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Original poster

Would you pay for private education when there is a very good state alternative?

660 replies

alfiesbabe · 12/01/2008 14:29

I know this is a contentious issue, but am really interested to hear other people's views. Our situation: have just moved DS (Yr 9)from private to local state school. (His choice). He had been on a scholarship as a chorister, and finished in the choir, but money wasn't an issue as DH teaches in the private school so we paid peanuts for fees. DS is really happy and likes the wider range of students. He is in top sets for most subjects and reports back that the work is more challenging and behaviour better than was the case in his previous class. He gets less homework, but to my mind what he does get is more relevant (eg in maths he might get set 5 questions to test that he has understood a teaching point, whereas at the private school he'd be set several pages of the same type of question). Results wise, the private school had 85% 5 A-C passes, the state school had 72%. Bearing in mind the state school has the full ability range, whereas the private school is selective, this smacks to me of better teaching in the state school. It seems like a very small difference considering parents are paying about 12K a year for the private school. A-level results are similar - statistically the private school is a little better, but not by much. The private school offers more in the way of music and sport; but DS has gone as far as he wants with music for the moment and isnt bothered about sport. I'm not looking for validation of our choice - we know we've made the right decision - but I'm left with this feeling of 'What were we actually paying school fees for?' The experience as a chorister was valuable, but I can't get my head round parents who pay the full whack, specially if their child isnt musical or sporty. I'm aware that our local state school is outstanding and we're very lucky in this respect. So.... why WOULD anyone pay for private in this situation?

OP posts:
kaz33 · 14/01/2008 19:41

B***ks - I am the product of working class self made high achieving parents who were never there and myself have a 2.1 from a top class university, law degree and used to have a top city legal job.

But would I class myself as having had a successful life over the last 30 years or so. I have self medicated my underlying depression with alcohol, cannabis, class A drugs and sex from the age of 16 to 30 and yet achieved this high academic success. Only now at the age of 38 am I starting to unravel the threads of my childhood.

It is very dangerous to equate success with academic achievement, by the parents absence and the emphasis on academic success you are playing a dangerous games with your childrens mental health. They might be compliant and passing all those god damn exams, just like me. But be careful they might end like me

Judy1234 · 14/01/2008 19:56

That's why I don't pressure the children and I talk to them. You can do that whilst working - many mother and fathers achieve that. It's much more important than whether they get to Oxbridge etc. Schools usually in the private sector that look after the whole person have lots of sport, good food, even happiness lessons can help ensure that too. Neglect whatever school you are in is never going to be a good thing.

Yes, as gf says that seems like success from the state system but may be children the product of that wouldn't also have the over all patina, manner, accent, class really, hobbies, be into the hobbies you'd like them to be into etc etc that perhaps they get plus those academics at some private schools.

Childhood is certainly very important. as the daughter of a psychiatrist I know that more than many. But in some ways relief from poverty and a high income give you choices to nurture your child appropriately. I know a lot of people pressured unduly by their parents and it often back fires. Look at that poor lawyer who killed himself (at the Tate was it?). There was certainly speculation oin the press about the pressure his father (well known in sport I think) might have put on him.

But you can achieve good mental health be happy go to a private school and get good exam results and you can go to a dreadful school and never have mental health problems. Genetics plays a part too in propensity to get depression.

kaz33 · 14/01/2008 20:04

Sorry Xenia, my parents talked to me - I can talk anyone round in circles and have a mean golf swing. Nor do I have a propensity for depression, I have been fighting it all my life.

What I talk about is being emotionally absent, allowing your kids to make mistakes, get angry and decide if they so want that they don't want to a hot shot banker/lawyer/cityhotshot just like mum.

I think you are peddling a very dangerous fantasy that it doesn't matter if both parents are absent. Doesn't matter who is there, mum, dad, grandparents but someone needs to be there.

mrsruffallo · 14/01/2008 20:07

I suppose if you can afford to pay you should-not because you will get a better education but because maybe someone who can't afford school fees needs the place

NKF · 14/01/2008 20:16

What if you don't want your children to mix with all sorts of people? After all, for many people it's the "all sorts" that makes them desperate for private education.

mrsruffallo · 14/01/2008 20:19

I suppose the good thing in mixing with people different to yourself is that you may see through generalisations and be a more tolerant individual.

