If I became a teacher, would I be able to not need childcare during school holidays?

[Twiglett]

or is that naive?

(assuming I work in the same LEA as my children's school .. I understand I would need before and after-school care)

You're hijacking your own bloody thread

I would echo MI's warning about going into teaching if it isn't really what you want to do. I know quite a few people who went into it because it was a "convenient career choice" - mostly frustrated academics who couldn't get a permanent position. Some of them loved it and wondered why they hadn't done it years before. Others didn't. And they either failed their PGCE (a huge humiliation) or were miserable within a year.

Do some 'work experience'. Shadow a teacher in whatever area you are interested in and see how it goes. Really, you have to enjoy both the subject you teach and the teaching itself for it to be in any way bearable IMO.

I'm not sure I see it as a vocation (I guess not as I am considering a career change myself), but I do enjoy it very much, and think it is a good fit with my interests, temperament and ideals.

I'm a teacher but at 6th form level. I have 2 kids (3 and 5) and have continued to work albeit part-time after the kids were born except for maternity leave.

I had a while working 3 days a week when the dcs were in nursery then changed to school hours when dc1 started schools so now I work 9 till 2.30. The dcs' school is 5 mins from my work so I can be at the school gates some mornings (have before school club when I can't) and am always at the school gates to pick the dcs up in the afternoon.

My college is particularly family-friendly and so meetings are time-tabled one morning a week and not after college.

The only time I have a problem is during INSET (works out as at least 3 days a year where we don't coincide) and when the dcs school breaks up at mid-day when I don't finish till 2.30.

I used to take dc1 in and sit her at the back of the class sometimes during INSET but I can't do that with the two of them and remember my students are relatively civilised so I couldn't do that in most secondary schools anyway.

Parents' evenings can also be a problem if dp has something on at the same time.

As others have said, I have bucket loads of marking and preparation (more than most teacher since I teach English and sicne I'm at 6th form all my classes are exam classes and coursework classes) and I have to try and fit this in after 7 pm when the kids are in bed and the odd day in the weekend when dp will let me. I also put the kids in holiday club for a day or two during the long holiday so I can get some work done or just sort stuff out round the house.

I agree that compared to lots of jobs where there's limited holiday and you have to work 9-5.30 and may have an hours travelling each day and still might have to bring work home teaching is pretty family friendly. But also agree with others about the workload (which makes you very stressed and long for a job where you could leave to work behind at the end of the day).

Meant to say part-time does make life much, much easier because it's not just about how much you're in school but how much each hour teaching generates in terms of homework.

But it's much easier to negotiate part-time hours when you're established in a job and quite hard to do when you're applying.

There's no doubt that the holidays are a huge bonus, as anyone who has watched non-teacher working mums (and don't shoot me for suggesting that it usually is us mums) trying to sort out holiday cover will know. Covering a few INSET days a year is nothing compared to what they have to organise. But then sometimes (often?) I'd give anything to be able to start work at 9 on a Monday morning, rather than part-way through Sunday afternoon in preparation.

but other jobs you have to take home work too .. I think the hours sound bloody easy to be honest .. no disrespect to teachers of course

yes, if teaching WAS 9-5 with lots of holiday that would be great. But really its 8am-8pm and that's no fun if you have kids.

Mind you that's a private school and they do have more homework to mark and more reports to write (every 3 weeks can you believe).

Twiglett, imo there are 3 types of good teacher: the ones who really like kids (a definite requirement for primary); the ones who have a passion for their subject (more of these found in secondary) or those who are born entertainers and like a captive audience! Or a combo. You need to fall into one category otherwise it isn't the job for you.

If you choose primary there is a lot of prep and you have A LOT of contact time with the same children. In theory pupils are better behaved but are needier. Patience is really a virtue. You need to choose a core subject to specialise in.

At secondary you could teach your degree subject (I need to look back and see precisely what it is!). Discipline is the biggy but tbh is depends on your temperament and the school. My dh teaches the tough nuts and very rarely has a problem as he is both authoritative and funny. I'm a lot quieter personality, gentle humour, encouragement and a passion for my subject are why I have few discipline probs. I do tonnes of out of hours marking, dh virtually none, so choose your subject wisely!

Teaching is poorly paid compared with post grad careers (I earn considerably less than my brother) but not compared to the average population.

You'll need before and after school care for your children - £10-£15 a day per child with a childminder. I'm in at 8am and leave 4-4.30pm, except for the 1 hr weekly meeting & the occasional parents' eve. You work very hard in term time and the offset of that is I do relatively little in the hols.

nobody here has said 8 - 8 . they've said 8 till 5 or 6 with maybe an hour or so marking afterwards .. a day or so during school hols

nope sorry .. far far better terms than my previous employment .. just for far far less money

Had a look at your degree, which you could teach at A Level but you would need a different subject for younger pupils. What are you A Levels in?

