More male teachers - doesn't that mean fewer females?

[mids2019]

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2025/apr/03/bridget-phillipson-education-secretary-more-male-teachers-adolescence

I don't think this was a considered statement as in world where women have had to fight hard for representation in professions it is is grange for a cabinet Secretary to advocate for more men in a professiion. We certainly wouldn't see the health Secretary advocate for male doctors in a profession historically dominated by men at least until the last few decades.

I don't think teachers are there primarily to be role models but educators. The sex of the teacher should make no difference only their overall ability to the job. To somehow suggest a male has more authority or respect from male pupils surely is just veiled sexism?

I don't personally agree......

Having a female boss at work (not a direct line manager, but a few tiers up) was an absolute game changer for me in terms of having a role model. It made me realise how important representation is.

It’s same for boys at school. It’s important they don’t see dealing with children as women’s work, and that the “those who can’t, teach” (which is obviously wrong) adage applies to women and men get the “proper” jobs.

We should be striving for equal representation of men and women in all roles, and where the balance is out either way then steps should be taken to correct it.

And boys are more in need than ever of positive male role models. There are so many bad role models for them out there, and some may not have dads or male relatives they see regularly to counter this. They may not even have extra curricular activities to go to. Teachers are the second most prevalent people in their life and there should be representation of men and women for them to regularly see.

I do think that more men may be an advantage at primary level for gender balance is a very female dominated profession but I think the role model aspect is maybe down played in that setting.

How many women actually want to traditionally male roles? how many female refuse or sewerage workers are there?

I just feel that teaching is more than just dealing with children but involves the important skill of imparting knowledge which can be done as equally well by both sexes. It seems quite a few posts refer to 'better' jobs than teaching and we should be concentrating on female representation in other professions rather than dwelling on teaching as if teaching was somehow lesser in terms of status.

I think it's a sad state of affairs of we view teaching as women's work.

Most teachers earn between 30-40k as the experienced ones are leaving the profession (teacher retention etc) 35k these days is not much to be honest in many parts of the country when you have a mortgage and children to feed, rising council, electricity bill etc . So no, teaching is not that well paid.

I think it is a valid point that we do need a slight over representation of women in professional roles as they do not possibly enjoy the access relatively high wage skilled work men enjoy e.g. plumbing, engineering, automechanic, builder etc.

Is it the argument that to get more make teachers you have to increase salary because they deserve more or is this in itself an indictment of teaching profession salary and status?

It's not remotely comparable to being a doctor. Teachers matter enormously to kids, and they can make a huge difference. The right teacher can be the difference between a child showing up at school or being a school refuser. They can be a protective factor in an otherwise chaotic or difficult childhood. Boys need role models who look like them, and like the types of fathers they should have had - it's not veiled sexism to recognise this. It's also not sexism to put kids' needs first in a school. Ultimately, if boys grow up with healthier attitudes that will benefit women and society.

Teaching is one of the very few professions dominated by women (caring profession). It is therefore underpaid. We don't need to worry about men taking our jobs - there are plenty of jobs for all. We need to worry about decent pay for the entire profession, male and female.

but teachers are role models like it or not, as PP said, in primary school they spend a massive amount of awake time in the classroom with this person. my kids would often come home telling me teacher said this or that ..
having a footballer role model isn't great, most kids won't be footballers and most footballers are poor role models. on the other hand seeing men be patient, kind, funny, instructional, firm etc is something we can hope our DS aspire to. if you're a single mum with limited contact with ex, then maybe a primary school teacher could be the main way your DS has the opportunity to see male role models at close quarters

I wish the number of headteachers and senior management reflected the number of women in the profession but unfortunately the majority are male.

The most popular teachers amongst the parents are always men regardless of any teaching ability. The ones in their 30s are especially sought out by the school mums, which I suppose is understandable.

I think we should aspire to more or less equal proportions of men and women in any profession that involves teaching or caring. Because often people like to be taught or cared for by their own sex. But I think we should also consider very carefully why imbalances exist and not make assumptions.

Some larger schools do have non-teaching pastoral roles. I don't have any first hand experience of that.