NKF · 14/01/2008 20:22

Well you might but most of us don't go looking to mix with people who are so different from us.

mrsruffallo · 14/01/2008 20:23

Why not? It's a big world out there

NKF · 14/01/2008 20:24

Sure it is but don't most of us end up with friends who are quite like us. Or at least congenial to us.

NKF · 14/01/2008 20:24

Sure it is but don't most of us end up with friends who are quite like us. Or at least congenial to us.

rantinghousewife · 14/01/2008 20:24

Maybe you'd feel more at home on Netmums then

NKF · 14/01/2008 20:25

I come on Mumsnet because it's full of people who are different to me and also lots of people know loads of different information. That's not the same as making friends.

rantinghousewife · 14/01/2008 20:26

You didn't say friends, you said mix though.

NKF · 14/01/2008 20:27

"Mix" as in "spend time with".

mrsruffallo · 14/01/2008 20:28

Then surely they will find their friends within a mixed classroom? What is this fear of the unknown? Or is it a need to feel superior- because I believe many state schools out there do a fantastic job

NKF · 14/01/2008 20:29

Of course they do but in a comp children will mix with children who are very different (socially, academically etc). For some people this is a wonderful thing. For others it's what they want to avoid.

Quattrocento · 14/01/2008 20:30

Chuckling at 100x Finbar. Yes I know what you mean about maybe complacency in an academic day school.

Kaz33 you say with some anger "I think you are peddling a very dangerous fantasy that it doesn't matter if both parents are absent."

We're all the product of our own upbringings - you've described your issues with yours. Perhaps Xenia's mother was a SAHM and she is rebelling too.

Perish the thought.

There's no need to get heated - we're all muddling through as best we know how.

mrsruffallo · 14/01/2008 20:33

Please explain why you would only want your children to lead a life with one type of person- the kind you approve of- and sneer at everyone else that wasn't good enough to mix with them?

Quattrocento · 14/01/2008 20:35

Sorry?

NKF · 14/01/2008 20:36

I didn't say that I did. I'm pointing out that the argument that they will mix with all sorts of people doesn't work for everyone.

yurt1 · 14/01/2008 20:38

I haven't read anything except the OP, but we have chosen a private school for ds2 and ds3 over the 'good' (results wise) local primary school. This is because a) the results were the least important part of the equation for us- especially at primary b) we really needed decent easy to use wrap around care c) the pastoral care in the private school is fantastic d) disability wise the private school is actually more inclusive and e)we went and looked round the private school and loved it, the state school wouldn't allow us to look around- not even in a group . I wasn't keen on sending my children to a school I hadn't seen. so as we could afford the private option.....

We expect to send ds2 and ds3 to a state school (selective though so relies on them getting in )

glitterfairy · 14/01/2008 20:38

I certainly dont equate success with academic achievement. I would prefer my kids to have an all round education and the opportunity to follow their own dreams not ones I imposed on them.

I was simply arguing that because someone is educated in the state sector does not make them incapable of achieving excellence in academic circles.

Nor does it mean they are unhappy or they need "happiness" lessons or good food. Sport and care are available in the state sector as well.

Quattrocento · 14/01/2008 20:38

Oh I hope this is a private argument.

Mrs Ruffalo - private schools are much much more diverse than the local state schools here. If you were to measure diversity by race or religion, that is. It's probably more diverse from an income perspective as well, although the median observation would be significantly higher.

mrsruffallo · 14/01/2008 20:44

So Quattro what do you think NKF meant by not wanting to mix with 'all sorts' then?

Quattrocento · 14/01/2008 20:47

NKF's point is different from mine. She is arguing that there are some private school parents who want to send their children to private schools to avoid them mixing with some types of children. That is undoubtedly true, but it is not true of me, and NKF does not sayit is true of her.