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Education

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COLPAI PR vs Reality

72 replies

Wasntmeanttobethishard · 30/11/2022 14:06

DH and I are considering Colpai (City of London Primary Academy Islington) for our DC next year. Whilst the COLPAI PR is absolutely brilliant, we are struggling with PR vs word on the street. On our recent tour staff didn’t seem engaged with reception children and coats/ bags were really messy. There also wasn’t a strong community feel there. The building itself is nice and new and the pupils seem super well behaved. But…

  • More Able children aren’t provided for beyond the ‘one size fits all’ curriculum. Power Maths (a Singapore style maths mastery programme) and their own English curriculum with a heavy reliance on RWI synthetic phonics in reception and KS1 to the point of holding some gifted kids back. The school doesn’t recognise HLP children or link with any outside agencies to support gifted kids.
  • The school day is long and play times seem shorter than any other school in the area. Plus there’s little playground space to speak of and no equipment for kids to climb, hang, swing etc. No end date for housing construction next door which is affecting playground provision.
  • sports don’t seem to measure up to other schools. Nothing before KS2 so far as we can see. No plans for sports outside school hours due to no space. Can’t see any involvement in Islington or city galas/ competitions to date. No swimming lessons in school before KS2. Hanover is regularly at IRB developing their stronger swimmers after school.
  • There seems to be a high teacher turnover despite their claims of employing high calibre consultant level staff for management.
  • Communication is a big part of our school choice. COLPAI say they are big on it but all the parents in the playgrounds locally say personal communication (about your child specifically) is poor although the school does send lots of reminder emails about various things. Some parents have reported having several emails ignored, being given the cold shoulder by senior staff members for questioning practices and being brushed off when asking in person. On the other hand some parents say they are given all they need plus more but that’s because they’re on some committee in the school??? There doesn’t seem to be a clear cut practise that we can see.
  • They say they provide a world class education and have excellent results but how much of their results are actually from private tuition outside school? City Juniors is a stones throw away and lots of kids try for that (much to the Head’s fury we hear). The school won’t provide references to private schools and won’t prepare kids at 11+ (Hugh Myddleton does this). Apparently the school even sent out what amounted to a nanny/ tuition advertisement of a leaving TA last year?? Should this ring alarm bells?
  • We are new to the British education system so are yet to get our heads around what’s what. Is it normal for the Chair of Governors to essentially be a member of staff? The COLPAI COG teaches French and her daughter is the DH in the school. Is this common practice to use governors skills in this way? Is it common to have family links on staff in a state school?

We know that different schools fit different kids. We have little choice around us. It’s hard to ignore the PR pumped out but also we can’t ignore first hand experience being shared. Any insights welcomed! 🤯🤪

OP posts:
July81 · 05/01/2023 21:33

Hi,
I also visited COLPI and had the same feeling as you.
2 of the teachers were agency and the Head Teacher was making funny comments about them.

They show the written work a lot but there doesn’t seem to be that much else interesting to show.

I would be curious about others experience.

Wasntmeanttobethishard · 06/01/2023 11:10

There seems to be a big focus on handwriting in the school. More so than other schools I visited. Couldn’t tell if this was a COLPAI initiative or national curriculum. 🤔

Other parents in the community that have shared their feedback about the school, comment on the draconian behaviour policy - but this may be a COLAT directive having heard about the secondary school COLAI where the students aren’t allowed to speak in the corridors and get detentions if they do.

Im also curious for further opinion. There’s little choice in the catchment areas so we feel caught between a rock and a hard place. We’re not sold on COLPAI, too many alarm bells but feel we’ve little other choice!

OP posts:
IIN16 · 08/01/2023 09:25

You are spot on my child goes there and they the school like a business and treat the kids as mini adults. What's alarming is that senior members of staff have previously been investigated by Police for previous school roles, somehow COLPAi doesn't seemt to mind and Academy has vetted.

They are big on discipline kids as young as Year 1 get detentions and lose their lunch times , all introduced by new DH and no communication with parents if you happen to find out about your child given detention it'd be through them school does not let parents know or communicate this in any way.

Numerous teachers from previous DH, music teacher , class teachers , and receptionist left within a year and some have described and awfully toxic work environment. When music teacher left parents weren't told, there was no music provision for months. This should tell you.enough about their communication with parents.

