Areas to live for good secondary or grammar schools in North London/ Berks/ Bucks/ Herts

[PeanutbutterAndJelly1]

I’m after some ideas of place names to start my search - where to buy a family home in London or outer London, north of the river, that has good secondary schools? I’m particularly interested in those with really strong pastoral care. In the interest of swapping like for like, I’m also interested in areas that would allow for access into grammar schools.

Background: We are currently on the SE London/ Kent border (renting). The plan has always been to move into Kent for our permanent home, for affordability reasons, and as a bonus, access to the grammar schools in Kent, should either of our DS be academic enough to benefit. However, DH and I are both from Manchester originally, both with family up north still, so we are starting to think if we have missed a trick to have never considered north of the river properly, purely because of our lack of knowledge. We have always lived in SE London and I know South London as a whole quite well through work. DH works in the city, so wherever we move to, we need good access back into central.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions!

I just saw Berkshire in your title, if you went further into Berkshire, the tiny catchment area of The Downs School is very good (and no 11plus anxiety as comprehensive), but you'd also be in the catchment for Reading School and Kendrick, both regularly in the top 10 nationwide. Elizabeth Line from Reading, via 25min drive or train from Twyford or Newbury. Or simply anywhere along the Elizabeth Line between Reading and London if you want to go for the 11plus at the Reading and Slough grammars.

@PeanutbutterAndJelly1
Ally Pally / Bounds Green side of Muswell Hill for Alexandra Palace School and Fortismere.

Muswell Hill for Fortismere
Crouch End for Highgate Wood and Hornsey School for Girls
East Finchley for Archers
Anywhere in North London, but High Barnet in particular for QE Boys (academically tough to get into)
Potter's Bar for Dame Alice Owen (they take 20 a year from the borough of Islington)
Southgate for Ashmole
There are supposed to be some good state secondaries in Winchmore Hill, but I'm not familiar with them.
The Latymer Grammar (need to check postcodes)
A lot of people who live in Stoke Newington and Highbury opt for independent senior school.

I'd go for Little Chalfont/Amersham in Bucks.

In the catchment for both Dr Challoner's grammar schools, plus have other local grammar schools too. Chiltern Line around 30 minutes into Marylebone or Met Line into Liverpool Street.

House prices reflect it though.

Harpenden and St albans for very good state schools, St George's in particular

Harpenden has good schools, but you pay an extortinate property premium of 1 million for it. Similar in Bucks. A nice exec style 4 bed family home on a decent plot is about 800/900k in Reading/Newbury/Slough (Berks/West Berks) area but about 1.8 mil in Harpenden. So the further West you go, it gets quite dramatically cheaper.

Bucks grammar schools are difficult to access from outer London proper but passing the exam is achievable for the top 25% of the cohort. You can either commit completely to the grammar system, move to Bucks and risk the possibility of not passing, or move to Thame in Oxfordshire or Chorleywood in Hertfordshire. There are some decent non-grammars in Bucks, my impression is that they're in the most expensive parts of the county but I'm not super well informed. Thame, Chorleywood, Amersham, and Beaconsfield are all very lovely commuter towns. Chesham and Aylesbury are more affordable. High Wycombe is a mixed bag.

A lot of the other grammars in North London and just beyond are super selectives, incredibly popular and really very difficult to get into - more like top 5%-10% of the cohort. In that area would definitely be looking for a decent comprehensive school as a priority, with the possibility of a grammar school place as a bonus.

I grew up in Sunningdale and around that area, and the windsor is lovely with great schools. Lots of competition from the boarding schools.

Not sure if they still do it, but Charters School used to jave a debate club that challenged the boarders.

Amersham for guaranteed great secondary modern or top grammar if they pass the 11+.

Tring and Berkhamsted in Herts both have fabulous comprehensive schools and you can usually get out of catchment grammar placements - although last admitted distances are shrinking year by year and there’s no guarantee.

Challoners and Becky High (which are the grammar schools) do not have good pastoral care though. You're expected to just get on with it!

Enfield borough- Highlands or Southgate School both get good results and have good pastoral care. There is also Wren Enfield but it is new and I don’t know about it’s pastoral care. Ashmole School has already been mentioned it is also in the same part of Enfield Borough but the students are put under a lot of pressure and pastoral care is poor. Otherwise APS in Haringey also very good with good pastoral care.

O wow, thank you for all the suggestions! A few of these places I have heard of, but most are completely new to me - looks like I’ll be setting up a little table so I can research and compare everything!

