Primary education Dubai vs London

[Cersai]

We have recently started thinking of making a possible move from London to Dubai to save on taxes, to live in a safer city and be closer to our country of origin which is just a 3 hour flight away from Dubai - plan is to be there for next 5 years. My son currently attends a top highly academic private school in London which he got in through the very demanding 7+ process and is in Year 3. From the couple of friends we know who made a similar move - I am being told the private schools in Dubai while expensive aren’t as good as the schools here . I would love more updated feedback (there is a similar thread in 2018) about your views on the schooling system in Dubai (how is it different) and what were the big challenges and positives especially for the child when shifting from London to Dubai. Thank you!

There's just much lower level of competition for places so the average student will be less academic when compared to a highly academic London school one. Teachers are good from what I hear however because they also like going to Dubai for the same reasons as you.

That said, the place is on a whole very transient. Teachers, students, colleagues. Few people stay longer than 5 years.

Do also think about what you like about London. Moving for tax reasons could result in you being poor socially & culturally. I had to make a decision once between a job in London and the Cayman Islands. I am very glad I never made the move.

Children growing up with grandparents, aunts, uncles and cousins is something you can’t put a price on. In London young people can grow up independent and use the extensive public transport network. Personally I also wouldn’t want to support a regime thet jails certain types of people. I live in a part of London that is very safe and am happy for my teenage daughter to grow up with friends, interest clubs, trips to museums. If you do move I hope you get lots of helpful advice.

Dubai is more expensive than London imo, even with the tax taken into account.

Schools are all private unless you are a National so there are a full range of schools but none of even the very top are as good as the top U.K. independent schools. Almost all are for-profit and run to make a few men incredibly rich. That culture runs through the school.

In my experience, the teachers are either:

1. very young, on their second ever job, very well qualified, beaten many others for the job, married to another teacher also working in Dubai. Hugely enthusiastic and just thrilled to be out there. The first year or two they are incredibly inspirational (your child will be dissecting camel hearts or building Lego robotics), but then it's either drummed out of them by the pro-profit culture of management or they want children themselves/realise their package isn't that great and they end up leaving.

2. trailing middle aged spouses who wouldn't get a teaching job in the U.K. independent sector.

The school inspection teams are ex state school teachers with all the prejudices that brings. The schools tend to stick to the English broken and not fit for purpose national curriculum much more than independent schools do in the U.K.

Sorry for such an indictment. If I had my time again, I'd home educate 😁

What will you do about senior school? Are you thinking then about a 13+ back in the U.K.? From experience, it would be very difficult to plan for CE.

Very insightful comments from everyone. Many thanks.
@preppingforlife Thank you and a good reality check.
@PettsWoodParadise We don’t have any family here .. but you are right .. can’t put a price on even the friendships we have nurtured here. My husband doesn’t want to disturb the son’s academic experience here and is happy to move there for a while we are here in London. You are right that London is historically and culturally so rich and diverse - that experience and exposure cannot be replicated . Thank you for your insightful question and advice.
@xraydelta
Wow! This was eye opening for me and ofcourse making me think. For 13+ we had the Dubai College in mind . How long were you there ? Is a lot of school life spent indoors?

Another thought. DS had two friends at University who grew up as expats, one in Dubai, one in Thailand. The first with family from South Asia and the second with family from East Asia. The South Asian boy is effectively stateless with no right of residence in either Dubai or in South Asia. He ended up having to fly the long way round as his UK student visa ended the day before his US one started. Ditto the East Asian girl has no right of residence in Thailand, really the only country she knows, and is at risk of losing her right to live in the country her parents are from.

Both are effectively under pressure to do sufficiently well so that they can get jobs and settle in the West. There is advantage in growing up somewhere where you can really call home.

Your top London school will be miles ahead of the Dubai school.
Not Dubai, but in the ME, my kids went from comfortably top of the class abroad to top table, but nothing special, at English state primary.

Agree with PP that a top U.K. school will be streets ahead of even the best Dubai schools.