I'd say look elsewhere even if alternatives aren't great, they will still be better than COLPAI.

Londoncityma · 09/01/2023 07:58

We also were considering COLPAI. What other schools did you look at?

Wasntmeanttobethishard · 09/01/2023 11:38

Hugh myddleton, st Luke’s, prior western and more lands. Hugh myddleton would be our only preference over the other options. They seem to have excellent provision for kids at both ends of the learning curve ie sen and more able/ gifted/ HLP. They also have an great music provision where kids learn instruments from year 1. Colpai don’t do instruments until year 4 I think. HM have good connections with outside organisations providing free tutoring for kids to stretch them, catch them up, go greater depth etc. HM have good outdoor space and a forest school. COLPAI has concrete and despite the building works being out of their hands, they haven’t even put in temporary equipment and won’t utilise local playgrounds as other space limited schools like Dallington do. HM have good comms in place where staff respond to parents by end of school day, COLPAI give themselves 7days but I know for a fact that parents emails are often ignored - what I hear Is that COLPAI send loads of group call emails about things like attendance, uniform, catering, housekeeping type things. I think because COLPAI has the outstanding Ofsted and draws in many professional families, that that impacts how the school is viewed. Plus, as I said in OP, their PR is brilliant. But since posting, I’ve heard that some families get preferential treatment by certain (senior) staff members. If this is true, and I’d like to know if it really is, I’d like to know what this looks like and why it happens. COLPAI is our closest school. I’m so confused and torn! Had no idea school choice was this hard!

OP posts:
Bomblebee · 09/01/2023 14:37

I have DC at colpai. Wish I didn’t! in a way, we are luckier than most as we were part of the first cohorts when the school opened. It was fabulous provision back then. And the school operated like a real family. Lots of personalised attention etc. As the school has grown, that’s changed. But as first cohort, that family sort of attention or parent/ senior staff relationship hasn’t been lost for us. It has lower down the school as staff are clearly stretched.

Communication has always been somewhat lacking. I do have to chase information. The group calls are numerous but individual contact specific to your child is hit and miss; mostly miss. A couple of examples I know of: Fine motor issue affecting progress/ attainment? Parents only told of concern at end of academic year. Injury during playtime? Child told parent themselves. Mental health issues stemming from school? School didn’t notice, parents had to highlight and chase (as school denied any wrong doing/ direct impact on this).

Playtimes have been cut shorter to cram more into the curriculum. And then the children are made to practise lining up as a key stage during that 15 minute break because, for eg, one child failed to line up silently, or lines weren’t straight enough or silent straight lines didn’t happen quickly enough. The COLPAI crowd will be brilliant at queuing for a bus!! 😆

Preferential treatment does happen. There are some senior staff and board members who do need their egos stroked. It’s a tricky game of raising genuine concern without causing offence which will inevitably lead to the cold shoulder. I’m lucky with the type of child my DC is I think and haven’t had to really question the school. A close friend got the silent treatment for a year from one senior teacher because they (rightly) questioned a practice directly affecting their DC. If I didn’t see it, I wouldn’t have believed it. 😳

Some families are greeted with hugs, and kisses to the tops of children's heads, photos are shared and enjoyed on phones between some staff, parents and bird members. Others, the senior staff don’t even know their names! Parents and staff have be seen and heard gossiping about others in the playground - same small group of both. Parents and staff within this gossip group have also been seen sharing cabs home after school.

My DC is lucky enough to have been celebrated for their achievements both in and out of school in the school newsletter. It’s great for their self worth and confidence but I have friends who’s children’s achievements have been ignored and I have seen the direct impact this has. Then I feel guilty for my DC being acknowledged and celebrated. And the children do talk about different things in school and it seems to be the same children getting special jobs within school. You know, being a special helper, being able to visit the deputy’s office, given a responsibility in class. Little things. Not something that bothers my DC now but it matters to some children.

The policies aren’t really followed. Not consistently anyway. And some, the way they say they meet it, well it’s a bit of a stretch of the imagination.

The parents on the whole try really hard to create a great school community. There are some who prefer to be in cliques but I imagine this is like any school. My DC has a really lovely bunch of friends and the parents of those friends are super! We support each other as much as we can like taking it in turns to collect from school or take to after school activities. And there are some real gems of teachers too who really see each child but this isn’t the case for all. Perhaps senior staff influence? Or school culture? Couldn’t say.

