Tricky A-level decisions

[PetalsAndPears]

My daughter did great in her GCSEs and is lucky she can take any A-levels she chooses at this point.

For a long time she’s wanted to be a doctor and has secured great work experience already, regularly volunteering at a centre for kids with learning difficulties.

Since getting her results, though, she’s suddenly questioning whether she does want to do medicine. Though it could just be a phase, she doesn’t know.

Her dilemma is she needs biology and chemistry for medicine. She got 9s in both subjects. But she loves history and English more than chemistry, and would do very well in those subjects too. She’s worried though that if she chooses those, she might regret closing off medicine - something she’s been passionate about for a long time - but is having a bit of a wobble about.

For now she’s doing 4 A-levels with the idea of dropping one very soon. But she’s got herself in such a state worrying that she has to decide now, at 16, about dropping chemistry / or history or English - and I’m not sure how best to advise her.

my daughter

“which do you enjoy more?”

Has she got an idea of whether she’ll want to go to university if she doesn’t do medicine? And if so what sort of degree she might want to do?
If she does Chem/bio/English or history she can still do a an English or history degree. If she drops a science then medicine is definitely over for now. Keeping both the sciences means more choices. However, I would be relieved if any of my children changed their mind about medicine and would be doing whatever I could to engineer a way to make that decision permanent!! So would be encouraging history and English. But you sound a better parent than me so you probably won’t do that

I don't think 4 A-levels is unusual for those wanting to go into medicine, why not just do all 4. If she decides to drop one that's ok and if she doesn't then she can just do all 4.

Is there a careers advisor at school that could help? Can she speak to any doctors or do a day shadowing to get the feel more about it? Has she read This is going to hurt? What are her motivations for doing medicine and does she have othr ideas of what else she would like to do if no that? In any case I would tell her not to worry, making the wrong choice of A Levels is not that the end of the world, even if it takes her an extra year or more to get there.

Chemistry and biology leave the door open for loads of great choices other than medicine (eg biochemistry, neuroscience, pharmacy etc). Personally I would encourage her to choose those two plus her favourite out of history or English. However I would also make it clear that it's her choice and I will support her in whatever she decides.

Yes, I have told her not to worry and that whatever she chooses, she can make it work. But it feels like a huge decision for her, she really does love history and English and is finding the thought of dropping one agonising! At the same time, she’s so worried she’ll have regrets about medicine later on.

She knows medicine is a tough slog and we’ve looked at what it involves. She understands the pitfalls - as much as you can without actually doing it! - but she’s shown a very strong interest since she was a child.

Doing 4 A-levels is not what she wants to do, given she’ll need exceptional grades - for medicine at any rate. I agree that the risk doesn’t make sense.

I'd see if she can find a day shadowing a doctor or working in a hospital setting or similar- she probably needs to see the reality of what medicine is really like?

I'd also make the point that if she drops chemistry, she is shutting off a lot of science based options which like two science for uni- if she has been interested in medicine, she might still enjoy that sort of career?

Would something like psychology be possible- biology and psychology would still leave the door open for medicine at a small number of unis, and might be more appealing than chemistry?

She’s interested in psychology and that is an option.
What is your reason for being anti-medicine, personal experience? I guess we all know that the NHS is on its knees…

She’s at risk of getting very very stressed and anxious as A level go on

at this stage Op, your role should just be all about what she enjoys most and to relax

If she wants to do Medicine then she will definitely need Chemistry and most universities require an A (although a small number might accept B).
Medicine is also extremely competitive to get into and then very hard work so she really needs to be sure it's what she wants to do.
I think if she's wavering then maybe its not for her, but she needs to make a decision either way herself.
As a previous poster mentioned, there are a lot of other related fields that aren't medicine that might interest her, or she may decide something completely different.
Maybe she should continue with the 4 for now provided she can cope with the workload and give herself some time to think about it. Also talk to the Careers people at her college.
The junior doctor in my family did 4 a levels (college would have liked them to drop one), got a 'B' in Chemistry but got a place.

I'd recommend keeping the sciences and enjoying history and literature as a hobby. Doing science a level doesn't mean you have to do medicine. Lots of other options like psychology and biochemistry are interesting too. But if you drop, science it is very hard to get back to it later

It’s just a horrible job. The patients might be nice some of the time but that’s about the only but that’s bearable. I don’t know a single doctor that seems happy. The training is so hard, not necessarily hard academically or practically but just mentally, you’re basically a nuisance for 5 years and everyone hates you being there but if you’re not there then you get immediately bollocked. Hustling to get and find opportunities for skills, pushing yourself forward all the time every single shift in the face of people wanting you to fuck off ideally.
Then you qualify and it’s so cutthroat and heartbreaking, constantly moving, rotating into new specialities and being shit and learning again, constantly having ten things on your to do list, literally being asked to do something whilst you are physically doing something else, just hassle and stress all day. Constantly on the edge of burnout. Make a mistake and someone could be really hurt or die and living with that. Long shit shifts. Absolutely horrible money. I know consultant can earn more a bit later in their career but these people are absolutely amazing intellectually and in capability and could be earning four times as much doing something else for far less stress. Fuck knows how women are supposed to have babies when they are medics.

