GCSE Options Problem.... Choices Blocked!

[IJustWantAUserNameThatDoesntExistAlready]

Hi there, looking for advice from anyone who may be in a similar position with a bit more knowledge. My first post here, so apologies for any presentation errors...
My son is about to select GCSE options. He has the core, plus 3 optional.
Core is English Lang / Lit, Math, Combined Science and MFL (French). All good so far.
For his options, he needs to select one from each of the following blocks:
Block 1: Geography, History
Block 2: RE, Sociology
Block 3: Triple Science, Art, Geography (only if History chosen as Block 1), Computing... plus a bunch of vocational stuff.

Here's the problem. He's academic, and is determined (since he was 4) to make a career in the historical sciences (details don't matter). As a result, he wants to take Geography, History and Triple Science. All 3 would be very beneficial to him, and allow him to select the A-levels appropriate to progress into a degree in the appropriate area.
But because of the structure of the options, he can't. He has to drop one of these in favour of RE / Sociology, both of which are utterly useless to him (I'm not knocking them as subjects - I personally took RE to A-Level - but they're not suitable for his purposes).

Does anyone have any experience in how to approach the school to try and get this limitation changed? I'm quite happy to play softball or hardball with them to get the options he wants. Or does he just have to do a subject that is a waste of time for him, and get whichever of the preferred subjects we can't get through school privately (he already has private tutoring, I'm not bothered about the cost, but the additional schooling on top of what he already does might be too much?) If I say to the school "fine - force him to do a subject he doesn't want to do that will be a waste of time for all concerned, but don't be surprised if this straight-A student lands an F and brings down your school when he could get an A in his useful subject" - will this bounce back on him?

So frustrated that we're being blocked from GCSE options that he wants that could hinder him through the rest of his education!
Grateful for any advice...

No, not a church school.
He's looking at either Palaeontology (req Biology, Geography) or Archaeology (Geography, History) - so he wants to start getting the bases covered now, rather than "wasting 2 years". He doesn't have any interest in either RE or sociology as they are covered at his school. RE covers primarily contemporary "big 5" (Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism) to quite a shallow degree, and his interests re theology are the polytheistic "dead" religions (e.g. Greco-Roman, Persian, Germanic / Viking, Celtic etc).
Good question on your last line. Option 3 is 50% "non-academic" subjects, from construction to hospitality to childcare.

I've not known any school go into detail about what you may or may not choose in combination when you look round. Plus most kids have no idea what they are going to want to study for GCSE aged 10.

Schools options change yearly anyway. No point looking in y6 when they aren't chosen until y9. maybe on whether or not they offer triple science but otherwise things change.

I know a lad who wanted to study marine biology since primary. Until right up to y11 when he discovered other interests and is currently doing film or some such at uni.

The RE syllabus my DD did was 50% Christianity and Islam and '50% ethics' topics Crime & punishment, War& peace, Abortion etc.

As a parent of academic kids, I'd have been horrified by those options too. Part of the problem is of course the decision to restrict them to 9 GCSEs only. But they don't seem to be taking triple science very seriously - the academic kids need to be able to pair that with all sorts of different subjects.

And then I think again and realise that it's a pretty rubbish arrangement of options for the much less academic kids too, if they were wanting / would benefit from doing more than one of the more "vocational" type subjects.

I'd certainly be raising it with the school one way or another, to express my concern at the restrictive nature of the choices they are offering.

Teacher here. It's 100% a timetable thing. There will literally be no classroom or teacher available to teach the subject you want at the time you want. You can kick off as much as you want, won't change anything.

If he's so gifted, do RE (a perfectly respectable GCSE) in school and he can teach himself Geography or whatever and sit exam as an external.

GCSE education isn't just about facilitating future careers. It is providing general education to help adults be rounded individuals.

"He's looking at either Palaeontology (req Biology, Geography) or Archaeology (Geography, History)" - I suggest you check this because a quick google looking at unis offering these course eg. Birmingham, Bristol, Durham suggests that that's not the case.