The new building is beautiful! The playground is lacking but this is down to developers not running to schedule on the adjacent residential tower. The children really could do with more physical stimulation and outlet and unfortunately I’m not sure my DC will ever get a proper playground before they leave primary! We meet their needs outside school.

Londoncityma · 13/01/2023 20:57

What did you end up doing?

Londoncityma · 14/01/2023 12:00

These sound quite concerning. We were going to put COLPAI as first choice, now I’m not sure. Any comments about surrounding schools? St Lukes, Moreland?

IIN16 · 15/01/2023 09:38

I think Hugh Middleton is the better choice. I also know families at Morelands whose children are happy and thriving.

Londoncityma · 15/01/2023 09:50

HM is a bit too far away unfortunately.
Morelands is in with St Luke’s as a joint academy. Moreland had a great space.
just hoping we are not missing out by not putting COLPAI

IIN16 · 15/01/2023 16:32

You need to find the right fit for your child and your family. At COLPAI there is no specialist PE teacher, at Hugh and most other locals they have one so P.E. provision is below par. After school places are like gold dust and they also start at 8 30 a.m. Also barely any school trips only 1 or 2 last year.
No TAs in classroom at COLPAI so a teacher alone with 30 kids most others have a teacher and TA, sometimes even two TAs where SEN requires it. Do PM me if you want to. I'd say COLPAI looks good, however it's all surface level.

Wasntmeanttobethishard · 15/01/2023 20:46

We didn’t list COLPAI. Took our chances with the other local schools because of music, PE, outdoor space, forest schools, trips, provision of stretch for more able kids and pastoral care. Seriously considered St Paul’s cathedral school for a moment but can’t afford yet. We even thought about homeschooling and haven’t ruled it out for good. Colpai felt like a sales job and we were impressed with the sell but it just didn’t feel right. One too many alarm bells speak8ng to those with first hand experience. Now we wait and see! Maybe we should move 😆

OP posts:
trustalot · 02/03/2023 19:30

You are being misled with a lot of complaints from parents in COLPAI who have no experience of the alternatives. The early cohort was highly selective as they were the most highly engaged group so the peer group was self selecting. Prior Weston has a good peer group but dreadful teaching, Hugh Mydlleton dreadful peer group and excellent teaching. As COLPAI is swamped with middle class they are highly cliquey but why you would care is another matter, its the quality of their kids you are after. The parents are all decent people having said this, and I am a dad amongst mums and generally unkempt.

I have never heard of a discipline problem at COLPAI and it is not overbearing because the kids are generally respectful by default. I am unaware of any discipline directed at my child but as they move to general intake I am not sure what problems are being experienced in lower years. They had a very very easy job with their initial intake but given other comments more curiosity my be warranted on my behalf.

Kim the head teacher, I think she is a strong manager and makes very strong hiring decisions. She has done a wonderful job and I have generally supported her versus parents with fashionable/utopian ideas multiple times, since I am aware of the alternatives and they are not. She takes criticism poorly but that is her right and I have crossed her so I know both sides of her personality. All I can say with certainty is when that first cohort takes their SATS they will blow all local competition out of the water

At the end of the day my kid is not particularly stretched but she passed eleven plus with no preparation when I gave her a sample test recently Her attitude to learning is exactly where it should be from a private school outside of music provision and I have no concerns on her friend group. Your kid will coast but also not be subject to the constant disruption in class of a child centric approach. Expect a more traditional authoritarian approach and if you want more liberal chaotic go for prior weston with its Barbican heavy intake compensating for the sloppy teaching.

dashmummy · 04/03/2023 15:04

I must say I really don’t recognise a fair bit of this thread. I find COLPAI to be a marvellous little school that’s very focussed on kindness, celebrates difference and proudly commits to high standards for behaviour. Admittedly, parents who have a permissive attitude on manners and behaviour may find they are more comfy elsewhere.

We have only experienced the staff as really lovely so I’m a bit confused by some of the snide comments above. I have local friends keen to join COLPAI who are on the waitlist for in year admission so by all means send your child to Hugh Middleton lol.