@NellyBarney Yes we would consider Berkshire, though reading back on what I’ve written, I’ve realised it doesn’t quite fit the geographical description of what I gave in the actual post! But despite Berkshire not being north of where we are currently, it would still get us out and heading north much quicker! So will definitely look into what you suggested : )

@Soma Thanks for the bumper list. Is there one that you would recommend over another, maybe based on personal experience or friends with DC there?

@limoncello23 and @BookwormButNoTime What are your thoughts on the absence of comprehensive schools in Bucks? I wasn’t aware secondary moderns existed until I looked into the way schools work in Bucks. Do people generally feel the system works?

@underneaththeash and @kkneat Thanks for the insight on pastoral care, DS1 would definitely struggle if he was left to just get on with it. So that’s very quickly highlighted a few schools to avoid for me!

Sorry if I’m being thick but what is pastoral care?
I went to a grammar in the north west and was left to get on with things?!

(I mean in practical terms. I know what it is in theory!)

@PeanutbutterAndJelly1 The secondary Moderns can be a bit hit and miss but there are some great ones. Amersham School, Waddesdon School, Great Marlow School all have good reputations. These are only the ones I know who have friends at though - there may be more.

Of course their results won’t be amazing compared to standard comprehensive schools as the top third of students have been creamed off to the grammars, but children do come out of them with a “full house” of 9s at GCSE. Don’t judge them on results alone.

@Led92 To be honest, I’m not entirely sure what I can expect for secondary aged children. I would hope that maybe for kids who needs a little more attention, maybe willingness to make adjustments? Or maybe extra support in the classroom for having things explained a little differently for example??

We saw a huge change in DS1’s attitude to nursery when we eventually found the right one for him when he was younger, and that particular school placed a lot of emphasis on getting to know the child and tailoring things to meet their needs. So it’s something we’ve always placed high priority for since.

@BookwormButNoTime I’m a firm believer that a child will always do best when they’re happy. Results only paint part of the picture, and not every child is academic anyway!

Rickmansworth? Location wise, you are close to M25, M40 and M1.

Schools - you have several part selective schools, but they also admit on catchment. So you could try for Watford Boys, Rickmansworth or St Clement Danes.

If you're looking at Bucks you need to make your choice of place on the basis that you could live with the secondary modern. All the grammars are good and fairly similar, the others (I think the council calls them "all ability" schools) differ from each other quite a lot more. Along with those already recommended, I've always heard good things about The Chalfonts Community College.

TBH if I was thinking about Bucks, I'd be very tempted to look at Long Crendon, Haddenham or Thame where you're in catchment for Lord Williams School (good but very large comprehensive) but could also try for one of the Aylesbury Grammars. That's a fair distance from London though.

The challenge with the partially selective schools in SW Herts has always been that they're surprisingly hard to get a place at, and there are usually quite a few areas where you're quite near to a lot of schools but couldn't get in to any. I'd probably move close enough to one of them that you'd expect to get a distance-based place if possible.

I agree that The Downs is a good school, the catchment is huge though (very rural area), not tiny.
The grammar schools in Reading are fantastic but very very competitive to get into. However if you live in The Downs catchment it isn't easy to get to Reading other than by car or driving to a train station.

Ooooo! So did I .... my school is no longer there now.

Yes I do remember Charters debating team

I disagree with @underneaththeash, my son is at Dr Challoners and pastoral care has been very good.
the Amersham School is excellent for a non grammar, so if you were to move to Amersham, you’re on the met line and Chiltern Railways into Marylebone and you have both Challoners Grammar schools plus possibly Chesham as coed Grammar depending on where you move to and the Amersham school as back up. Plus Bucks is a lovely place to live!

What are your thoughts on the absence of comprehensive schools in Bucks? I wasn’t aware secondary moderns existed until I looked into the way schools work in Bucks. Do people generally feel the system works?

You do know it’s the same in Kent?

I don't know that there are secondary moderns in Kent, certainly not in the parts I know. They're comprehensives, although the majority of the top is creamed off by the Grammars.

By definition you cannot have genuinely comprehensive schools in a selective local authority. Non-selective schools in Kent might be 'comprehensives' in theory but in practice you cannot consider a school which has had the most able 30% creamed off its intake to be a comprehensive school. Non-selective schools in selective LAs are de facto secondary moderns. This article from the FFT Datalab is from 2017 but is nevertheless a good explanation of the nuances.

I’m not sure how good the schools are but in terms of location, Leighton Buzzard would be ideal and is quite a quick journey into Euston.

Or you could head further east. Bishops Stortford in East Herts has excellent schools (choice of one comprehensive, one state highly selective, two single sex and one Catholic for secondaries). Good rail connections into Tottenham Hale and Liverpool Street.