One child is capable of 11+ and the other isn’t

[anonymous06]

Hi,

I have a little dilemma though I knew to expect this from the start.

I thought I’d try my two kids for the 11+. They had their first lesson with a tutor and I was told one of my children doesn’t have the chance of passing. She’s had a bit of a troubled year 3 and she’s now year 5 and I’m not confident about her year 5 teacher. A few months ago we decided for her to not do the 11+ and she’ll thrive better in a comprehensive. Her dad thought it’s best to give her the opportunity but after her first tuition lesson, I was told she will find it challenging.

The dilemma is what do I do with my year 4 child who has had great feedback and I was told he has a chance of succeeding in the 11+.

I feel really sad for my daughter and had a positive chat with her. I even reminded her how happy she was when I told her previously she won’t be doing the 11+. She did get upset but was fine after a little while.

Now that I know which route to take, I’m worried about the journey to school if my son passes the 11+. We are 6 miles away from the Trafford schools.

My only other thought process is to sack the 11+ for both, and focus on them getting good SATs which can help them in secondary. The tutor advised to focus on SATs tuition with my first child, let the second child practise at home and revisit where he is around Easter. I agreed with this as I feel it makes the most sense.

Any thoughts?

Thanks!

If you are happy with a local school for both then leave the choice up to your child. I made the choice for ds1 as I knew he needed a different type of school as he was very shy and would have disappeared at a large comp. even though he wanted to go there with his primary school friends. He was also very bright but bright kids do well academically anywhere. DS2 I let choose as he would have coped fine with a large school but he chose to follow his brother. Making them get up early and travel for 7 years is a lot to ask so it has to carry major benefits over the local choice and it helps if it’s where they want to go. It took years before ds1 agreed I’d made the right choice but he still moaned how much shorter the school day would have been at the local school.

If DC1 passed, and DC2 didn't, you wouldn't remove DC1.

So its not fair to deny DC2 the opportunity just because their elder sibling isn't suitable.

The kind of feedback that tutor gave you'd expect after 6 months of working with the child - not one hour!

I strongly disagree. After an hour an experienced tutor is perfectly capable of judging if a child is definitely not going to pass a grammar school entrance exam.

If you are near MGS then isn't it a fairly direct route to Stretford Grammar?

This!

I love in an 11+ area and while I’ve met many families who’ve made your choice - dc1 failed/didn’t take it as wouldn’t pass, so didn’t put dc2 in for the exam, I probably know as many families where it was clear dc2 wouldn’t pass yet they put dc1 in grammar.

(and even those not doing the 11+, lots of time and effort looking at the various school options for dc1 and finding the right fit for their interests, dc2 just goes to the same one even if somewhere else would be a better fit. )

Even if your children 'pass' the 11 plus I thought that by living 6 miles away you will not get offered a place. Unless you are catholic and applying to the catholic grammars. Am I wrong about this?
I have much younger children and also live in Manchester and I have assumed that there is no point applying as we live too far away to be offered a place.

We always knew our two would go to different schools. Grammar school was the obvious destination for DS but with DD we knew we had to pick the best available secondary school as she would never have passed the 11 plus even if she studied for a thousand years.

Even if DD had taken and passed the test they would still have been at separate schools as the grammars here are all single sex with the boys school and girls school being miles apart from each other.

By the time they are secondary age two different schools will be fine. Plenty of people have boys in single sex and girls in single sex, because those are the best schools for those children regardless of how close the bond between siblings

I have three and I started off believing the boys alone should go to the same school, DD wanted another school anyway
Ended up with three kids at three different secondaries. Each school was right for that child.
Secondary is very very different from primary. Siblings often ignore each other on secondary territory anyway. They are friends with their peer group only.

I think what is fair is for both to have equal investment in tutoring. So your DD gets tutoring to fill in gaps in her Maths (not for SATs, but to build a firm foundation and increase her confidence) and your DS has 11+- targeted tutoring if that’s what is best fir him.

This may mean 2 different tutors - 11+ tutors are often ‘1 trick ponies’ and may not have the skills needed to coach a child with difficulties in a school curriculum area.

You could enter your DD for the 11+ exam - as you will enter your DS - and see what happens, and equally should seize every opportunity to visit any and all schools they could attend to see which you and they prefer.

That way, they both have the same investment in financial term, the same opportunity- but a way forward that matches their specific aptitudes and needs.

Your dc are individuals. Even if they are friends they are two separate humans with two separate sets of needs. I don’t get why dd can’t go to a school that meets her needs and ds can’t go to a different school that’s right for him.