AugustLandmesser · 05/03/2023 01:20

It never fails to amuse me how much London parents will fight tooth or nail to argue about “the best” school and gossip about every little detail…in hopes of somehow winning the magic lottery when it comes to their DC’s education.

There are no “best” schools and even if a school was simply brilliant in every way when your child joined since they were four years old, schools change. Heads and staff leave and so do families.

Every family’s view of a school is subjective and prospective parents considering a school should do their research and talk to a wide variety of local parents about their experiences. What’s helpful about Mumsnet is that parents can express their honest opinions without fear of repercussions for their children. So for whatever it’s worth…take the write up below as you wish. Just don’t try to use the “You must be wrong because I disagree” counter-argument here because that type of a retort is rarely helpful to anyone.

If you look at the facts about COLPAI, it’s OFSTED “Outstanding” and that seems to matter to a lot of local area parents, who are mostly a mix of professionals and creatives that have hopes for their children to go to independent secondary schools with some sort of a bursary.

You can imagine what it mean, both good and not so good, to be in a parent cohort such as above. Competition is latent and everyone is somehow trying to curry favour with the school to help their child get ahead for the next stage of education. Is there a potential conflict that the very engaged Chair of the Board of Governors (COG) is also teaching French at the school AND she’s also the Safeguarding Lead for the Governors? And the mother of the Deputy Head? Confused already? Try to keep up!

On the surface, COLPAI does seems to be all about kindness and charity and Insta-ready new facilities, but it has its fair amount of discord and intrigue beyond the superficial.

Talk to the parents who have left for Lyceum, City Prep, Charterhouse, St Paul’s Cathedral School, and other local states like Prior Weston and Hugh Myddleton and you’ll hear again and again stories of repeated clashes with the Head, COG, who both seem to be highly defensive at the slightest whiff of dissent and will simply ignore or even make up rules(!) to keep parents’ concerns at bay. There are also numerous examples of the Deputy Head’s lack of experience (LGBTQ+ slide show video for Pride Month sent on Google Classroom during remote learning to KS1 children without notice to parents and with no live teacher guidance) and a dismissive “I know best” attitude at times by the Deputy Head towards not only parents but also individual children.

There’s also an undercurrent of intensive emotional pressure on the children at times to perform when it counts for the school. On standardised exams of course (the Head is an administrator who knows how to continuously tick all the checkboxes to keep up its official ratings), but also in front of numerous glittering “elite” of Governors who somehow managed to all show up at the school in the middle of the pandemic, unmasked, for photo ops with the State school children. Yet parents were not allowed to enter the school building to see their children’s work throughout that time. For some reason, it feels like the school and the children are beholden to generosity of the Governors, like charity cases from the almshouse.

This is a school run by a Head and somehow manoeuvred by a COG / teacher that is focused on achieving top marks for THE SCHOOL as its first Reception cohort is about to enter their year 6 before the 11+. Parents who raise any concerns for THE CHILDREN are often brushed aside or will find themselves being given an increasingly cold shoulder accentuated by occasional snide remarks to put them in their place, less the parents start to get ideas above their station.

Which makes it all the more puzzling why the school (likely with the backing of the Governors) decided to hire a SENCO, who was the former head of an Essex school and let go because of financial irregularities. (All news in the public domain so no secret. Police declined to press charges in the end.) Everyone deserves a second chance of course, but personal reviews from parents who’ve had interactions with the SENCO have largely not been positive. Quite the opposite it seems. Lots of whispers amongst parents of SEN children (both “gifted” and special needs children) about wanting to leave for other schools because they are unable to get support from a proper SENCO who is up to standard. Families have recently left as a result.

All this even before the lack of a playground, a school nurse, regular sports provisions, the public “shame without a name” approach about parents who run afoul of the school on one of its 65+ policy docs listed on its website, over communication about matters such a “home-school agreement” that requires children to do as they are asked “by any adult within school”, the younger children who are actually fearful of losing time from their precious two ten-minute play breaks a day if they don’t line up properly in the hallways, the laughably blatant favouritism by the senior leadership with some of the children and individual parents. It all stinks a bit of lack of experience and/or confidence on the part of Head and Deputy Head in knowing how to establish a successful school environment, while still allowing children to BE CHILDREN.