The triple science one is confusing me, both schools I've worked at and the one DC go to. You only get to do triple science if your grades are good enough and it's not actually an extra taking up more timetable as the double science students have the same number of classes? So the bright kids still get the same options they just come out with an extra GCSE.

This gives more going over and revision time for those just doing double.

This also allows movement of students in science but they do generally make sure all those doing triple are doing so by the end of year 10. We also get students who then move up and down from foundation to higher.

Home educator here so can’t comment on timetabling. Just wanted to point out that if he were to take history GCSE at home, he may as well study an aspect that he finds more interesting. Maybe Ancient History would suit him? My ds is studying it now, the first block is Greece and Persia, with a focus on Alexander the Great. The second block is Rome and Cleopatra.

I can pm you the details of the inspirational online tutor if you like? He wouldn’t be able to watch the live lessons but he could watch the recordings and do it that way.

Can you find out which exam board the school use for combined science? That way you can check the syllabus yourself re the biology content.

I'd also bet any money that, just because your 13 year old likes fossils now, in 10 years time he'll be working in something totally different and you'll have wound yourself up for nothing. Maybe even by A level choices time...

Most palaeontology degree courses require two sciences at A level (although geography and maths both count) so presumably he will be wanting to do biology geography and history as his A levels.

So he choses combined science and does history RS and Geography as his options. That means he can take biology, History and Geography A Levels. He doesn't need to do triple science.

Southampton is 5th for Archaeology. It has no specific A levels. If you choose Ancient History and Archaeology, you need History but lots of other A levels are suggested, eg Sociology, RE, Classical Civilization and many others. None require a science. None require Geography. Therefore the RE or Sociology option for GCSE is neither here nor there. Triple science would not be a problem for any course. Obviously check Oxbridge but plenty of subjects are good prep.

I am surprised about triple science taking up an option as the options appear very loaded towards humanities. No arts? No technology?

I’m a geologist. I was looking up some of the uni course requirements for palaeontology. There aren’t many courses that do just palaeontology, and that could be quite restrictive for careers, so finding a more combined course could be something to look into with a more focussed masters or PhD afterwards perhaps.

https://www.whatuni.com/degrees/palaeontology-and-evolution-bsc-hons/university-of-bristol/cd/57998910/4517/

This course for instance says entry is “Standard offer: ABB including two science-related subjects.”

Portsmouth’s course says
A levels - BBB-BBC
UCAS points - 112-120 points to include a minimum of 2 A levels, or equivalent, with 32 points from a Science subject (Applied Science, Archaeology, Biology, Chemistry, Environmental Science/Studies, Geography, Geology, Mathematics or Physics).

Basically for geology related courses, they will teach you from scratch. You need to have done appropriately sciency a levels, for which geography counts, as does maths. You don’t actually need to have done geography to do a geology degree - I didn’t. Actually dropped it before GCSE. I appreciate he may be keen to do it and that’s great, but it doesn’t actually matter at all - it’s about training your brain to think scientifically.

So I would recommend:

• geography
• re or sociology (both are critical thinking essay subjects and you will learn similar SKILLS as you would in eg history for essay construction and research).
• Either triple science or history. I was helping my 15 year old revise the evolution part of biology triple science gcse last night. An interested student would pick it up in a few hours with a bit of reading. They’d cover it all at a level if needed. It’s straightforward.

Also, where will he be doing a levels? At the same school? Or moving to a sixth form college? Find out what option blocks there are in various places. I was v surprised to discover that all the places we’ve been able to look at only offer 3 a levels, with potential 4th only really being further maths, if you’re doing maths as an a level.

Also - I do sympathise. The “compulsory” RE or sociology seems weird to me. But just think of them as vehicles for skills, not content. Keep going to geology museums, find summer schools in fun topics, sign up to the geological society or similar. Read stories and watch programs about ancient civilisations. One of the sixth form colleges near us offers three different history a levels, one of which is ancient history. Does anywhere near you do that - could be a good one to aim for. Good luck!

