GCSE subjects

[Popcicle123]

Hi, looking for advice please

my DD has passed the entrance test to get into our local grammar school (year 7) she is delighted. I’ve been looking through their website and from what I understand, they have to take all 3 sciences and RE at GCSE level. I feel this is going to be very limiting, my DD loves art, French, PE, geography and music she obviously won’t be able to do these if she has to take 3 science options and RE??

Has anyone else come across this and am I allowed to insist she does 2 sciences and not RE (I don’t have a problem with her still doing an RE lesson, just don’t want her to take it as a GCSE)

My husband and I were not educated in England so this is all new to us

Thanks

If that's the timetable you won't have the option of doing something else. Students will be doing those subjects at a set time and you won't be able to pick something else instead.

Usually you can choose to limit coverage of science to a smaller number of GCSEs. So everyone covers all 3 science subjects, just in different levels of detail depending on how many GCSEs they decide to allocate to science.

Does that make sense?

You can enquire now as to whether anyone does so, but it's unlikely, especially as it's a grammar. The expectation will be they are all capable of triple science, since it's a grammar, and RE has to be timetabled anyway so many schools do the GCSE because they have to teach it anyway (though they may do it a year early, DS did). And you can't say you weren't aware if it's on their website...

It's likely she'll get to choose 4 of those options and not all 5 - usually there is a choice of at least one language, at least one humanity, then 1/2 others on top of 3 sciences, maths, english lang and english lit. Though the exact combination will be constrained a bit by timetabling - it may be that art/music/PE isn't a possible combination - but they aren't going to commit to something now for 3 years time.

My year 6 child is about to go to a secondary where RE GSCE is compulsory but I (and my child) were aware of this before applying. I'm not super keen but I have been reassured that it is a proper, interesting, humanities subject that will educate about the history of religion and contains an element of philosophy. My child understood that it was a requirement before applying – but was still keen since friends are going there and it's walkable.

However, in secondary schools (my oldest goes to a different once) you generally find that you only get to properly choose around three or four GCSEs after accounting for all the ones you have to do – science (whether x 2 or x 3), maths, English language and English literature. And that choice often depends on how it's timetabled.

Our comp has RE as compulsory, but it is short course only and sat in y10 so doesn't take a full option slot.

Triple science (3 separate sciences) is likely to be compulsory at a grammar.

it is a proper, interesting, humanities subject that will educate about the history of religion and contains an element of philosophy.

DS found it so - he really enjoyed it, there were a lot of debates apparently. He would also regularly talk about issues raised with his sister (different school, didn't do RE but did philosophy/psychology)

that said it would appear his school have stopped doing it as a GCSE from this year!

You normally only get a choice of 3/4 subjects on top of English x2, Maths and Science (all three disciplines) . Some schools do Compulsory RE (esp if a faith school) otherwise a language and minimum of two others is typical. Triple Science is often taught in same timetable as double in schools where both are offered so you do not "lose" a subject by taking it.

You won't be able to insist - if they have these rules, the timetable will be planned that way.

Also, doing double science would not necessarily "free up" space for another subject - at the schools near here, pupils do either 10 subjects including 3 sciences or 9 subjects including 3 sciences.

Maybe she could study these subjects (eg art and music) outside school?

Sorry, that should be 9 subjects including 2 sciences

The school may well review what they offer as time goes on and whether they have numbers sufficient to run the classes in any given year. Music and PE are very different to study at exam level and may not be as attractive but she could still follow them as interests, PE being compulsory in the timetable until year 11 anyway. Your dd is only 10/11 and her interests will change.

She'll more than likely be able
To do at least three from your list. By the time she's in year 9 what she likes will almost certainly have changed. So don't worry!

Everyone in England (apart from a few private schools and the odd child with SEN) does all three sciences, it is simple a case of whether they study Combined Science (commonly known as double science) or Separate Sciences )commonly known as Triple.

I am personally against compulsory RE as a GCSE as I feel that children should choose subjects based on their interests and abilities. My daughter loved RE as she excelled at essays, constructing arguments etc. My son struggles with extended writing and was not good at RE at all.

