primary school dilemma 2 - which schooL?

[olala]

i posted about this a while ago - current primary school is just dire. the whole deal is awful - no communication with parents, governors are all staff so no accountability, head left in summer, now we have the wooden plank deputy as acting head, no consistency in homework - sometimes handed out, sometimes not, no extra activites, other parents are largely utterly retarded - there was a punch up at summer fair over face painting q, between 2 mums blah blah, i could go on for ages ,.
Anyway, I've taken action, found 2 schools near me, both have places for my ds, neither have places for my dd. Though one has said this is poss negotiabloe. The one that has said this is negotiable is the top achieving school in or borough, has fab reputation etc, BUT is a faith school - we are not faithful at all and know nothing about this religion. They do accept non relgious families though, and there are quite a few of them there - but they do religiousy things in assembly etc. I think I can swallow all that for the education, as long as I can be clear with the kids that thats not our religiong, but its great they are learning all about someone elses. Is this ok?
Other school - have to wait for place for dd, no religion, not so high achiving, but has much greater mix of kids, many who don't speak enligsh etc, though it does get very good results for its intake, and is small, friendly and happy, and marginally nearer to my house than the other one.

So its the faith school, or its the non faith one thats not quite as good and means I have to wait for a place for dd.

what does everyone think?

thanks

xx

i know this is so boring for everyone, but its totally stressing me out in a humungous way. I really wish I could just be told. Here - do this:
1.
2.
3.
And know that was the best thing to do for them. I feel I have cocked up so badly with their current school ,that in moving them I have to make sure I am doing the totally right thing. OR it will be another cock up except this time without theri friends.

I'd go for the faith school (which faith?). I went to Catholic schools and tolerance for other beliefs was very much the order of the day.

Have you been to see them? Which did you like best? And what exactly is the policy about transferring children - I mean, either they have a place or they don't. how long do they think it is likely to be before a place for dd comes up at school 2? (they should know roughly what their turnover is per year). Do you know any other parents at the other schools?
Sorry to answer your questions with more questions, but as you know, this one is down to you! If it were me, I would go for no 2 because I am strongly anti-faith schools, but you have said it doesn't bother you too much. Do find out what you are letting yourself in for though, I know friends at a Catholic school and they pretty much have to buy into the whole shebang, confirmation, church attendance etc etc.

my dd goes to a religious school (well in my eyes it religious - not RC) she comes home singing religious songs - we are NOT religious but it doesnt bother me. she likes the bible stories and as long as she likes it thats fine with me. they are nice stories after all!

anyway what im trying to say is i love the school and so does dd so thats what counts

hth

also, if ds gets a place, dd with be top of the list for a place when it comes up (thats how it works here anyway - siblings always get priority)

Did I post on your thread a while ago, re. St E in east London? If so would be quite curious to know what the other option is.

Only you can make this decision, based on how strongly anti- or non-religious you are. There seem to be loads of MNers who would rather disembowel themselves than put up with their child coming home singing hymns or wanting to say goodnight to Jesus, so if this is you, steer clear of the religious school.

otoh, if you can cope with the idea that your child will be exposed to some fairly high-octane RE (assuming it is an RC school) and have to attend Mass on feast days etc, and if you're happy to deal with that while making it quietly clear to the children that you do not share the school's faith, then go for it.

No, its not catholic, its jewish. I have no knowledge at all of judaism, and am keen for my children to have a good academic understanding of it. Our family background - we are all kind of atheist catholics if that makes sense! ITs just the deal that you are catholic, although none of us believ a word of it, or practice it, we still are it. I think its an irish thing!

I am anti faith schools. Really. I know this sounds madness, but I don't think they are progressive at all.

But (massively swallowing pride and prinicples for sake of children learning to read by age 14!) this school is excellent. It is near our home. It teaches them Hebrew from age 4. It accepts non-jewish children and is liberal in every way you can think of. I have met lots of other parents from there and they are like me - they are middle class, vaguely left wing, and very much into their children's education. They are not that much into judaism, though they enjoy the sense of community and the excellent education. I have enjoyed their company. (need to remind myself it is not about me but about the children!)

