Primary school admissions - 14 miles apart

[Ruralparents]

Hi all

I thought I’d join to mine your collective wisdom!

We live in rural Cambridgeshire, 6 miles from our nearest school in one direction and 8 miles from the next nearest in another.

Back in the depths of lockdown we had to a choose a school for our eldest to start at in Sept 2021. My wife teaches at the school 8 miles away and so we chose it because it would be handier. We didn’t know if our eldest would get in there but she did. And it turns out that her catchment school, 6 miles away, was oversubscribed.

Now, in 2023 our daughters school is over subscribed and our youngest has been placed at the catchment school. These two school are 14 miles apart! We lost our appeal and have now got the prospect of trying to manage a 28 mile school run, twice a day.

Cambridgeshire council don’t care, they are hiding behind their protocols and passing the buck.

We asked if our eldest could move schools to be with our youngest and they’ve refused because her year group at the catchment school is oversubscribed.

Out of catchment siblings get the same priority as in catchment siblings in Suffolk and Norfolk, but not Cambridgeshire. And when you live 6 and 8 miles from the two schools it’s fairly obvious you’re going to be at the bottom of the admissions list when either school is over subscribed.

Has anyone had any joy appealing on the grounds of unreasonable journey times etc? I just don’t think anyone should be made to do over 10000 miles a year on the school run. School transport hasn’t been offered but even if we can get it, someone still has to be available to put a 4 year old in a taxi and to collect them etc, it doesn’t help the logistics.

There is an ombudsman, but I think they have just rigged the whole system in order to do as they please and screw those who live out in the sticks.

Honestly there is so much movement o we the primary years I’m sure it will work out in the end.

*in the

And whether it does or not, in a few years time none of it will matter anyway…

Sounds like logical to move both to Suffolk school

Just be careful if they end up at a suffolk primary it doesn’t disadvantage secondary options. We had this scenario with dd.

lived in county A, went to primary 3 miles away In county B. Secondary school in county B went on home address and we wouldn’t have got in. Secondary school in county A went on primary school as a priority for certain schools in county A and then on distance. We wouldn’t have got either school and had to move her for year 6 which was a pain. Joys of rural life.

No idea why youve been given such a hard time here op Good luck with the Suffolk school option fingers crossed it works out

@Figgygal I think most people have calmly explained catchment areas and the issues if you choose out of catchment which then introduces jeopardy for siblings attending the same school. The OP rather thought the rules should be bent for his family. This would disadvantage others. We all want the best for Dc but sibling and catchment rules have to suit the majority and not just a few.

Sorry I didn’t respond to this at the time. In the link you posted it lists the mileages for each school. Is this the distance out from the school in a straight line at which the infant class size was reached?

Usually last admitted distance, in a straight line from school, on allocation day. The actual final admitted distance is often much further after waiting lists move.

So say, on allocation day, the last child admitted on distance criteria lives 7.8 miles away (and the first child not admitted lives 7.9 miles away), the distance recorded will be 7.8 miles.

By the second week of September, after 2 children got into a different school from their waiting list. 1 went private, 2 moved area, 2 deferred until the following year and 1 simply never turned up and was found on investigation to have moved elsewhere, the final child actually in class might well live 9 miles away.

So on that list our catchment school was full up at under 2 miles at criteria 7 (lives out of catchment). Our eldest would have been criteria 4 (lives in catchment, no elder sibling) at 6 miles distance. So presumably she would have still got in due to the way the catchment map is drawn, by trumping the criteria 7 child 2 miles from the school, or at least that’s a fair assumption?

However the school she did actually go to that we requested says it was full under criteria 7 at under 5 miles distance. And yet our eldest was accepted on allocation day at a distance of 7 miles as the crow flies and she would have been criteria 7.

So I’m not even sure how she got into our chosen school in the first place? Unless they’ve recorded the distances wrong?

Was there a ‘children of staff’ criterion?

Ah yes, dug the document out, criteria 6 is staff children. The school was undersubscribed enough to get as low as category 7 in 2021 but in 2023 it was full at category 4 (children in catchment) at under 0.4 miles away, that doesn’t extend as far as the edge of the village.

Well, we did what we thought best at the time, and now we shall have to try and do what we think best this year. And we’ll find out in a couple of years whether we made the right call!