It's unusual to go to grammar and not do a language and geography. As for the others, I would expect her to be able to take 2 or 3 out of art/PE/music

You wouldn't be able to insist on a different timetable from the other pupils.

Ds is at a state school, they choose 4 option subjects as science is combined meaning they cover all 3 sciences but only come out with 2 GCSE grades for it which are paired so they can only be the same ie 7,7, or one grade difference 7,6, they cannot have 7,5 for example.

Most grammars or high ability entry schools will do triple as an option however in Ds's school if you are high ability they put you in an accelerator group so you cover triple content and sit the triple without affecting any of the options. Therefore most of the children will sit 9 GCSEs but he and a small group will sit 10.

It might be that the grammar also accelerates content due to all the students coming in as high ability as they have sat an entrance exam. It is something you need to ask. I wholeheartedly agree that just because you love history now does not mean you will love what topics they cover, the way it is taught or the workload between now and year 9.

Find out how many subjects they get to choose for GCSEs and sadly that is the choice she has unless you send her to a different school.

RE is a legal requirement, not the GCSE qualification but the subject.

You can’t insist on anything and they will stuck with the timetable.

A child who loves music, art and PE at 12 doesn’t automatically want or need to study GCSEs in those subjects. If you have a look at the courses they might not be what you’d think. She can still play an instrument and play competitive sport without taking GCSEs in music or PE. I’ve seen lots of comments on here about students who love art not enjoying the GCSE art course.

Lots of schools make RS GCSE compulsory because they have to teach some form of religious education at this age anyway. Your DD will also still do some form of PE during year 10 and 11 because the school have to provide it.

For science, do they offer dual award science? That’s still Biology, Chemistry and Physics but counts as 2 GCSEs.

A child who loves music, art and PE at 12 doesn’t automatically want or need to study GCSEs in those subjects. If you have a look at the courses they might not be what you’d think

Indeed - PE is a huge amount of biology, for example! and she would carry on doing PE as a lesson, even if she didn't do the GCSE.

Thank you all so much. You’ve all been so helpful. Lots of ideas I didn’t think of. She does play an instrument outside of school so it might not be such a big deal if she doesn’t do music, and the same goes for PE

Ask how many GCSE subjects they do in total. They probably do 10. So you have:

English Lit
Engish Lang
Maths
science x 3
Religious Studies

So that is still 3 others that she can choose. Also check whether it is the full GCSE Religious Studies and not the short course (which would free up more time). Also check whether they have to do a MFL.

As others have said, she'll probably be able to choose 2 or 3 subjects at GCSE. I work in a grammar school and most pupils do Triple Science but some do Combined.

One of my kids is starting at a grammar this year which also has triple science and RE as compulsory which we knew when we chose it. The RE they can do as a full or a half. If they do half they get another choice as they do it as extra of you see what I mean. They also have to do a MFL so land up with a maximum of three free choices after all that which is about as many as you ever get in the uk at that age.

A grammar school will normally expect them to do 10 or 11 GCSEs. So science x 3, maths, English - literature and language, RE, creative subject, history or geography, MFL,

Your dd will have plenty of scope. They'll also do PE as it's compulsory. I have to admit that Id not be ecstatic about RE but since they've got to cover it anyway they may as well go a bit deeper and get the qualification.

My dd not at grammar though has just done 11 - English language and Lit, history, French, 3 sciences, maths, further maths, graphic design, drama - which is quite a wide range.

^ To clarify PE GCSE is not compulsory but PE itself is - that said it's quite a popular GCSE at DD's school^^

It's great that she enjoys such a range of subjects, since she'll be doing them all for at least the first two years, possibly three - it would be sad if there were already subjects she didn't want to do! By the time she chooses her options, she'll have an idea of which she wants to take to GCSE, and of course continuing things like music and PE for fun is always an option - in fact sometimes better, as you can do exactly the bits you most enjoy!

I believe that core PE is compulsory and is completely different to GCSE PE.

If the school is a Church of England school then RS is also compulsory.