Moving from independent school to Grammar school after GCSES

[Ontheredeye]

My DS is currently in year 11 at boarding school and we are considering moving him to a Grammar school next year. We are in Kent so have some good options, this depends on him getting a place of course.

The fees were always a stretch for us and if I'm honest I regret going down that road in the first place. Has anyone moved their DC to a state school after GCSES? .

I haven't mentioned it to DS yet and I'm also not sure how to bring it up with the school. We will need to give a terms notice at Easter. He would then have to sit his exams which would be very awkward for him. Otherwise it would mean paying almost £15,000 for a term after he leaves.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

In my area (SW London) there's lots of movement at sixth form, both from State to Private and vice versa. I also know a fair few DCs who have left boarding for day schools (state and private). No awkwardness, all the schools know it goes on and are happy to write reports etc if needed.
I know a lot of school and college have already closed their applications so you may want to move quickly.

Thank you @notputtingtheheatingonyet .We have a little time but not long. I will start the application.

@Ontheredeye it is quite common to give notice at the end of the Michaelmas term especially as most State 6th form applications have to be in by mid January. As PP have said, there is a lot of movement between, boarding, day and State schools at 6th form. At a friend's DC's independent school in Herts/London, the entire Year 11 (bar one) left for a variety of schools, including grammar and boarding. There shouldn't be any awkwardness, but you know your school. FYI, (not suggesting this is your reasoning at all) your DS won't get an easier ride with university applications by swapping to a grammar school, grammars are treated the same as an independent.

@Soma My DS's school is what they call on here a big name and I don't think they will be great. They are not very forthcoming with predicted grades and are actively trying to increase the size of their 6th form . DS has got very little out of the school and I need to sleep at night so I can't justify another two years.

University applications don't come into it but I do think that he will have a better outcome at home. Being at the bottom of the pecking order is not a good place to be imo. Hopefully they will think nothing of it.

Masses of movement for 6th form around us. Some move from local independent to local academy as their A level results are markedly better. Some move from academy to sixth form colleges as they have more interesting courses / more relevant for their career directions - ie the best sporting facility for rugby and riding Hartbury is on our doorstep in Gloucester so children with sports interests might move there. Some move from local independent and local academy to board for 2 years as a sort of finishing school/club membership.
Don't move if it is for contextual offers at University as OP said it won't make a difference if it as a grammar and most Universities look at GCSE's as they know a tiny minority of parents move just for this reason.
Good luck, I am sure your DC will flourish.

@Ontheredeye it does sound like you need to move him. How does he feel about changing? How does the grammar compare to say your local day schools? I wanted one of mine to go to a state sixth form, but they resisted and moved to another independent.

My 2 went to a Kent grammar and there was always movement in both directions at 6th form. Mine went the other way from grammar to boarding at 6th form. Do what’s best for you, your finances and your child.

@Soma the Grammar school would be the best option for us I think. I will also apply for a less selective 6th form just in case. DS will be ok but I think that the next 2 terms will be difficult.
It would be so much easier if it was a day school.

When it's all over I think DS will breathe a huge sigh of relief as will we.

@Burpeea thank you, that's very kind of you.

@Ontheredeye Good luck, just remember that your DS will have to write a personal statement for his State applications.

At my DC Private school there is no 6th form so quite a few go to Grammar for A levels

My three sons are at grammar in TW in Kent - there is a fair amount of movement in both directions throughout the school, but it's really not that uncommon at sixth form for boys to arrive from indies - parents trying to game the UCAS system perhaps😉, even though they take postcode and where you sat your GCSEs into account, so it doesn't really help. [That is said firmly tongue in cheek by the way].

The current school ought to be understanding of "we just can't afford it for another two years". However, I wonder whether there is any mileage in asking the admin office whether it can be kept confidential that he is leaving? There's no real need for his teachers to know, beyond anyone who needs to write a reference on his sixth form application for elsewhere.

We are definitely not trying to do that @Panicmode1 , but I imagine some may.The boys at my DS's think going to a state school is the worst thing that could possibly happen to you , I kid you not ! They live in the most bizarre bubble, if I had our time again I would never have send him there. As it stands I just want to try to make his 6th experience better for all of us.

@lanthanum It's more the housemaster and matron , they will have to know.

This is really common here (grammar school area). A lot of parents intentionally do this because of concerns of Oxbridge preference for state school applicants. So private to 16 and then state grammar for last 2 years so they then get classed as “state school pupil”.