The majority of schools are run as businesses, and it shows in staff commitment, cost cutting, and how they prioritise families with more children attending the school.

A lot of the teachers are early in career, with less experience. When you get a school with a lot of inexperienced teachers, they don’t have a good support structure around them.

I will be sending my DC back to the U.K. to board for senior school as I have very little confidence in the quality of education they receive in Dubai (and this is across several schools, and many friends that live here think this too).

Sorry, you asked about the positives too and there are lots of them.

1. It’s very safe here, low crime.
2. Children don’t seem to grow up as fast.
3. Less bullying/social media problems.
4. More time to spend together as a family as the commute is shorter and you can get household help.
5. My DC are so aware of other cultures, they have friends from all over the world.

You would need to move to Dubai College for Y7. Chances of getting at 13+ are minimal as it's not a main intake year. Not impossible but minimal. I've also had comments (from parents who have moved their kids from London) that the school gets results because of its highly selective intake and quality of teaching doesn't match up to the top London independents. There is no truly selective primary - the only schools that are full enough to be fussy are not selective (except on English fluency).

The other issue is if you're looking for highly selective is that DC is your only choice and it is very competitive to get into. Do not assume your DC will get in no matter how bright and sporty they are. There are other good schools in Dubai, but they will be more mixed entry.

I'm very happy with the quality of schooling my kids receive but I am not interested in mimicing a prep school, or having my children under the pressure of a top selective independent. I'd say their school is similar to an excellent state with a naice catchment but with far far better facilities and an international student base (although majority UK and I haven't met a child not native English speaker level). Teacher retention is not an issue at my children's school (one of the reasons we chose it was because they value their staff over profit) but I agree it is a major issue in most schools.

Separately, I haven't lived in London for years, and not with a family, but I have heard some people say Dubai is cheaper than London, although some say the other way. If you're using to paying private fees and your husband will get an education allowance covering part of the cost out here (it's rare for it to cover all) it will probably be cheaper but if the main reason behind the move is financial you would need to be making substantially more than in London. We have a combined take-home of £175k pa and whilst I would never say we are low or even low middle income, i don't think we're materially better off than we would be on £175k gross in London (although that would be with kids in state school). The one thing that is cheaper is having live in help - with two working parents that's a major advantage - but an actual proper nanny as you'd get in London wouldn't be significantly cheaper.

The school inspection teams are ex state school teachers with all the prejudices that brings. The schools tend to stick to the English broken and not fit for purpose national curriculum much more than independent schools do in the U.K.

Agreed.

Also, some schools only enter students into subjects in which they are sure they can achieve and A grade - it's worth looking into this.

On safety do remember that there are stringent reporting laws and you are not seeing the full picture. Personally it is not a country I would call safe, and it's one of the few places in the World I would not want to raise my children.

From my friends who still live in Dubai who have senior, or approaching senior aged school children, they are mostly (except 1) looking to relocate back to the UK or at boarding options in the UK. The one friend who is not is only not coming back because they are closer to Family (so similar reasons to you).

It is safe in Dubai. I don’t know anyone that’s been a victim of any type of crime here.

Agree with all the comments here. If your son is happy and thriving at his London school leave him there. You are definitely not missing out on anything in regards to education in Dubai.
Also my children found it quite unsettling with continual changing friendship groups as people came and went.
My children did do well at GCSE in Dubai but had a better education at their provincial private school for A level and in some regards I regret them not having done their GCSE’s there also . (Mainly due to the social, friendship , school ethos, extra curricular side).
Also don’t under estimate the importance of having a base with local friends when your son goes to Uni which he can call up during uni holidays which tends to not be available in Dubai as people don’t stay

Just to add the positives, I VERY much feel that only a Dubai person can criticise Dubai. People who haven't lived there don't get that privilege 😁

So, for the positives. My children had way, WAY more exposure to other points of view, religious and nationalities than they ever had in their prep and boarding schools in the U.K. They have had all of it.