Re hours, last week for me was 6am to 12midnight. An unusually tough week admittedly but they happen but offset by a really good week with the students. More representative would be 6am-10pm. The tiring aspect about teaching is a) the out of hours, brain straining marking and prep once the kids have gone to bed b) You need to be at the top of your game from the word go, when in front of a class.

My advice as someone who trains PGCE & GT students when they come into school, is to get in to a school for a few weeks - you'll know then whether it's for you.

Twiglett - go for it!! Why are you prevaricating?!

its not just the hours, the prep etc (which will be more like 7.30-6/7 in school then 2-3 hours more at home whilst training and a NQT) it the fact that you also have to work with a class full of kids and take the flack for all society's ills too

Twiglett, I agree with you that teaching has far better terms than the business world. I moved to teaching in my mid thirties, having spent many years working as a senior manager in various companies. I and the people who worked for me nearly always worked 50-60 hours per week, often more. We worked in a 24/7 industry which meant duty management at the weeknds and over nights (at no extra pay/time off in lieu). We always were contactable by phone and had 4 weeks holiday per year.

Bloody hell, teaching is a doddle after that. I don't have to be in until 8, I get to leave by 5.30 sometimes, I can plan my work when I want to, I often get time to sit and have a coffee in the staff room, I get PPA,customers don't ring me in the middle of the night with emergencies, and I get 13 weeks holiday a year. What's not to like? It's far less stressful than alot of jobs.

Twig - if the training is what you were realy good at can you not do that as a consultant? You must still know loads of people in your old industry who might employ you? I know in my old insustry we used to employ loads of outside people to come in and do training - personal development stuff, workplace skills (I was taught how to negotiate by one of the senior trade union negotiators during the miners strike - not that that was a great advert for his skills). And you could balance doing full days in London (when I'm sure dh could pick up the childcare) with days at home preparing materials. And just not work in school holidays

will repeat what others and I have said a few times now - get into school, see what you think, then find a course and apply. You will have to do this to be accepted onto most courses now anyway

my dad was a secondary school teacher and HOD - he taught for about 30 years overall. Now works in a shop after taking early retirement on health grounds. He recently apologised to me and my brother for 'never being there' while we were growing up. And although he is a wonderful dad, in a way it's true. He was always either at work, doing marking, lesson preparing or asleep - often on the sofa without having taken his coat off. It is true that my parents never needed childcare. Mum worked evenings and weekends, dad covered school holidays. But he was, in my memory, always working, and always tired. I think it is a very draining career emotionally. Agree with everyone who has said you need to want to do the job, not just have the holidays.

I don't agree that teaching is unfamily friendly. I work part time as a joint head of a unit for Hearing impaired children(attached to a junior school). My head teacher is very understanding and if the dds are ill or there is an assembly/ sports day he positively encourages us to go as he values support from our parents and thinks he would be a hypocrite not to let us support our own dcs.

Actually I have worked for 3 other heads within the same school (been there 18 years!)and they have all been really good too.
I suppose I'm lucky that I am able to work part time as my prep is done when the dds are at school. Agree that teaching is a vocation- not to be gone into for the sake of convenience

I've been surprised to read of people leaving before 5.30pm. Which schools are these? Any jobs going? If ever I do leave before I'm chucked out by the caretaker, I'm weighed down by boxes of all the stuff that can be done at home. I think it largely depends on the culture of the school in question however. In mine, whilst no-one has ever mentioned directed hours, they don't need to because we're all self-motivated. Oh, and there's probably an OFSTED imminent.....

The only plus teaching holds for families is the holidays. I think particularly if you want any kind of promotion teaching is not family friendly. I love my job but i am not sure if i would choose this career if i had my choices again especially if i wanted a family. If you are choosing teaching for convenience you will need to choose your school carefully. I can pick out the teachers in my school who are in the job for convenience and they are all no the verge of breakdowns or counting down to retirement.

Ah for me it is far more money so I think I will love that side too.

one option is supply work. my mum did this when I was a teenager - very little preparation or responsibility, no work at all in the holidays. the lack of responsibility can be a plus ( no prep; no hassle) but it can also be a minus - less job satisfaction. you also need to be a very good and confident teacher to walk into a class of 30 kids you've never met (having done no prep) and just get on with it. also - obviously, it's less secure and to maximise the amount you get you need to be willing to drop everything when the phone rings at 8am. but it suited my mum down to the ground and she spent about 15 years doing it very nearly full-time.

I'm in school tommorrow anyway talking to Year 2s and I'm a school governor so not completely naive

I know I'm prevaricating but it is because I have bought into the 'you must have a vocation to teach' concept and if I'm truly honest and look deep within I don't