@ontheredeye I was like that. I didn't meet any state educated children until I went to uni and thought everyone had pools and ponies and big houses 🙈 because we lived in such a bubble.of privilege. I was determined that our children wouldn't be like that.

That said, DS1 is one of 15 from the year who got into Oxford or Cambridge this year, so not all state schools are bad 😉

@Panicmode1 You made a very wise decision.
Luckily DS is very grounded so I think he will really enjoy 6th form. The next two terms will be tricky though.

Congratulations to your DS 👏, that is a fantastic achievement!

It's very different now with social media, orchestras, sports clubs etc. state and independent school DC mix all the time and often go to the same parties aged 16 - 18.

Movement for 6th form is quite normal and current attendance does not mean your child will have a place for 6th form if he fails to get their required grades for GCSE, so don’t feel too guilty about telling the school. Make sure you follow the exact terms of the notice required or you will end up being liable for the terms fees in September. However once you have given notice, there is no safety net if your DS fails to get the grades required for the Grammar…. Or if he doesn’t settle at the new school. However, having gone through this last year with my DC who left a super selective to attend another super selective (with a better facility in a certain subject) that required 8 or 9 in all 4 A levels and the rest 7’s… there is a lot of added pressure on them that I didn’t foresee about ‘what if’ during exam time. I wouldn’t spring this on your DS he may be looking forward to some 6th form privileges/concessions/activities at his school that now won’t come to pass. Plus he has to leave his friends. That said, financial issues are a reality so you need to be honest with him about the situation if staying is not an option plus he’ll likely have missed all of the open days for any of the schools you are considering? It all happens really quickly this term so I think you need to have a very honest conversation with him at half term about your plans. You also need to be prepared that some DC deliberately tank exams to avoid changing schools that parents have chosen for them and they don’t want to move (this happened to one parent at my DC former school). Schools normally only take a reference if your DC have passed round 1 of the application process but the school will know you are applying. I sent a note to my DC HOY before the new school took a reference explaining that whilst we loved the school, the x dept at x school offered more opportunity in the subject my DC was most interested in which seemed like the right thing to do.

With respect to the comment that your move is ‘gaming’ UCAS, most top universities are clear that attendance years 7-11 at a private school and then attendance at a state 6th form leaves the applicant still in the ‘attended a private school’ camp. Grammars are also not considered to be ‘normal’ state schools. So unless you live in a postcode which has a low university attendance rate (and grammar catchments/areas don’t tend to facilitate this), it is pretty difficult to ‘game’ a UCAS application.

I’d talk to your son at the earliest opportunity and wish you all the best.

i’d also add that your DC’s current school needs him to do well at GCSE for their league tables so it shouldn’t be awkward for him to sit the exams and it wouldn’t be in their interests to do anything other than to get him to the best grades he can.

I’m sorry you’ve had a poor experience with the current school, sometimes it’s easy to get swept along in the educational arms race. I deeply regret my DC prep school choice (largely ignored until it was clear they were significantly brighter than school had realised), however they thrived at the next school and this current one (they got the required grades for 6th form 😅)

What will you do if he doesn't get into the Grammar?

So unless you live in a postcode which has a low university attendance rate (and grammar catchments/areas don’t tend to facilitate this)

Some areas of Kent are very deprived but still have a grammar school system. Some parents really stretch themselves for private school. Even in the more favoured West Kent there are roads which would tick the widening participation box. Often universities will consider for WP if either the GCSEs or A levels are at a state school on their list. Grammar schools are not usually on that list.

@Ontheredeye do consider the different level of support which might be offeed in a sixth form at a grammar. It does depend on the subject/ teacher but classes of 20-25 are not unheard of and a grammar school might move at a fair pace, leaving more time at the end for revision. If the private school are giving lots of extra support he might struggle to adapt in a large class. Support needs to be proactively sought by the student. It will be good preparation for university, but there will be less hand holding. It might be worth getting a tutor initially, if high A level grades are crucial, to ease him through the transition and to ensure that he can cope with less support.

Having said that if he is not happy, 15k a term is a lot of money which can be redirected to university fees and a house deposit. It might be nice for him to live at home for a bit before university.

Thank you for all your advice. DS gets absolutely no hand holding, I think that's exclusively for the big donors at the school or those deemed important socially. He should have the results for Grammar school but we will apply to a less selective 6th form college just in case.

All the best to your DS! As PP have said, there's lots movement for sixth form for a whole range of reasons. If it makes you/your DS feel better, why not suggest he tells his classmates that he's moving because of potential preferential treatment for uni applications?!