Shocking Westminster School allegations

[Turth]

This makes for a very grim read indeed.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9383413/Westminster-school-hit-rape-culture-claims-former-pupils-compile-dossier-sex-allegations.html

Accounts are coming out from many, many schools in the past weeks or two.

There is an urgent need to do more to teach teenage boys not to be creeps

There does seem to be some link between these very wealthy schools and particularly odious, entrenched behaviour.

Oh come on - this type of crap went on when I was at school. A classmates brother got done for sexual assault. Don’t pretend this isn’t a societal thing.

The reason these schools are being reported on is a) they're well known by journalists b) they are 'posh' and c) the individuals who have organised the dossiers are articulate and vocal.

This kind of behaviour will be found in any school in UK but the story won't find its way into the Daily Fail.

I don't think this is something that can or should be othered to just 'wealthy' schools. But they are the ones most likely to appear in the press.

I agree it's found in any school - just like bullying is. And it needs tackling with just as much resolve and the expectation that every school is on the case.

Having been to a wealthy school decades ago drinking alcohol, drug taking and dealing, sexual assault (teacher-pupil & pupil-pupil) and self-harm were rife in my school. All of these things and many more when reported (which rarely happened) were made an internal affair. I only remember one drug dealer getting expelled in my 5 years there.

What I find puzzling about these headlines is the idea that just because a school charges £00,000 then the students must be held to a higher level of behaviour than any other student from non fee paying schools. Sex allegations, alcohol, drugs etc happen in every school, they are just not worthy of reporting probably because no ones cares except the victims and the sheer numbers will probably mean what exactly? Expel half the students? In that case nearly every school will be closed.

Fee paying schools make exciting news. It’s a way of placating the masses that all those silly rich people are paying for, is for their little darlings to be abused.

The one good thing that can come out of theses reports is because like @liveandletllive said, they are articulate and vocal and can afford good lawyers! Where some local comp kid or their parents might feel intimidated or just not have the resources to report and take it further. That might lead to new laws & school policies that will better protect both girls and boys and see the perpetrators receive stiff sentences.

There has been far more sexual abuse of children in private schools by teachers over the last 100 years than in state schools, you just can’t get away with that sort of covering up in state schools.

@Cowboychild

There has been far more sexual abuse of children in private schools by teachers over the last 100 years than in state schools, you just can’t get away with that sort of covering up in state schools.

The fact is you have no figures to back your claim up. Of course you can ‘get away’ with that sort of covering upon state schools don’t be so naive. Paedophiles don’t behave differently just because they’re at a non fee paying school. 100 yrs ago what society considered normal is different from today, so many parents swept it under the carpet and if you were from a humble background you had no ‘voice’ at all. This can hardly be the preserve of private schools. The true scale of it in state schools will never known. In the meantime, private schools make great news.

But don’t forget religious schools. A friends step-dad was abused in a catholic school, as was a friend in a children’s home. Let alone the physical abuse - somehow meaner/more viscous when it’s suppose to be the ‘godly people’.

@tonty
Comp parent here. Takes quite a lot to intimidate me and plenty of the other doctors, lawyers, judges, barristers, vets, politicians, authors, journalists who have children at the comp. Plenty of resources to make sure that we can have our voice heard too. What a lazily stereotyped post you wrote.

@Dillydaffy It doesn't matter whether anybody can intimidate and you (it's not about you). I am state educated and most people in the UK are state educated and cover the whole spectrum of work from blue collar work to white collar. As only only 7% are privately educated it would be a rather strange society if the remaining 93% were all from 'humble backgrounds' which is what you have chosen to infer but not at all what I said.

@tonty
You made it very clear it was about comp parents I am afraid -

Where some local comp kid or their parents might feel intimidated or just not have the resources to report and take it further

As if we might somehow be too cowed to not take reports of sexual allegations towards our children any further? That we might be too intimidated and just let it go? What a load of utter balderdash. It isn't state school parents on here saying that it isn't about individual schools it is about society. Talk about burying of heads in much sand! Of course it is also about society, but in this particular it is very clearly about these named schools which must be held to greater scrutiny.

@Dillydaffy Yes indeed, I said 'some', not all but don't let that stop you looking for something to complain about.

I'm still waiting for your data to back up your wild claim that there has been more sexual abuse of children in private schools over the last 100yrs, than in state schools. I'm sure I'm not the only one interested in this research of yours. Burying head in sand did you say?

No burying of head in sand here.
I was sexually abused by a boy at my boarding school at the age of 15 in the school gym in the evening.
Two of my friends were abused by monks at Ampleforth and I know of one serious case at Downside.
It is pretty harrowing hearing friends talk of their experiences at the hands of predatory teachers and the covering up by the schools and the parents. My DH had friends who were abused at his prep school and his famous public school. In those days we somehow thought we had to accept these things and didn't speak out despite our wealth, the fact our parents were articulate and vocal. I am glad that children feel differently now.

I am also very glad dc are much more vocal and society more clued up (which i mentioned upthread). I am genuinely sorry about what happened to you, there was a general attitude of gushing things up in society as a whole but your claim about numbers of abuse in private schools v state is not backed up by any evidence at all, that doesn't diminish you experience which was awful.

My point is going back a hundred yrs, only God knows what atrocities happened to dc especially the most vulnerable so this publicity of private schools may be good for everyone.

@Tonty
I was very clearly talking about abuse by teachers - and I shall have a dig about and see if there is any actual hard evidence to back up my very stark ancedotal stories. It does seem that for the tiny amount of children who were educated by boarding schools in the last 100 years there was shockingly high amounts of teacher perpetrated abuse. And no doubt that is due to access - but also to much covering up/moving on by the schools involved. Sadly this has happened right up into the last decade so isn't just about the morals of 100 years ago - St Pauls and Clifton College have very recent cases of teacher abuse.

@Dillydaffy I agree. Didn't Ampleforth close down some yrs ago or did I imagine it?

@Tonty Still open, I have friends with children there. However they are not allowed to take on any new pupils due to major safeguarding failings which is unheard of. I suppose it is the private school version of Special Measures.
My friends were told by the school to post positive stories on their social media about the school to try and improve the image. I think it will take a lot more than that to make people trust the school again, however, as always, there are happy children there even though there are major safeguarding concerns. One child's experience doesn't make it everyone's experience, however every single experience has to be taken seriously.

This was my school and I don’t recognise the stories. It doesn’t mean I doubt they happened but it simply wasn’t my experience. I was a boarder too.

I notice that many of the stories took place outside of school - it doesn’t make them any less awful but the parents were in charge at that point, not the school.

I have suffered sexual harassment in many forms in many places but not from the boys I went to Westminster with. I agree with PP that it’s not a this school or that school issue but a societal one.

@Dillydaffy You also have to take into account that although there was more access to dc (I feel sick saying 'access') through boarding, we don't know what was happening to day dc in their living environment. So a comparison with like is not going to be possible.

DH was Westminster (from 1980). At that point, with fagging still in place, he says that younger boys had as much to fear from older boys as girls may have. There were certain boys’ rooms you did not want to have to go into. Around ‘82 he recalls a boys’ incursion (just for a laugh, allegedly) into the girls’ boarding house. John Rae, then headmaster made it crystal clear that any further attempts would result in instant expulsion. Things have obviously not improved since then. My own female school contemporaries went on to previously all-boys’ public schools for 6th form, such as Rugby, Marlborough etc in the late 80s and had pretty unpleasant experiences.