Comparing private primary/prep schools

[Bubble14]

Our daughter is currently in year 1 in a small independent school. Its reasonably priced for private and she is happy, however it's very poorly run and there are significant financial issues with the school, admin is terrible and they are cutting back on staff. We are considering another local couple of independent schools as we are concerned about the long term future of this one and its not as academic as we would like plus they do nothing to support working parents, no after school care etc which we are struggling with...but how do you decide which is/could be better? Destination? Range of subjects? Scholarship opportunities etc? For the money I honestly feel we could be spending it more wisely! Thanks

We are in a very similar boat for our DD. Outstanding state vs smaller prep.

Our decision is focussed on the leaver destinations. So where do they go after year 6? But it depends on what you are after. If you want grammar for secondary, then leaver destination is probably key.

I have had children in both. The child at the superficially polished but actually chaotic prep school had a worse deal academically and pastorally than his siblings at our local state school. Nicer uniform though, and they did learn Latin, but at 11+ it’s only maths and English that matter.

Thanks for your replies 😊 yes its tough, we moved to the area recently and probably didn't do our homework enough as the current school definitely isn't what we were anticipating, hubby is very keen on a very academic secondary, she could stay where she is but the middle and senior school are really not that great (we have now discovered) of course things can change but currently they are trying to get a new head so who knows which way it will go...she is happy and settled so it would be hard to move her unless we are really sure about the alternative. We'll go and have a look of course at the options, thanks for your feedback x

You really need to check what the destinations are of prep schools. Cheap usually means less good and parents with lower ambitions. The top preps publish destinations and scholarships. So do you want state grammar or academic independent?

Around me, the better preps divide along these lines. There are the grammar crammers where DC all leave at 11. Then there’s the traditional preps where the majority stay to 13 and go to boarding. A few girls leave at 11 as some girls schools start at 11. Generally people choose schools by destination.

You should also look at availability of pre and after school care, scholarships won (although state grammar isn’t the same as an independent school scholarship), facilities for teaching all subjects. My DDs old prep got art, sport, all rounder, music and academic scholarships. It’s certainly not all about English and Maths at top prep schools. However if your senior school only examines in maths and English with nothing else, then don’t worry about art! However we found a broad curriculum essential. It’s what you pay for. Our class sizes were 18. You want to see a range of opportunities and plenty of after school clubs.

I’m not a fan of through schools. They don’t prep for other senior schools and are often too cosy. Be aware of financially dodgy schools too - they cannot attract a decent head. I would jump ship but you will now have to pay for next term won’t you?

Thanks for your reply, you are absolutely right the parents are less ambitious...we didn't realise this when we moved to the area! Essentially the majority want to send to private but can't afford to pay for a really exclusive private!
There are 3 private schools near us, all 3 are in financial difficulty and all are non-selective so it's hard to decide what's best...the smarter schools are starting to provide after school care, holiday club etc and have slicker marketing but they are all a worry long term. There is another more traditional public type school which gear's kids up for the more exclusive private senior schools (and more expensive!) But it's a good 40 mins away. We would consider it as they do a bus service, it certainly seems the most secure too as it is now owned by a larger group of exclusive schools...but its so expensive! Admittedly we should have looked at destination more but we were naive to it I guess as we had to move fast for a job relocation.

Another alternative is one that goes to 13 and does send to very good schools for 13+ however their last accounts were worrying, they took out a massive loan after covid happened and it feels more risky than when we are...although they are better at appealing to working parents with provision and they have a good reputation for academic work so it is an appealing alternative! If they are all much of a muchness financially feel like she's better staying where she is for another few years as we've already moved her in the last 18 months. Tricky!

Agree with @PresentingPercy ... our local small prep doesn't have a lot of facilities but their destinations are incredible (75% to superselective grammars).

Part and parcel of it is that this selects ambitious parents so naturally the home environment might play a big part too.

I am not sure about the headteacher thing. Does it matter so much if a school changes head teachers every 5 to 6 years? No experience here. Is it something you would ask?

40 mins away feels far @Bubble14 unless they have great pre and after school care which may be worth the long journey

The change of head every 5-6 years might not matter at all, but it’s the calibre of head that will find this school attractive which could be the issue. Certainly for an ambitious head. If they need more DC, the school might have to up their game considerably but with diminishing funds that’s very difficult. It’s also difficult if parents see it as purely supplying its senior school and nowhere competitive. It’s a comfortable route but not so much challenge.

You are right about the just about affording if to. We were very clear that our money had to buy a school with good academics and lots of opportunities for DD to discover what she liked. It had to be big enough to do this effectively.

I’m sure changing schools again is difficult. And I can see why you would not do it quickly. Around me it’s fairly normal to change schools after Y2 though. Or even Y3. So maybe wait a bit?

Yes, 40 mins isn’t great but it’s what I did! But we chose a brilliant school and it wasn’t all about grammars and 11 plus. It had everything except a decent swimming pool! It now has that too! Pay for what you need to get DD the best shot at what you want for her.

We lived in a small settlement with no community regarding the children. At one time, 14 different schools were being used!

You need a school that ticks several boxes. Firstly, it needs to have a good 'feel', by which I mean you go and look around, talk to the teachers and you get that 'yes' feeling, that you like the ethos of the school and feel your DC would be happy there. Secondly, that it provides what you need i.e. after school care, sports, music, drama, whatever is important for you/your DC. Thirdly, that it prepares DC for 11+ or 13+ if you need that.