You would need to check. In our area mileages are calculated on nearest safe walking distance, because straight line measurements are likely to take people over a river and/or a very busy dual carriageway.

I went through appeals when we relocated youngest was offered a place (yr 2) eldest wasn’t (yr 3), we had a stroke of luck though in that a family moved away and a space became available so did manage to get them both in, there’s still time for something like that to happen, but for you logistically now I would find a childminder close to your local school, your wife drops her off on her way to work (I fully understand the dynamics of life with a farmer) and then heads to work herself with one of you picking her up at the end of the working day. Your wife only needs to do this journey 5 times a week (based on working 2.5 days), get your school transport sorted for both children so the days your wife doesn’t work both children can go to school on school transport, or your wife can drive one of them. I get it would be a lot easier for both of your children to go to school where your wife works (and saves you lots of money too) but the reality is most working people need to drop a child at school/childminder etc and then make their way to work. Your eldest is at your wife’s workplace an presumably arrives and leaves at the same time she does so you can’t really class that as a school run when looking at logistics of getting your other child to school.

@Ruralparents I think an escort is provided if you get school transport like a taxi or car. Young children wouldn’t have to travel alone I’m sure.

Hi. I am sorry this has happened and more so that you’ve come on here for advice and basically been told it’s your fault, you should quit your job and god knows what else. Good old mumsnet. The only think I can suggest is getting legal advice and judicially reviewing the decision to refuse your appeal on basis it’s unlawful/irrational/procedural impropriety. May cost in solicitors fees but from what you’ve said about the criteria not being properly considered you may have a case although this is always a high bar. Hope you get it sorted and btw from what you’ve put you sound like a really good dad and husband just trying to do the best for his family and help his wife 🙂

Too many townies on this post 🤦‍♀️🙈🤣 farming is a 24/7 job and tbh if you've never lived the lifestyle you're not likely to understand the constraints.

What a pain in the ass for you OP!

Not really got any advice that others haven't already suggested. Think sticking your children on wait lists for both schools seems sensible, hopefully then at some point they will both be going to the same one.

The farmers in our village send their children to the local childminder who then does the shool pick ups and drops offs along with breakfast and tea.

Exactly, time for you to do the school run.

I have to say that I think posters are being far ruder to you than you are back. I think you are being reasonable and doing your best, and the situation you are in would be impossible for any parent.

Suggesting that you are being sexist and promoting the patriarchy at the expense of your wife is very unfair and a bit embarrassing. IMO the fact that you are posting here in such detail and investigating all routes shows the opposite. There are sadly many men who think it is their partner’s job to sort all this out, but this is clearly not the case here. I’m a feminist but I don’t see the OP doing anything wrong, beyond he and his wife making a mistake with the admission criteria. As many people do.

OP is in a tied house and contractually obliged to farm. He has very little flexibility. I can negotiate start times with my boss in the city, but harder to do with chickens I presume.

I think your responses have been dignified in the face of such animosity and that some posters’ behaviour has been far more toddler-like than yours.

I have no solutions unfortunately, but hope you find a solution that suits your family. And thank you for farming - without the hard work you do, the rest of us wouldn’t have access to cheap food.

@KateyCuckoo financially, I'm assuming the OP makes far more money with their job than the wife does, so it makes the most sense that if anyone were to lose their job, it would have to be the wife, yes its shitty, but when it comes down to finances, the one with the lesser wage will always have to take the hit. It's just common sense

As your youngest is May born she doesn't have to start this year and could start next September if whatever childcare arrangements you currently have for her are easier than the commute. And then try and get them both into the same school once class sizes aren't so rigid for the older one.

Time to get advice on whether a second appeal will work. If decide to appeal again you can ask for your evidence to be reviewed and you can try to show new evidence to strengthen your case

Could the NFU help or point you in the direction of someone who can?

Sorry to see all the negativity you've received on here. Wonder how the posts would've gone if your wife had posted about the situation? (I predict just as much disdain directed at you along the lines of "why is it always the woman having to deal with the children issues" )

I feel for you both in this situation. Good luck with it all

'Some of the panel may be volunteers as school governors are quite often on panels so would be at home rather than their place of work'

Seriously? Other parents get to decide this stuff?!

Op, sorry if it's been mentioned but contact your MP See if they can liaise and help drill some sense into the jobsworths. Of course in your circumstances both primary kids should be able to attend the same school to avoid a stupid school run. Good luck.