They remain friends with a number of people, now scattered all over the world as well as remaining in Dubai. They made true friendships. For all the moans about transient friendships, I have exactly the same as well. I talk to people, friends, I made in Dubai much more than I do friends I made in U.K. prep school parental life.

They understand differences. They felt the embarrassment of not being at least bilingual in the "British" schools.

I don't have the energy right now to explain why DC isn't all it's cracked up to be, but it's not 1990 anymore, and it isn't. The trailing spouse teacher issue is their main problem imo. There is now competition, and that's a great thing.

Me. And my family. And all my Dubai friends 🤷🏻‍♀️

Sorry @SunsetGun that was me agreeing with you. Nobody I know had any crime.

My door stayed unlocked 😆

It's odd that there are such different experiences and I'm wondering if it's in some way related to the social circles you move in compared to me! In my experience, a small number of people return to the UK for senior school (well Y7, I can't definitively comment if you mean Y9 as my kids haven't reached that transition point) but it's not the norm. DS2 is Y6 and I don't know of anyone in his class returning home for secondary for example. I think one did in DS1's class. Interestingly, one of the few people I know who has said that they plan to return for schooling (a way off yet) went to a top London independent.

I'm interested in all this crime I'm missing expressed as if there's something terrible being hidden. What is meant by crime? Of course there is crime - of all types - and I've been a victim of crime myself as have most people I know if they truly think about it. They don't tend to report it but then it's at a level that you probably wouldn't bother reporting in the UK. I had a material sum stolen (opportunistic and I was stupid) and I did report that - there weren't any hoops to jump. I don't think you can realistically deny that crime is low here - I don't even know where my door key is! It's certainly not non existent and there is organized crime, drug trade and some real seedy stuff going on - it's a major city of 3m people - but I do not know anyone personally who has been burgled or suffered a violent assault (except domestic violence) etc.

I also agree that it can be transient and it can be hard on the kids to have friends move, but again that in part is social circle and school chosen. I'm seeing this changing, but then my social group tends to be long termers and our kids school also seems to attract long termers - one child left in each of my children's classes at the end of last year. My children have friends here they have known close to all their lives. If I look around colleagues, a lot have been here 10+ years and have or are buying property and settling down.

I don't think you should move though OP. I don't think it will give you what you're looking for in terms of education.

I also know Dubai isn't perfect and isn't for everyone or all families (for example I would think long and hard before bringing an LGBT teen up here). It's just that reading this thread I think some people live in a different city to me! So unsafe it's the one of very few places in the world you would raise your kids?! Which major city is more safe if you look at day to day crime?

Thanks @xraydelta

I get tired of people making inaccurate comments about the UAE and presenting them as fact despite never having lived there. It’s not perfect, no where else. But to say it’s one of the few places in the world not to raise children??!

I’d agree that Dubai College is the best place for an academic education. DESC is huge, I know parents that are happy with JESS AR. There’s things I don’t like about DC though, it doesn’t suit everyone even if you’re at the ability level required. I wasn’t happy with Repton, very much run as a business, and I know many parents that have removed their children. I think the GEMS schools are a mixed bag and also very much run as businesses.

I definitely wouldn’t move to Dubai from the U.K. for education, but to save (if you’re on the right salary package, as it’s expensive) be closer to your family, and have the experience of living in a dynamic multicultural environment, it’s great. It’s also amazing to open the curtains everyday and see the sun shining.

A lot of failed/underperforming UK teachers go to Dubai/Middle East, particularly if they fail NQT (ECT) or just scrape by. Interviews are often by Skype/TEAMS or at best a meeting in London they dont see them teach or interact with children.

Not in my experience.

Some do, yes. But these tend to be spouses.

Teachers tend to be young and insanely well qualified. Inexperienced yes, but very well qualified and brimming with ideas.

There are about 7-10 applicants per place for the better schools, and the recruitment processes are all done through long-lasting relationships with agencies.

@Cersai - did you end up moving? What was your experience? I am in a very similar position to what you describe in your post and found this thread incredibly useful to inform my thoughts. It would be great to know more of what has happened since.