I’ve been a hospital nurse for 17 years so that’s the perspective I’m looking at it from.

Im all for studying what you enjoy, but unfortunately medicine is pretty prescriptive for Alevels so you have to suck it up!

I think before she drops chemistry she should have a really good think about what she likes about the idea of medicine, and whether that could be transferred to another career that involves history or English.

Does she enjoy the problem solving? If it's because she likes the idea of helping people there are other careers that she would probably do more 'caring' in. Medicine does look attractive as it's all laid out as a career, medics are respected and it gives you opportunities to work anywhere in the world, but as pp said there are definitely drawbacks!

I would definitely recommend shadowing and talking to a lot of doctors.Put my dd right off!

@PetalsAndPears

Don't know if it helps but my DD absolutely loved English up to gcse. Wanted to do degree etc etc.

A level just isn't doing it for her - it's now her least favourite of her 3 subjects.

1. It limits your choice for medical school, but there are some universities that don't require you to have Chemistry A level. I would check this with the universities concerned before making a decision though.
2. If your daughter changes her mind later it's quite hard to take A level Chemistry outside school due to the practical work involved. It would be easier to take English or History as a private candidate at a later date.
3. What didn't she like about Chemistry at GCSE ? There are some parts that are different at A level.

Apologies if these points seem contradictory. There are points for and against for each scenario.

Thanks for the helpful advice everyone.

@catndogslife She liked chemistry well enough, it’s just that she really loves English and history!
In an ideal world, I’d advise her to do what she loves but people are right that science leaves more options open.
Things were more clear-cut for me because my talents clearly lay in the humanities as opposed to science. I do feel the English system is hard for kids who are forced to make decisions like this at just 16.

I'd do the sciences. It's much easier to keep reading history and English - books clubs, local history groups, online groups. (There's always history of medicine...)

I'm with your daughter, though. We specialise way too early in English education. I was an all-rounder and still resent having had to give up most subjects for A-level. However, I've also been doing evening classes/online classes/OU modules for most of my adult life when I'venot been in formal education. You don't have to stop with school. (You do have to be good st time management.)

Is there anywhere near you that does the IB (international baccalaureate)? There a state school and a private school near here that do it, and it allows (insists on even) six subjects. A friend's kid just got into med school with it.

Only private schools, which we can’t afford … and she wants to be with her friends at her current school. But I do think it’s a better system.

I’d look up university courses that aren’t medicine to see what combinations are accepted. I’d have thought by not doing maths she’s maybe excluded some things like engineering or straight science courses already.

Choice then really is whether she will want medicine or an associated healthcare role or if she thinks her passion is really the arts and likely to do an English or history degree. if the latter, I’d stick with biology and drop chemistry. I did 3 arts subjects plus chemistry and found the combination hard as there were exam clashes but also others doing straight sciences or maths had some complementary content in the courses. I also found just having chemistry plus the 3 arts subject (two were history and English lit) didn’t open any other university routes really- maths would have probably been a better 4th subject there.

If she can manage 4 for a little while longer she can at least keep her options open for a little longer.

drop English and read books! Stick with history.

If she still has any interest in medicine (even if having a wobble) it makes sense to do the two sciences and pick either history/English as the third one. She can read literature/about history as a hobby.

If further down the line she decided a degree in anything medical/scientific isn't what she wants, she still has good A levels to move forward. I know people who've done science A levels/degree then gone into law/finance careers. You can't do it the other way round though!

Weirdly I did all 4 of these A levels but dropped English after the first year (it was not for me). I went to uni and trained as an Occupational Therapist BSc (Hons) and worked in the NHS for over 20 years.
I now work in education and studying a History degree with OU in my late 40’s.

You may have seen it, but at the bottom of this article is a handy table of the pre requisites for each uni.

www.uniadmissions.co.uk/application-guides/medicine-a-level-entry-requirement-subjects-to-study/

Realistically speaking, given the constraints such as UCAT and work experience, she really needs to keep chemistry and biology to have a chance, because practically all other candidates will (and many will have maths or physics as their third)

I would try all 4 until half term or Xmas, if possible, and then keep whichever of history or English she prefers if she still wants the option of being a medic. If she has gone off the idea by then, history, English and biology are a good combination