I always say that I don't really enjoy the pastoral side of teaching. I'm a subject specialist through and through. Maths is straightforward, and fun. Human emotions, behaviours and expectations are messy, and not often "solvable". But in my experience you can't do the fun maths bit effectively without confronting the messy human bit.

And because I'm in a private school, we have a sport and extracurricular expectation (and a timetable allowance for this) and some boarding duties. I sometimes think this is ridiculous, and that I should be spending those hours teaching maths (because I'm really good at maths, and I'm rubbish at badminton!) but actually, this whole-school immersion does make us more effective teachers in the classroom.

At the end of the day, I'm teaching kids, not teaching maths.

Only 15% of teachers in primary school are male. I guess there must be whole schools without a male teacher.

"We need dads to step up so British boys can have role models, says Minister".
Fixed it.
Well, sort of. We need more engaged, committed, responsive, warm men in more places to reach more boys.

This is nothing new.

Men are underrepresented in the teaching profession but often over represented in leadership positions.

We do need more male teachers (and more teachers in general) and we need to support female teachers into leadership roles.

It’s an otiose argument to compare doctors and teachers and it looking at only from an ‘employment rights’ viewpoint rather than an educational one.
Unfortunately many boys have no positive male role models (a successive stream of ‘stepfathers’ is hugely counterproductive ) and this has caused huge problems and the really dangerous emergence of the incel/Andrew Tate plague.
When families split on a whim, financed by ‘benefits’ it is the boys who suffer. That won’t change now - so at least offer them some positive male role models to help them channel their masculinity in a healthy way.

podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-diary-of-a-ceo-with-steven-bartlett/id1291423644?i=1000701533754

We employed a man teacher for our department to "balance it out". He was awful, lazy and entitled.

I used to work in a challenging school with lots of deprivation. The children came from families where there was a lot of misogyny and disrespect for women. I was lucky to have lots of male teachers in my department who would model to these young men how to be respectful to women and it was invaluable. I don't think I could've stayed there for so long otherwise as the school behaviour system was woefully inadequate.

I think it's a sad state of affairs of we view teaching as women's work.

This is one of the reasons we need more men in the profession so it's NOT viewed solely as women's work.

I totally agree.

And that can depend a great deal on the area a school is in. I live on a large council estate with a few schools. Lot of children are from single parent households and of course that usually mean a female carer.

Boys need to see men working and being role models otherwise where do they get that information?

Obv we need good teachers but there’s specific issues with boys today lacking appropriate role models and turning to the internet for inspiration, having good male teachers who can address some of these issues whilst offering a positive image of what it’s like to be a good man in the 21st century cannot be understated. Nobody says we should get rid of female teachers, just that there should be more of a balance for pastoral reasons

That’s not the point. It’s about equality of opportunity so if a female does want to work in refuse they can.

we want more women in stem roles. That’s kicking men out of roles. That’s life if we want equality in roles

It just seems another example of the teaching profession having to take on responsibility of greater failures in society to an extent other professions do not. We need more STEM female teachers as well as computing science, huge economic drivers for the future and it would be a shame if we dissuade bright intelligent women taking on these roles because we become too focused on getting more men in as role models. To me though it is against the grain teaching primarily is about the professionalism of teaching and the partial element though important isn't the main aspect of the tole. To give a parallel consultant doctors work in a caring role but most of their job they would describe as highly skilled responsible decision making rather than softer skills. In a sense rightly or wrongly professionalism does get associated.with these qualities.

It is widely recognised that it’s important to have diverse teams. I work in an extremely male dominated industry and we have been in a recruitment drive over the past 10yrs to encourage more women (through school engagement, target women returning to work etc). It was so important to me to have female role models, especially in positions of authority. Getting rid of the notion that it’s a ‘man’s job’.

It’s the same with teaching, it’s important to have a diverse workforce, showing children that it’s not a ‘women’s job’.

Your argument that it reduces female teachers is one that I’ve sadly heard on my industry (albeit the other war around), and is at best ignorant, and at worst sexist.

Well men have got to get trained as teachers then! Thats the difficult hurdle to get over. There are many many primary schools with no male teachers. When I was working at a LA, there was a tendency to appoint male head teachers. Some of them were poor appointments. These days nearly every primary head is a woman. Men are not teaching in primary schools in any number. I think BP is right to highlight this.