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Original poster

Is this assault? - confrontation between headteacher and 6 year old

116 replies

ptangyangkipperbang · 31/10/2007 13:09

DS1 (age 9) came home from school yesterday talking about what had happened in assembly. He said a class 1 child was misbehaving so the head shouted at the child (loud enough to make one of the special needs children cry) and got him to come out to the front. He then said the child had to go to his office. The child, for whatever reason, refused to go. I know this must have been frustrating for the head and he wouldn't want his authority undermined, but DS1 said the head then marched the child the length of the hall, pushing him in the back to make him move. DS1 said the whole school (nearly 200 kids) sat in stunned silence.
I've had my doubts about the leadership of this head and have heard him shouting at pupils in a bullying manner but do you agree that by doing this he has overstepped the mark?
By the way DS1 is usually a reliable source!

OP posts:
irises · 31/10/2007 13:58

Depends on the school, of course. My ds is in yr 8 at a very old (1620) grammar school which is very very hot on discipline.

Original poster
ptangyangkipperbang · 31/10/2007 14:02

I try and teach my DS's that resorting to physical 'remedies' isn't the way to go when trying to sort out a confrontation. I know this may be a bit idealistic but it's so far so good with my boys. When a head loses it in this way surely that underminds this? He'd be a bit of a hypocrite to then lecture them about not resorting to violence in, for example, a playground altercation.

OP posts:
TerrorMater · 31/10/2007 14:04

I should add that boy in my example was not just standing there refusing to go, he was behaving in a dangerous manner during a practical lesson.

maggotandjerry · 31/10/2007 14:04

Think what the head did was just fine. Don't get the problem tbh apart from the sn child crying.

Child in trouble defying the head of the school? Head needs to show child and all the others who is in charge. What other choice did he have other than enter into fruitless negotiation which gives this child power.

Bessie123 · 31/10/2007 14:06

It is battery and I don't think it is legal. It sounds to me as if the head teacher has committed a criminal offence against the child.

FluffyMummy123 · 31/10/2007 14:06

Message withdrawn

irises · 31/10/2007 14:07

Bessie, doyou seriously think that?

FluffyMummy123 · 31/10/2007 14:08

Message withdrawn

Bessie123 · 31/10/2007 14:09

Actually, I am legally trained (although not a criminal lawyer). It is not ok for the head teacher to push the child and technically, it is battery.

FluffyMummy123 · 31/10/2007 14:11

Message withdrawn

Bessie123 · 31/10/2007 14:14

To do what? How was it reasonable to push a child down a corridor?

wannaBe · 31/10/2007 14:14

but we don't know to what extent he pushed the child. Did he have a hand on the child's back to encourage him along for instance? in which case to suggest that it is asalt is absolutely ludicress.

Have any of you ever picked up your children to put them in time out? on the step? in another room? removed them physically from something they shouldn't be doing? in which case is that asalt too?

Original poster
ptangyangkipperbang · 31/10/2007 14:14

icod - other kids confirmed it in the playground this morning. They were saying that the child isn't a 'trouble maker'.
If the head did this to my 9 year old I would be fuming but would support the head if he said DS was behaving so badly it was the only course of action he could take. However, if he had done it when DS1 was in class 1 I would have been livid and would definitely not have supported his actions. I would not physically push my child so why should the head (acting in loco parentis - spelling?) be able to?

OP posts:
morningpaper · 31/10/2007 14:15

lol I can imagine the alternative

AIBU: FCKING SCHOOL RANG AND MADE ME DRIVE 30 MILES TO PICK UP DS1 WHO WOULD NOT GO TO HEADMASTER'S OFFICE!!!!! CAN'T THEY DEAL WITH THIS THEMSELVES?????

FluffyMummy123 · 31/10/2007 14:15

Message withdrawn

Original poster
ptangyangkipperbang · 31/10/2007 14:16

DS1 said the head used both hands to push him on the shoulder blades (or perhaps a bit lower) for the length of the hall.

OP posts:
morningpaper · 31/10/2007 14:16

agree Wannabe

TerrorMater · 31/10/2007 14:16

Gosh. I pick up ds (6) and carry him under my arm if he starts messing about.

wannaBe · 31/10/2007 14:16

what should he have done then? if the child was refusing to move should he just say "oh ok then, let's all sit down and have a reasoned debate about this"

the world has gone mad.

Blandmum · 31/10/2007 14:17

You are allowed to use reasonable force.

I agree that it isn't an assault, but it isn't good practice.

Best practice would be not to have got into that situation in the first place (waffly answer I know)

If a child refuses to move, it can cause all sorts of knock on effect on dicupline and behavior. I was once in the farcical situation of escorting a kid to welfare (because they had acted up in a lesson) and they simply refused to move while we were standing in the middle of the play ground. I had to get another member of staff to help me shift this girl.

Two adults, wasting their time because of bolshy teenager.....not good practice either!

a gentle hand on the arm and a steely eye'd look would have beem a better way of coping woth both situations.

also tales always grow in the telling. Check the facts

irises · 31/10/2007 14:17

Hopefully he'll have learned to behave himself in school.

Perhaps he doesn't get enough discipline at home.

morningpaper · 31/10/2007 14:19

Also saying that the child "is not a troublemaker" - REALLY? Defying the headteacher in front of the whole school? I don't think that EVER happened when I was at school...

OrmIrian · 31/10/2007 14:20

"Surely he could have left the child standing at the front while the head got on with assembly. He could have said something along the lines of "I'm not letting you get away with disrupting assembly for everyone and will deal with you later"."

Precisely. The head brought it to a head (no pun intended) then had to intervene physically so that he didn't lose authority. I've been there with my kids sometimes and as far as I'm concerned it's only happened because I'm failing to do my job properly. There was no need for it to go so far.

LadyOfTheFlowers · 31/10/2007 14:20

Jesus! Battery?!
Think this is well OTT!
The kid MUST have done something bad.
Doubt he head is that much of an out of control loon to pick some random 'good kid' to pick on unless the kid was acting up?

Blandmum · 31/10/2007 14:21

MP, we don't even have to imagine that thread, it happened on MN not that long ago, a child wouldn't enter the classroom, so the school kept phoning the mum and getting her to come in.

As you rightly predicted, she wasn't happy!