Parents Evenings - why does the child have to be there?

[Coatsoff42]

Why are parents evenings more like an annual performance review for the child? Is it a new thing at secondary schools? It’s not what my school did where the parents had the chat with the teacher, and you had to wait and see if you were in trouble or not.
Ive done a couple and it feels like being in my work annual appraisal and even they are a box ticking exercise in false promises for the future. The teachers say ‘child A, to improve your score/performance/grade you need to speak up more in class/contribute more/put more detail into your written work etc’ and the child says yes miss I will and then we walk away and they say, ‘I’m not doing that, I’m doing fine as I am’

I feel that the teachers are not speaking frankly in front of the child, the child doesn’t really care overly much, and we are not able to voice our concerns openly either.

Can someone tell me the advantage of having the child present at parents evening. Or alternatively, what the bloody hell I am there for? They could have that pointless chat any day of the week without me there!!
If there’s any secondary school teachers who can explain the benefits I would very much appreciate it.

At state schools I imagine it’s so teachers remember who they’re talking about. DN last year got a terrible parents evening where things were mentioned that didn’t apply to him — it then turned out the teacher had confused him with the other Indian boy in the class. This year children need to come with parents.

There should be no surprises at parents evening, if the teacher has concerns they should have rung you, if you have concerns you should have emailed them. Parents Evening is largely to show that both teacher and parent are working together to benefit the child and the child will be held to account by both.

I have never had a particularly productive parents evening I largely go to hear nice things about DD and to build a relationship with the teachers should I need more specific support / interaction at a later stage. The Spanish teacher said she should contribute more verbally in whole class discussion and needed to be reminded that DD is autistic.

How strange. DD's school does parent's evening online and without the child. When you only have 5 minutes per slot I definitely don't want DD there.

One of my children came along a couple of times when he was at secondary, the other never does as she doesn’t like it.

We just tell them what the teachers have said. They both take their studies seriously so we’re fine with that.

Parents evening has never really given us any information that is needed for progressing learning, but it’s good to meet their teachers and hear how your children are doing. The teachers have always very clearly known who our children are and I appreciate the teachers spending their time seeing us.

If my children were having difficulties academically or with behaviour, I would have made them attend parents evening with us. Teachers have a difficult job and I think when there are issues, seeing school and parents on the same page can be really important for the child and parents evening is a good opportunity for that to happen.

There should be no surprises at parents evening, if the teacher has concerns they should have rung you, if you have concerns you should have emailed them.

Very serious concerns, yes. But I teach just over 300 students. I do not remotely have time to ring or email a parent every time a child has any issue in lessons or with my subject.

If 'the' (your) child doesn't care, it's because you're allowing them to say they aren't going to bother listening to the advice and guidance of their teachers.

It's their opportunity to understand exactly where they are and how to get better, and you're meant to be there so you know and can support them in their education. It's meant to be a team effort, with different responsibility placed on everyone involved.

Teachers aren't there to parent your kids or instil basic manners or work ethic. It's no wonder so many kids find it so hard to cooperate with anyone who is trying to help them.

Child doesn't go to ours

To be honest, I don't really mind if the child attends or not, especially in KS3. The students get constant feedback, so they should know full well what they are doing well and what they need to improve. 6th formers should attend though - they are practically adults.

As a secondary teacher, it is very useful to have the pupil there. It is lovely for them to hear praise in front of their parents if that is what is happening. Similarly; a frank discussion can happen because everyone (hopefully) has the child’s best interests at heart. For example a recent one for me was ‘I know geography is not your favourite subject Jonny; but I don’t think its unreasonable of me to ask you to sit with your head off the desk, face forward and write things down’. Jonny had, in the past, informed me that his mum didn’t care how he did in geography. This was not the case. It is also very rare that a child will lie to your face in that situation; whereas if Jonny’s mum had gone home and repeated what I said it would have been very easy for him to deny it. In the end, it is the child’s education. I can talk to their parents forever. I’m not teaching them.
A further interesting thing as a teacher is to witness the dynamic between child and parent (s). You can learn a lot about how to support them by seeing how they interact together. I have met parents who I know want and are able to be closely involved in their child’s education and this will have a positive benefit for all sides. I have met parents who I would never contact no matter how frustrated I was with their child because I know it would do no good and would make their home situation considerably worse. I have met parents who, while thinking they are being supportive, have told Jonny in no uncertain terms to ‘stop fucking using bad language, how many times have I fucking told you?’ I have met parents who are so desperately deluded about their child’s ability that everyone’s expectations need carefully managing. And everything in between. At primary, teachers see a glimpse of the parent/child interaction at pick up. We don’t have that at secondary and it is vital.

I think it's important for the student to take responsibility for their learning.

Obviously they get constant feedback in school but hearing in a concise manner what their strengths and weaknesses are is important.

