Would most people choose private education if they could afford it

[mids2019]

My children go to reasonable state schools but especially from my older daughter I keep hearing about a succession of cover teachers and general malaise in the school system (governments fault not the schools)

That for me asking the question would most people choose private education if affordable in their heart of hearts or are there egalitarian parents who would still choose state on ideological grounds?

I am in two minds about this but certainly the private sector locally is attracting quite a few.

There is bullying in all types of schools. I was bullied so badly in my state comprehensive that I ended up trying to commit suicide. Also, not all private schools are academic hothouses. In fact, I moved my DS1 from a private school to a super selective state grammar as he needs a very academic school, otherwise he just coasts. He is thriving at his grammar. DS2 remains in the private school because that’s what suits him best. It offers a lot more than academics, sport, music, dance…

We can afford it and both DC are in state. They were both in private before the current school and wouldn't rule out private again in the future, so not against it in principle.

Rubbish

I agree with you @twistyizzy
everyone can do what they think best for their children and spend their money how they see fit. I see fit to spend it on getting my child the best education and schooling experience that I can.

And I don’t judge people who make different choices on how to spend their money, those are their choices to make.

Ideologically, nope it's not an automatic vote for private school and depends on the child. I think the social division is a disadvantage.

Pragmatically, whilst there are fantastic state options in some places, I believe in a fully rounded education, including the arts, and the only way to get that right now is private. The current educational system for most children (and teachers) is not good enough.

Also the difference in the pandemic was night and day.

For bright kids and dare I say it bright girls I think private is unnecessary.

We live near a really good state secondary school. I'd move near a good school though, rather than spend vast and ever increasing amounts on private school if I didn't live near one. Private school always seems like a huge waste of money to me - unless you're incredibly wealthy.

I'm not bothered about fairness though - life isn't fair IMO.

But what do you consider a wide variety of society? There are many state schools with very narrow demographics. My nieces state school is far less diverse than my DS’ private school. My nieces don’t have one friend who isn’t from a white working class background.

@Newuser75 behaviour management and having to teach things using different methods and ways of explanation. There is often quite a bit of using extra time and different exam boards to gain higher marks than can be done in state schools
as well. Obviously this is more true in selective private schools. But I have also heard of far more less able students simply not being entered for GCSEs at private schools so they don’t affect results as well. This is far less common in state schools. I am biased as I teach in a state school but I do have friends and encounter colleagues and students from a whole range of academic environments so feel relatively confident in my opinions. But obviously things can be very different in individual schools, both state and private.

Private schools often also employ teachers with excellent degrees but sometimes no teaching qualifications. To the point where it can be a bit of an old boys club amongst staff. Teaching a subject well requires a large degree of teaching skill-this does not always correlate with an outstanding degree in a subject. 😬 I am trying my hardest to be fair but my opinions are clear, I’m sure.

I absolutely would. If I could afford it. Which I can't. I went to Grammar School and chose same for my DCs

@Haggisfish3 That makes sense, thank you.

Nope, I wouldn't. State school all the way and preferably comprehensive. There are some fantastic state schools and inevitably, some not so good ones, but in my DCs school the teaching is fantastic and they're getting a well-rounded view and experience of society.

I taught in mainstream schools for most of my career but finished it in private. In a utopia, there should be no private schools. They add nothing but inequality to the country. They are far worse than people using private healthcare.

Would I send my kids to one if I could afford it? Yes, in an instant. Because there is no sign of the education system being properly invested in any time soon (Labour have said nothing about it either) and I do not want my kids being stabbed outside the school gate or being unable to learn due to relentless feral behaviour in classrooms.

Let's say I won the Euromillions and stuck to my Socialist principles. Would I move to a leafy suburb and pay well over the odds for a home in the catchment area of an outstanding state school. Of course I would. How would that be any different? Are there parents out there with privileges like that still kidding themselves they are Socialists?

The state system is broken. The teacher shortage is chronic and causing massive strain and disruption. I am amazed parents and teachers alike aren't out on the street in a general strike over how bad it is.

Have I sold out? Maybe. I think I am just a realist, and our kids have precious few opportunities as it is.

It is hard @AgnestaVipers i can’t afford to send dc to private school so it’s an irrelevant argument but I really don’t think I would, even if I could. But I’m fortunate to live in an area without grammars and where most local schools are ok.

@AgnestaVipers

Maybe we all reach that stage? I can relate to your thoughts.

Yes, for secondary.

We are in Wales which just had terrible PISA results and the new curriculum is doubling down with less science teaching at GCSE. Wales is doing nothing to attract science teachers, there are more incentives in England which is a brain drain. The language policy smothers STEM.

We are saving up for younger daughter to go private if she wants to study math or science.

Dibblydoodahdah
true, and different types of bullying in each, but in college there was a general consensus that most private schools around Dublin were the same (could have been a Dublin thing too to be fair!)

😂Not sure if that was intended as a joke or not, but it did make me literally LOL.

I am sure those kids will come a “representative social mix” yes. Representative of those whose parents can afford an £850k house. At least at private there will be a mix including kids on scholarships and bursaries.

@Haggisfish3 , you are indeed fortunate, and that is the point.

When I was a raging Socialist, I didn't have kids. No actual lives/futures on the line for my views. I have also learned to hold my beliefs more lightly. Much of Socialism is based on unachievable wishful thinking. Laudable, maybe, but no sign of it happening here in the UK any time soon.

Having taught in a private school, I also want to refute the argument that the teachers there are less skilful that in state. In private one has the normal mix of teaching ability, but without the mayhem in so many state schools. This is an unpalatable fact, but it's true. Some state schools are ok - but again, this is a postcode lottery. In state, the behaviour can be so poor that little teaching is ever accomplished. It's all firefighting.

I am very against private education, but having seen my very bright DC lose motivation and their mental health suffer in a bog-standard state secondary (not one of the magical ones that MN children have access to), I have to say I have a much better understanding of why people use it.

Not that many sharp elbows considering only about 5.9% of children are in private schools.

Why can't state parents get their own elbows out anyway

AgnestaVipers
I only ever worked in state but your post resonated with me.

Until I went into teaching I was very black and white that state is good and private is selfish, awful and other similar lefty knee jerk judgements. Over time my opinion has become more nuanced.

Why are people continually spouting that private school kids won't have a well rounded view of society?

You know they leave school at evenings and weekends? Like football club, gymnastics etc? Where there are state school kids.

We were happy to send our kids to state but when my son failed to get in to the FOUR nearest schools (all rated excellent) and was offered an 'adequate' (I think that was the term back then) on the other side of the borough we sent him to a private school and his sister followed. We lived in zone 3 and the schools are bunched together weirdly so we just didn't live close enough to any.
But philosophically I'd go with state if the school was very good.

I think it's one of those situations if your child's local state school is really excellent then it's difficult to get your head around why someone would feel the need to pay for something you can get for free. I'm in Ireland and we have only one private secondary school in the area where I live (zero private primaries) and the private school is by no means highly sought after so I'm often bemused by people on MN who are planning to almost live hand to mouth just to afford private education. But one of my DC has additional needs and I can see the unbelievable difference in him since I moved him to a school with additional asd support so I can now understand if that type of education wasn't available at state level then yes absolutely I'd pay for it if needs be but in general to be honest I think I'd rather move house to an area with good schools than pay school fees.