I did a palaeontology related degree with archaeology/anthropology cross over modules and an MSc in a physical geographical field with no geography GCSE. I did history GCSE instead and found it useful for A'level and University for the critical thinking and essay writing skills it developed. I would also look at geology A level if it is an option. I did an AS geology, it ended up being my most enjoyable A level course and helped me decide on my degree choice. I found it very useful preparation for my university course particularly for the field work aspect and coursework style, but physical geography has that too along with biology A level. Statistics was also a useful component if they offer an A level Pure Maths and Statistics option, many other people on my university course had to do extra statistics courses in the first year, although they do some in Biology A level too.

@TizerorFizz The OP missed out the longer list of options in block 3 as not needed for the discussion, all he arts, tech, and vocational ones.

He's looking at either Palaeontology (req Biology, Geography) or Archaeology (Geography, History)

You keep saying that - it's not true! Archaeology at Cambridge for example doesn't have ANY specific subject requirement.

Actually, thinking about it further, option blocks 1 & 2 really don’t work well for anyone, do they? It’s a shame RE and sociology aren’t both under option 3, leaving Option 2 free for another free choice.

I think the triple sciences would be the most important thing if he wants to do sciences later on. Out of the history/ geography, if he wants to do paleontology or archaeology I think history at gcse will not be much interest to him. The gcse specification looks at modern history, going back to medieval times. I would say geography would be more useful. My DS wants to do paleontology and will be choosing gcse options next year, but in his school science is either combined science or triple science. He wants to do geography as an option. I think actual gcse options aren't that important apart from science for A Level/ degree anyway, as long as they can get good enough marks to go to the next level.

I'd have been really miffed with block 2 as effectively everyone has to take 2 humanities (or 3 to do both History and Geography). Logically blocks 1 and 2 should be the same "pot" with 2 options to give chances for things like triple science and music. I'm pretty sure RE counts as a humanity under most measures!

Assuming the blocks are fixed I'd be dropping history as it's likely the easiest to pick up later and have a look at the syllabus within history as the classic GCSE route of Victorians, World War (1 or 2) and another relatively modern topic wouldn't necessarily fit with ancient history/paleontology as well as Triple Science (which included a chunk of geology when I did it) Geography and RE.

RE was my worst subject at school, largely because the teachers were dull, dropped history for the same reason (plus I wasn't that interested in the periods covered) but I ended up doing a lot of French political History as part of my degree...

Thanks for this. I'm not the OP but one of the things I was worried about with my DS being so set on paleontology is that it may be quite restrictive. I suggested natural sciences as an alternative.

I am amazed by Block 2- it is incredibly narrow and means every child does either Sociology or RE to GCSE level. Most schools don't offer either at GCSE level now. I am baffled as to why they don't just move the Triple Science into Option 2- by far the most straightforward solution.

I do think you need to do some fact-checking. Word of mouth from other parents can be misleading.

Combined science does cover biology, chemistry and physics equally. Check the syllabus for whatever exam board he's doing.

Palaeontology, Archaeology, History of Science, Geology degrees etc etc have a wide range of possible A-levels. Check on whatuni.com.

A-levels don't always require the subject to have been done at GCSE. Ask the local sixth forms or check their websites.

(And tell him getting a decent grade in a subject he hates will be good practice for life.)

I'd back the advice to do maths A-level if he can. It'll make any kind of quantitative university work easier.

Palaeontology is definitely an area that people get quite obsessed with! (I don’t mean that as a criticism!).
I actually did natural sciences too, specialising in geology and ending up with geology msci. I then went and did an industry focussed masters and got a job. Natural sciences is a great way of bringing other sciences into your interest areas. Palaeontology is just one topic in a much broader geology course, but people often get the options to choose some course modules and some of my fellow students ended up doing palaeontology related phds afterwards. I would say it’s a good idea to take it a bit broader for a first degree as it’s often something you end up specialising in later on, and you need to understand the bigger geological picture too.