On the plus side, the active and well-organised PTA raises £6k-8k a year for whatever the school needs. (One year it was chairs for the new assembly hall.) Parents feel like they are continuously being asked to give donations at times, but most seem happy to give. So one way or another, parents will end up paying for the privilege of being allowed to attend a COLAT state primary like COLPAI.

There are also some really caring teachers and other staff members dotted about the school, but they are also careful to not step too much out of step with the Head and COG less they become targets of snide critiques or even harsh treatment themselves. The pressure on the staff is really palpable at times to deliver academic testing results and they are stretched to nearly breaking point. You can see it on their young faces, particularly as nearly all of the teaching staff are in their 20’s and early 30’s.

On the whole, the children at COLPAI are brilliantly well behaved. These are lovely children from caring families across a mix of social-economic backgrounds. The children are, however, in a highly pressurised and intense environment at COLPAI to do as they are told and not make a single step out of line. Literally.

So why should you choose COLPAI? Mainly because you don’t want to miss out on an “OFSTED Outstanding” school for your DC. You like the modern looking building design and aren’t fussed about the lack of real play space or much playtime while your DC’s are in school for 7 hours a day. You find Heads who subscribe to Katharine Birbalsingh‘s “neo-strict” approach from the Victorian era reassuringly retro and you feel certain you won’t ever feel gaslighted if you’re treated as an overreacting, overstepping, lower-class annoyance for daring to email and ask why your young child was kept in from playtime and made to complete a “reflection” form for not staying seated properly during lunchtime.

Clearly there’s still much to be lauded about COLPAI and its methods or else it would not be “OFSTED Outstanding” so quickly after being established. You can read about all those elements in the “official” OFSTED report.

If you do choose COLPAI, choose it with your eyes open, all the while knowing there really is no “best” school without tradeoffs.

LonParent · 12/03/2023 17:59

I am very surprised to read this chain about COLPAI. It is not our experience at all. It sounds like a very personal grudge!

I have children attending COLPAI, one starting in one of the earliest cohorts. It is an outstanding school in every way and the staff go way above and beyond.

There are a number of entries above categorically untrue, at least one of which is defamatory.

All families are different, and if you find this school is not right for you and yours, then investigate other options in the area -- please do not spread untrue rumours and lies as this is not helpful to the COLPAI community.

IIN16 · 12/03/2023 22:35

I agree some of the comments above are highly problematic I.e "dreadful peer group". Yikes! No plebs, or chocolate coloured kids in the wonderfully "middle class" and clique COLPAI 🙈

And then there are the facts about their deputy head leaving, closely followed by music teacher and a few other teachers who are all at the lovely Grasmere School, I believe. Their head of Phonics who was also amazing left. It seems that anyone good cannot wait to get out of there or at least since the new deputy and SENCO took over. The Police investigation is a fact and a Google away for anyone who believes it to be "untrue".

Tosh101 · 13/03/2023 08:54

I also have DC in COLPAI and she's very happy there. Some of the above seem to be the moans of parents whose children won't or didn't get the individual attention you typically "pay" for. If you don't like what you hear about the school go elsewhere. There are a lot of happy kids and parents. Ofsted don't seem to share the concerns.

Rainbow1990 · 13/03/2023 13:02

Unfortunately all the negative comments ring true.

We’ve had DC at COLPAI since it opened and supported the school all the way through.

Regrettably, what used to be a great school has morphed into an overly strict and political environment with a clear trend of favoritism and different treatment for the in-crowd vs everyone else.

(Just as an example: COG Mary is mom to deputy head Emily whom she should have oversight over, and Emily’s godson attends the school…)

I don’t know if this stark change in ethos is by design / decided by COLA or if the school leadership are struggling as the number of pupils has grown, but either way COLPAI today IMO is not a nurturing and supportive environment for children — unless you fancy a throwback to discipline from Victorian times above all else.

Also factually true re: investigations and families leaving / voting with their feet (just Google/ask around), not to mention the very high levels of staff turnover which does NOT seem to be the norm elsewhere. (My sisters’ kids attend 2 other London primaries)

We ourselves are waiting for property chain to complete and will take DC out then. Sadly, we can’t wait for the day to come as we have completely lost faith in the school’s leadership…

sweetbaby123 · 13/03/2023 13:31

I have seen all the comment about COLPAI and people choosing other islington schools. I have currently one child with SEN and feels that my child needs are not met. Their reception experience was awful but this year is better. Going to have my second child go there but will closely monitor my second child performance very closely as he is very gifted. More to be done with the music department and really expected more in this regards to performing arts. School does not have much space for outdoor activities and therefore have to find extra cirriculum.

