State vs grammar vs private for DC with mild SEN

[ballroompink]

DS is about to go into Year 5 and is in the middle of the assessment process to see if he has ASD or ADHD. He currently has some help at school around a) concentration and following instructions and b) social skills as he struggles a bit with friendships, working well with others etc. He does nurture group and some other activities based around helping social skills. His attainment has always been good - he is bright and hits all his targets but could undoubtedly achieve more with a bit of pushing and he has done some extra sessions outside class in Year 4 aimed at pushing him a bit more. His concentration and confidence are his main barriers.

We are looking ahead to secondary school and weighing up our options and I wonder if anyone else has experience of what has worked well with similar DC? I'm not sure that an academically pushy school is the right route for him although he is bright. He was in school during lockdown earlier this year and thrived in a small class environment of ten children and for this reason we do feel drawn towards perhaps a smaller private school with plenty of different opportunities for him. But then we also know that state achools are often best geared up to support children with SEN. We could afford a cheaper private school, not an expensive one, which would limit us.

Anyone with experience of a similar situation?

In my experience (working in a range of state schools and having had my own kids go to a mixture state/private/grammar - as each child has needed something quite different) I would suggest that 'relatively able with mild SEND' are likely to be better served in small-class smaller private schools and often have parents who choose them for that reason. Many of those places are well used to trying to get the very best for those students in terms of addressing specific learning needs, sorting access arrangements early etc. I think many state schools are likely to have SEND students who are much more needy and those are likely to get the focus of resources and additional support than those who are 'managing adequately' as your DC seems to have done to date. I have just chosen a small independent for my now Y7 DS for this reason. I was worried that in our local secondary he might have been setted in lower groups for subjects that rely on writing and then find it difficult to work in groups where behaviour of some students may have been very challenging. His state primary didn't identify his SEND, despite me repeatedly asking for them to look into it - they just said 'he needed to concentrate' since they had many more big cases on their hands and he didn't much come to their notice. Of course much of this will depend on the individual school, so it would be worth talking to any contacts you might find within your local independent.

Following. Son, same age, does have ASD diagnosis, I feel your pain over worry of secondary. We are currently looking at 11+ and he is very able and keen to try, I feel he'd fit in well in a grammar as he works well amongst others who are intense and engaged in their learning. However, the places are fiercely contested for around here and there obviously has to be a plan B, and I've no idea what it is!

Thank you marly that is really helpful! I think ultimately small and private is our preferred option but we're not rolling in money so it would be a big decision.

ElvenDreamer yes I know what you mean - fiercely contested places etc.! DS would be keen to try 11+ but I don’t know if would be the best option!

Grammar schools need children to behave and confirm, DS1’s grammar copes to some degree with ASD but not ADHD. They get less pupil premium though and the SEN support is crap.

Some Independent schools cope really well with SEN, some don’t, it varies.

He’d fit in very well at DS’s grammar school!

I don't know any grammars that cope with ADHD. Some manage with ASD but even then it's not great. I'd go private but choose very carefully and don't be taken in by glossy brochures. Our ASD year 6 is in a private school and it's been the making of him.

@Yahtze

I don't know any grammars that cope with ADHD. Some manage with ASD but even then it's not great. I'd go private but choose very carefully and don't be taken in by glossy brochures. Our ASD year 6 is in a private school and it's been the making of him.

Yes I was definitely thinking along these lines with grammars. I don't think he would struggle to pass the 11+ but concentration and sitting still are an issue for him and I feel like that's not what they would be prepared to cope with? At primary school now he does sensory circuits before lessons start and sometimes has movement breaks.

My autistic Ds went to a state grammar. Passed the 11+ without any tutoring, I thought he would meet his tribe and that the school would support him well.

How wrong we were. It was an utterly horrendous 5 years for him. No SEN support, no pastoral care and he was severely bullied. When I complained about them not supporting a needs assessment for him, the Headteacher wrote us a letter, pretty much putting the blame on us. He is a very unpleasant man, who only cares about exam results, how many he's sending to Oxford and Cambridge or the boys who will be 'reading medicine' at Uni.

My Ds's experiences were just awful and I would be very wary of sending a child with additional needs to a state grammar school.

I would echo many above. Ds went to local grammar. Though they talk the talk re Sen they were shit. Poorly funded in support and pastoral. Shit attitudes and shocking lack of awareness from many teachers. I hate to say it but majority of staff were older men who I got the impression they didn't even believe SEN exist. DS moved to another grammar in year 10. They were more set up - had a special learning support dept and all sorts. Speak to other local parents. Get a feel for schools. Meet the senco. Trust your instincts.

You are right about them talking the talk Dont. The Head at Ds's old school likes to go on constantly about how amazing and supportive they are. Always tweeting about 'mental health' . It's all for show, he couldn't give a shit about the mental health of the boys in his care.

Ds was picked on by staff too. He once had a teacher encourage the whole class to laugh at him. For a young man who at the time had an undiagnosed SEN and who struggles massively to communicate with those around him, it was horrendous.

We have a similar age ds with ASD and mild dyslexia. No behavioural issues at school, but anxious. We are choosing private, smaller less selective schools.
Why? Smaller classes, less chaotic, not hot house pressure but good results, potential for support if needed.

Local state schools - won’t be able to offer anything really as he isn’t bad enough. All options are large (1300-1500 kids) with okay but not great results, reputations. I have visited both.

We are not in grammar territory.

My dd's ADHD wasn't diagnosed until the end of year 10.

She is at a high achieving, selective private school.

If I had had any idea about her ADHD I would never have sent her to that school. Small class sizes mean absolutely nothing if the teachers are not inclusive, experienced with SEND, and value children with a range of skills and attributes.

Given my time again, I would have sent DD to our local comprehensive.

I would steer well clear of grammar school for a child with SEN (I have a bright child with SEN and I didn't even consider it, no way was I having their confidence blown to smithereens by a school after good results)

Some small private schools often just don''t have the quality of SEN staff, and I have heard of one local to us being so swamped with new SEN children since the last lockdown when children were able to see by trying to teach their children how difficult they found it, that they are having to put ratio's on how many SEN children they can take as they can't afford the SEN staff. Small private schools can have as bad budgets as state schools.
I would take it on a school by school basis. Visit them, ask about SEN budgets, find parents with SEN children at those particular schools. You can't judge on a sector of school you must look at them individually (just like you shouldn't buy a house just by looking online!)
Definitely don't discount a comp just because it is a comp - they can have very good staff with access to good training. They do have big classes but depending on the complexity of your DS's diagnosis he might get lots of time in the SEN department in small groups.

May I kindly know the name of the other grammar school that was good? Thank you 🙏

Have a child with high IQ and CAT scores, well behaved but with severe dyslexia and almost certainly ADHD (assessment underway).

Private schools were not prepared to deal with her degree of SEN, grammar would have been a misery.

We opted for a huge comprehensive with a sensible but not draconian discipline system and it's been fantastic.

Enough kids she could find her tribe, the school have seen every combination of SEN under the sun and are good at dealing with it, and there are huge numbers of both children and staff so enough sets that they can be very precise in placing children in exactly the right class for their needs.

I am forever grateful to the private schools for saying no as, with hindsight, it would not have been a good fit.

@HGR this is quite an old thread, it may be worth tagging the poster you are asking your question to as they may be more likely to see it.

What part of the country is the Grammar?

The south coast.
And Ds is still struggling with the things that happened to him there ( he left in 2020).