is doing? She probably thinks she is acting appropriately to ensure your ds doesn't fall behind. Did you tell her he didn't have the sheet?

While I understand that organisation is difficult for your ds, it is worth thinking about how you and he will tackle secondary school with the increased number of subject teachers and much greater homework burden. Because ime, by yr 7 teachers do get stressed about homework not done, so you will need some strategies in place!

cat64 · 21/05/2008 21:59

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

AbbeyA · 21/05/2008 22:05

A very sensible post cat64.

TheFallenMadonna · 21/05/2008 22:07

cat64 - you have it spot on.

Heated · 21/05/2008 22:12

Cornsilk, do you think ds should be learning the consequences of not being organised - I don't mean as punishment but as a life lesson? I can envisage him having a tough time at secondary if he doesn't have some responsibility over this - rather than it always falling on yours and the teacher's shoulders.

Original poster
cornsilk · 21/05/2008 22:23

Cat 64 - wise words!
Heated - yes I agree he needs to learn the consequences of not being organised. My problem with this sanction is that it is out of step with how the class teacher usually handles him. It will also mess up his routine which is a big issue for him. For instance, he wouldn't look at me tonight 'cos I had me hair done and it was 'different.' Missing his lunchtime play out of the blue will totally throw him.

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fizzbuzz · 21/05/2008 22:24

I agree with cornsilk...sanctioning a child with poor organisational difficultis is wrong.

I am not talking about deliberate skivers/can't be bothereds, I am talking about pupils with recognised organsitional difficulties, which is in effect a disabiity. I would alwys give them another chance. Certainly at that age of your ds. Year8 and above are a bit more cunning, and I am inclined to treat them with suspicion.

My ds has learning difficulties (dyslexic, slow writing speeds) He was kept in at lunchtime repeatedly to finsish his work, despite the fact his teacher knew of his problems. The SENCO at the school where I teach thought it was dreadful, and she would think the same about this.

IT is NOT about undermining the school, it is about recognising disabilities/problems, and IMO the school is not responding properly by instigating this punishment. There will be things like hwk clubs, and people to help your ds at secondary school. He's only 10 after all....but she is only a student teacher who is trying very hard on her placement. I would let it go, but ask for the future. I find a lot of young pupils with these problems are usually very keen to sort it, and go out of their way to track down homework sheets etc

As I said they get a lot more wiley a bit older than this, and don't get very far...but I suspect the recommendation from our SENCO would to be not to instigate this punishment on a child with these problems