I firmly believe in choosing the school that fits the individual child and not sending siblings as a job lot to the same school just because

I absolutely agree that the OP’s DD would benefit hugely from one to one tuition so that she catches up on things she may have missed, gains confidence in maths and has a firm grasp of the basics. That doesn’t mean tutoring for SATs or teaching to a test. It’s about broad learning that will set her up well for senior school. It might be, as cantkeepawayforever said, that she needs a different kind of tutor.

My sister went to a grammar school- I didn't. Never thought anything odd about it. She was older (3 years) so we went to different schools. 🤷‍♀️ I definitely got the better deal, 10 minute walk, she had a hour bus trip each way.

Why do parents foresee problems where there aren't any? Or try to make problems? And whatever happened to 'you're going to X school- sibling to Y.'

Abosulte rubbish. The child is nearly 18mths away from the exam - if she's just gone into year 5 - the exam happens January year 6 - so January 2026.

They may be able to assess that the child wouldn't pass now but they have enough time to teach and coach between now and then.

It depends on the area. Many 11+ exams are in the first few weeks of Y6. I think Trafford’s are usually in mid-September?

It’s September for the grammar entrance exam where I live.

I went to grammar and my sister didn't. It was good for us to be able to develop our own identity- we are very different but close in age and look very alike. Both schools were the best fit for each of us at the time.

We actually went to the same 6th form and it was really annoying to be compared to each other again!

Find the best fit for each child, as long as the school commute stays doable.

I have 2 DS. They are both bright but in different ways. Round here the 11+ test needs kids to be really quick but doesn't really assess overall suitability for grammar education. You can train a child to pass with enough tutoring but those kids then struggle.
We present 11+ as increasing school choice options and assessing whether the teaching style would suit them but stress that it's the same exams for all schools.
DS1 was late reader and didn't pass. He is however a deep thinker and enjoys studying so I think he will do well.
DS2 is super sharp and I'm sure will ace the 11+. He will get the same chance as his brother and we will look at the best school to suit his personality which maybe may not be grammar.
They will probably end up in different schools even if we didn't do 11+ as they have different strengths and interests.

My older son went to a super-selective and is now at university. He passed the 11+ easily. But the younger one has dyslexia and goes to a local comprehensive. We did give the youngest a chance to try if he wanted - but warned him it would be hard work, especially as he struggles with English. He agreed there wasn't much point doing it.

Due to changing catchment my younger son ended up in the good local comprehensive rather than the outstanding one. Looking at what my older son's peers achieved compared to him, I don't think that the school would have made that much difference to his outcome. The bright kids in his primary school who went to comprehensive did approximately the same as him But I think it would have made a difference for the younger one to go the better comprehensive school.

But each is happy with their path as far as I can tell.

Regardless of how well they get on, how exactly are you intending to frame child who is able for the exam we made a decision to your education detriment? Because children talk, they know their placing and are likely to have a decent idea of their capacity to pass the exam.

It's just like if one was good at ballet and the other better at tap dancing.

No problem with choosing different school options for your children but if you are 6 miles from a Trafford grammar and out of catchment, you have limited options for getting in. The prep is enough work without having to try to aim for a top 20 score or similar!

I have twins and one did the exam and the other didn't. I don't regret it at all but also the one who didn't never really wanted to anyway. Her sister is just a lot more academic. They both go to different schools now which suit them both immensely. One of them needed a grammar school while the other needed a comprehensive to thrive and it would have been silly to deprive either one. I also have a son 3 years younger who is at the boys grammar so it can be tricky having 3 secondary aged children in 3 different schools!

Your son should not be deprived of the opportunity to try for Grammar just because his older sibling does not have the aptitude. I am not impressed by the tutor suggesting you tutor daughter for SATS. That just smells of wanting to keep a client. I see in an update that it is maths that is the main concern for your daughter. I'd suggest getting a specialist maths tutor for a specific period to give your daughter a boost in that subject. Some children really do not suit grammar school and I fear that keeping both children with the same tutor will mean that in your daughter's head that if she just tries harder she might make the grade. Actually the tutor making clear the situation at the start is actually the right thing to do.

As well as the children get on now, you have to accept they are two individuals and your role as parent is to make the right decisions based on their own individual best interests.

I gave my two the choice of sitting the 11+. We were fairly sure the older would pass but not as sure with younger. Younger very sensibly said they've got no chance at all if they don't actually sit it. They didn't pass by much and again we had a chat about whether grammar was the best option as they would be surrounded with kids who got higher passes. As parents we have given them the same opportunity and support.

Don't tutor for the SATs. As pp have said that's about the school.