I think it's also to try and ensure student and parent are on the same page. They've both heard the same thing at the same time and that way parents can support their young person by understanding what they need to do to progress.

The teachers could be fairly brutal in my experience! I know my son dreaded it as he wasn't academic and didn't work very hard. It was never a 'parent pleasing' exercise with him.
My daughter on the other hand was a model student. Same thing year in year out, with the 'she's doing extremely well but needs to talk more ' (my son it was 'he needs to talk less'). I didn't bother going to her last parent teacher meeting.
I'm glad it went online though - much better than hanging around waiting to meet with a teacher and overhearing them talk about another student. No monopolising a teacher - five minutes is enough and online the connection cuts off at that point. It is constructive for the student if the teacher can pull up examples of where they need to concentrate.

Primary my children attended. Secondary it's all done via Zoom so I just do it without my child. Seems unnecessary for them to do it and it's such a rush. Only a few minutes at a time. The primary ones are great as they can share the workbooks etc so a lot more worthwhile, you could arrange a separate chat without your child if your needed to talk privately.

Why wouldn't a teacher talk frankly to a secondary school child? I doubt any teacher would have an issue doing so, the child needs to know what they need to improve on and no one needs to pussy foot around children of that age. At that age they should be involved in all discussions about them.

I don’t take my children either, I’m a teacher and prefer speaking to the parents but I’m not afraid to speak openly in front of the children if needs bed. Although, parents evening shouldn’t be a shock and any behavioural or learning issues I bring up with parents beforehand. If it’s low level behaviour I will say so in the meeting but it’s better to not be there if you need to speak about their ability or mental wellbeing.

Because it's the child's education, not yours.

Never ever took my dc to parents evenings

In my years of experience as a teacher the parents that you really need to have a frank conversation with don't actually come to parents evening and are never very receptive to feedback about their child.

Ours was via teams and all spread over 90 mins, so I didn’t ask my son to but he did drop in to listen every so often

The point of having the child there is surely because the child is the one that everything needs to happen around? If the teacher says the child needs to improve something, it's the child's chance to say why they find it hard, or what they misunderstood. Especially remembering that is is often 1 teacher to 30 ish kids, they don't have time to do a child interview with each child very often. If the teacher just rattles off to the parent that X is good at a,b,c and needs to improve d,e,f and then the parent comes back and says X "you apparently need to improve d,e,f" the child may well think "well I know that, but HOW?!" If it's a 3 way discussion, child can say straight away, "but I don't get that bit of d, or I find this bit of e hard" which gives the teacher and parent the chance to think about how to support that learning.

My kids have always gone to their parents evenings and the teachers always speak frankly.
I ask any questions I need to. Any massive issues and teachers call or email anyway.
It massively helps having the kids there they can hear what's being said about them, they can ask/answer questions they maybe don't want to in front of others etc.

thanks for your opinions.
it looks like schools all do things differently and you all handle it differently. I’ve thought about why it rankles so much for me when many of you think it is a sensible system.
I think it’s because I don’t trust the teachers to have any real interest in my kids. The teacher/pupil chat during parents evening feels really fake. At least if I talk to the teachers I can read what they are like and if what they are saying is true, which I can’t if I sit back and listen.
Primary school dropped them like a hot potato for months on end during covid and I don’t think I’ll ever go back to trusting teachers over myself, I feel like I have to know where they are because if it all stops again I’ll be picking up the pieces and I won’t see the school for dust.
Thats an issue for me to deal with but I appreciate everyone’s viewpoint, they have been helpful and a good range of opinions lol!

Why not?

@Singleandproud Unless your child attends a tiny private school, I think you are somewhat deluded about the amount of time teachers have to ring parents. Teachers can’t call parents about every concern, there aren’t enough hours in the day. Yes if a child is falling asleep in all their lessons, or being extremely disruptive, or crying etc - then they should find the time to call the parents. But if a child who was getting 7s in maths starts to get 6s, or a child who was a diligent 12 year old develops a bit of an attitude age 14, they’re not going to ring the parents about that. It’s too common and they don’t have time. They’ll wait till parents evening to flag it up.

@MumblesParty I taught at a school where you were expected to ring home if a child forgot their pen! Not a private school but a large school in a massively disadvantaged area and if I actually did ring home for every tiny misdemeanor as the school expected I would have never have actually gone home, I did opt to leave teaching though.

I was talking more about larger issues being a suprise really more so than anything, things that the teacher or parent wouldn't actually want to bring up in front of the child. A drop in grade, or a poorer Attitude to Learning should absolutely be discussed in front of the student.

I found inclusion of the child a little odd at first because when I was at school in the seventies and early eighties parents' evenings were for parents only. Children were not included.

I found it makes sense though. Looking back, I didn't like discussions being about me without involving me although I didn't think anything of it at the time.

Involving the child means that they should be clear what is expected of them, rather than it being passed on second hand (or not at all in some cases).