The other school - the non faith one - it has a more varied intake, it gets good SATS results and had a 'good' ofsted recently. The head has a good rep. I'm leaning towards the other one.

I;m seeing non faith one tmrw and the faith one next week.

I will then spend another fortnight waking up in a cold sweat not knowing what to do and needing to put by DCs on pause while I decide!

And frogs - yes you did post on my earlier thread, but not about St Es - I'm not sure what that is!

Thanks thahks thanks for your input - it really is so valuable .,any other thoughts or views very much appreciated!

Looks to me like you have answered your own question olala

"this school is excellent. It is near our home. It teaches them Hebrew from age 4. It accepts non-jewish children and is liberal in every way you can think of. I have met lots of other parents from there and they are like me - they are middle class, vaguely left wing, and very much into their children's education. They are not that much into judaism, though they enjoy the sense of community and the excellent education. I have enjoyed their company"

no it is not all about you but if the parents are like minded people the children are probably similar to yours which is always great - and you do have to stand around hte playground with these people for hte next x years!

I would say, unless you are really overwhelmed by one when you see them, choose this one. Personally I am with you on chilren getting a good grounding in as many faiths as possible and this school sounds great from what you have said.

yes yes yes and yes Carbonel. I think my mind is pretty made up already. Thanks x

you know when you think you may have given away too much and you don't really want to be identified by MNers who you know in real life?
Its now!

Sorry, I have the same problem, hate the idea of being indentified in real life, will tell mnet to delete previous message.

hi all who posted on this before. Just thought I'd update any of you who are still awake !

I've been to see both schools in the last week.

School 1

• head too busy to see me
• i didn't get shown around as such ,though the school secretary did let me see the school hall (lovely) and the parents area (also lovely, very welcoming)
• there was a visitors book in the foyer with lots of fab comments from school visitors - arty musicy types visitting for projects with the kids. all positive stuff.
• school sec was vaguely nice.
• while i was there (around 10am) a mum and her 2 kids arrived, sec asked why they were late, mum said 'cos he's been up alf the night chuckin up in 'e'
• nice small school, they've certainly made the most of the space - fab displays etc.

School 2

• head gave me an hour and a half, long chat in his office, then comprehensive tour of the school, saw the kids in action - lovely, peaceful, happy, bvut not totally lifeless and military either - there was some fun there.
• saw a hebrew lesson with some Year 6s. Excellent.
• met the PTA mums - very nice, very welcoming, some of them had been to the school themselves!
• got to see every single year group in action
• ooo and the class sizes! only around 15-20 kids in each class!
• and they said ds could come in for a day before he starts, meet up with the 'buddy' they would give him ( I met the buddy today - perfect- just like my ds!) and spend a day getting to know people.

ok. so maybe I've made my mind up already.

School 1 has a place for DS but not DD

School 2 has places for both.

what does everyone think?

Only problem is the 2nd one is a faith school, not our faith, and they want ds to wear a symbol of that faith as its part of the school uniform. I'm not too sure about that tbh. discussed briefly with head and he thought ds would feel naked without it as all the other boys would have one on.

am mulling that one over.

and finally.....how to gently break this to ds so he doesn't have a bad experience? I feel another thread coming on!

id personally go for the faith school, sounds fab.

yes it does doesn't it!
thanks

I think the faith school sounds fab, and it is great that the school has made your family feel so welcome. The fact that there is a place for both of your children is fantastic. It will help them to be together, and of course you for the school run.

Is there any chance that you can talk informally to some of the non-Jewish parents at the school to figure out if their kids feel different?

yes, it was great and they really did go out of their way to make me welcome - i saw every single year group in action, i went into their classes with the head completely unannounced, i met the learning mentor, the deupty head, the TAs, the PTA, the school secretary! it ws just great.

my children go to a totally fab faith school and we aren't religious at all. Strangely none of the parents I know are either and yet the first criteria for entrance is church going families and its rare that criteria 2 kids get a look in. My children do come home singing churchy songs etc but its a small part of their school life. The education they get is second to none, the sense of community is amazing - DD1 went to a different school for 2 years before we moved here and there's just no comparison. Go for it.