Prep schools, by definition, should do this, but somehow my DC ended up at a private primary that called itself a prep and doesn't actually prep the DC for anything, because it wants them to have no option but to go on to the rather disappointing senior school. Unfortunately, paying for private education doesn't guarantee you certain standards, so you have to take off your emotional hat and put on you consumer hat for points 2 and 3, but it's really worth doing your due diligence, because you don't want to have to pay out for private and then pay a tutor on top to do the prep work that your 'prep' school doesn't!

Thanks for all the replies, it has definitely helped! I think we will keep her where she is for now and see what happens, she is very happy and the facilities are fantastic, if they would only offer an after school club it would make life so much easier but hey ho...they have a longer school day but its always cutting it fine for me to get there! Looking at the accounts for other local schools it seems they are all in debt and having to take loans from banks so I think we just have to ride it out.
We'll definitely look to move in a couple of years unless the situation changes x

I think quite a few schools have financial problems. Some of them can sell off land and take out long term loans. If these are well known schools of a decent size they will survive. Small and mediocre is more at risk I think.

@PresentingPercy

I think quite a few schools have financial problems. Some of them can sell off land and take out long term loans. If these are well known schools of a decent size they will survive. Small and mediocre is more at risk I think.

Yes and that is what ours is actually doing, selling land!

All the local ones are fairly small 200-300 kids max (age 6 months to 13 or 6 months to 18)...we are looking at one of them which has a better academic reputation and better destinations so perhaps that is the better option for longevity too, only time will tell I guess. Thanks

zafferana we did the same.. prep of an all through school and there was zero pace or stretch. We have swopped to a prep which is defined by the scholarships and destinations at 13+. It's much more pacey and interesting.

@Bubble14
300 pupils for an all through school is far too small. 200 from nursery to 13 isn’t great either. The best preps around me are 400 plus. 3-13 or to 11. There are smaller ones but they have local grammars in their sights and nothing else. The better ones do that and have independent destinations too with lots of varied scholarships.

It’s rather tempting to choose a school for a shy 3 year old without looking at the bigger picture when they are 7 or 11. Needs change and schools who stand and fall by their reputation are the ones to go for. Near me a private primary hardly gets any dc to the grammars and I really cannot see any advantage over the state primaries. It’s tiny so sport is useless, music and drama suffer so I cannot see why parents choose it, other than for nursery. It might work for “precious” dc but the state schools are all good here so why anyone pays for a lack lustre school is beyond me. Other preps do everything and are wonderful schools so why choose a great nursery class that eventually leads to less good than a state school provides?

Your not in the NW are you as you’ve just described our first Indy.

School life was brilliant but academically it was terrible. We hung on till year three then changed. When dd moved to a prep in year 3 there were massive holes in her learning and she’s been on catch up ever since.

My advice is to move now. Your essentially pay for a brilliant education - which your not getting. Your wasting your money.

I would agree with hotankles. We just moved DC1 in yr 6 and she had not done latin before so we had to catch up on that and is also behind in french. Luckily I have AS level french and she is quick to learn so we are making progress. Dc2 is in yr 3 and moved and I'm hoping he's early enough to not need to catch up. My only regret is we didn't get to the prep sooner. Dc1's BF is still procrastinating over whether to move her or not... The longer they leave it the bigger the gap is getting.

Indy's charge such a ridiculous amount of money these days you want to make sure you are getting your worth out of it otherwise they would be better off in a good state school and you could spend the money on trips to inspiring places, top notch sports clubs, books, subscriptions to magazine's, proper music teachers (the ones in schools are a bit bluuuhhh sometimes), saving for Uni, house deposits, pensions etc.

I would move to a top one if you are paying and not bother with the mediocre one.

@Hotankles

Your not in the NW are you as you’ve just described our first Indy.

School life was brilliant but academically it was terrible. We hung on till year three then changed. When dd moved to a prep in year 3 there were massive holes in her learning and she’s been on catch up ever since.

My advice is to move now. Your essentially pay for a brilliant education - which your not getting. Your wasting your money.

No we're not in the NW, must be a common issue then! A few people have commented that they have experienced similar issues!

I know you are right, it seems a bit mad to be paying for mediocre. We've decided to go and have a look round somewhere else which has better academics and reputation x

@burpees

Indy's charge such a ridiculous amount of money these days you want to make sure you are getting your worth out of it otherwise they would be better off in a good state school and you could spend the money on trips to inspiring places, top notch sports clubs, books, subscriptions to magazine's, proper music teachers (the ones in schools are a bit bluuuhhh sometimes), saving for Uni, house deposits, pensions etc.

I would move to a top one if you are paying and not bother with the mediocre one.

I know you are right, we are going to have a look round another one that has a better academic reputation and you seem to get more for your money there too, ours doesn't have any after school clubs or activities at all which is annoying especially to fit around our work....hardest part will be moving her from her friends but hopefully she'll forgive us in time!

What are the local state options like? Near me all of the state primaries are brilliant so the preps have to raise their game. For me the added value for under 8s wasn’t quite there. I’ll look again for year 3 but for now I’m very happy. I certainly wouldn’t be paying for a prep with no after school activities.

Secondary is a different beast where the added value appears massive.

Do not be fooled that destination schools are a true reflection of a prep’s quality. Our 20k London prep has displayed shockingly bad teaching this year (an important year for 11+). Maths is just printed sheets, no text books, kids mark their own work, exercise books go unmarked for weeks. They can get away with it as they know parents are paranoid and stupid enough to pay for tutors.