My first child felt ignored by some staff members but can say teaching assistants do an amazing job. I believe the school wish to feel they offer the same as private school but cannot be on the same level.

If second child not happy in first year ats school ,will consider the homeschool option.

Pinkheart321 · 13/03/2023 14:56

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

Wasntmeanttobethishard · 14/03/2023 18:37

@trustalot what do you mean by ‘the first cohort was highly selective’ and now there’s a move to ‘general intake’ lower down the school? Is this about socioeconomic status or academic ability?

If the parents are cliquey, wouldn’t that make the kids cliquey too?

Does the school meet the needs of those that require more challenge for their well-being? Or is coasting the only option?

OP posts:
Wasntmeanttobethishard · 14/03/2023 23:28

@Pinkheart321 your vitriolic and righteous response speaks volumes. 😳

IMO it would’ve been more helpful to share how your DC’s different needs have been met.
Share examples that qualify your statement that the SENCO ‘does a great job identifying children with needs and making sure nobody gets missed.’ That would be very helpful to prospective parents with both diagnosed and suspected ND / SEN / HLP.

As parents of a DME child it’s been really important for us to not just base our school decision on gut feel and PR but also to have some inside perspective / first hand experience to consider. Ours has been neither an easy nor simple educational or diagnostic journey so far. The realities of school provisions are not lost on us.

DC won’t fall below the government’s minimum academic benchmark so won’t fall into the ‘at risk/ priority’ category outlined in most schools equality policy. That comes with its own worries for us as parents.

Pinkheart321, perhaps peruse the plethora of research available on the impact and importance of play, sports and movement on children’s ability to focus and learn in the classroom before you dismiss parents making it a priority within the school day. Also how ND and HLP children present vs what goes on internally for them, how they struggle / suffer / mask. How a school’s behaviour management approach impacts kids differently - some it suits, some it damages. *Our DC is a ‘model pupil’ with impeccable behaviour and respect (taught by parents in the home FYI)

We’re not looking for a perfect school, just one which will meet our darling DC needs, where she will be happy and thrive. One which will work and communicate with us despite our DC not operating below benchmark or her additional needs not presenting as a dominant barrier. I don’t think we are any different to any other parent.

COLPAI promises a lot. We wondered if it really delivered and how much substance there was to playground garnered perspectives…

🤔

OP posts:
Pinkheart321 · 15/03/2023 19:11

@Wasntmeanttobethishard The majority of my post was targeted at the tone of the whole thread and not to you in particular however when my child has been mentioned above by an existing parent then as a reaction by any parent, I will not take that lying down therefore feel free to critic my response and call it as you please.

I see that you haven’t responded or criticised the posts mentioning specific children. I also find it very patronising telling me to do research especially as a parent who has been living with a child who has special needs and understand the importance of meeting specific needs.

As for my experience with the SENCO, I’m not prepared to expand on or breach our personal experience nor that of parents who also have children suspected ND/officially diagnosed SEN, certainly not on a forum such as this. All I’m prepared to say is that I have met 1-2-1 with 4 other SENCOs from the surrounding schools and found the one at HM to be the absolute worst.

All parents want the best for their child but I am a realist living in the present. COLPAI is a state school with limited hours in the day and employ their limited resources appropriately. The majority of parents I know want learning to be the priority over the school day and not sports as they personally select and participate in those in their own time. Inner London schools in general are not great for sports IMO and therefore most parents who find this a priority send their children either outer London or outside of the capital completely.

As a parent you need to find the right fit for your family however everyone here needs to be realistic as well with their expectations of any school and there is not one size fits all. If you don’t like a school either don’t send them there or move them to a more suitable education setting nevertheless it is morally wrong to hold personal grudges and be vindictive against staff and other families at the school unless you have walked in their shoes.

MumPositive · 16/03/2023 20:23

If you are so unhappy with COLPAI, take your DC somewhere else. Plenty of places at other City and islington State Schools. Why stay?

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