Moving schools in year 3

[Ratbagcatbag]

Hello

I'm wondering if anyone can help please?

I'm wanting to move my daughter from her current school to one of two if possible in the area.

I've spoken to admissions who've said they don't have waiting list information, but when I asked the school the waiting list length they couldn't share that information.

School one do have space in normal times but due to corona virus restrictions they've said they are full.
However they would happily add me to a waiting list but I need to apply through admissions and it will get rejected.

School 2 have said no space and won't say how long the waiting list is.

If I get rejected how do I go on a waiting list? And can I go on waiting lists for both schools through admissions?

Sorry for all the questions. I'd hugely appreciate some advice on how it all works please.

You need to apply (to both) and be rejected in order to be added to the waiting list (for both). Once you are on the waiting list, they will tell you your position at that point in time on the waiting list. You might be number 1 at that point, but pushed down the list if someone who is closer/with a sibling is added to the list - it's not done in order of application.

Brilliant.

Thank you so much for that.

So if I apply and get rejected do I ring the school to be added to the wait list or do I do that through admissions too?

Darn it on order of application though. I was hoping that might help.

When we moved last year, we applied for school places and were automatically added to waiting list for DD1 whose year was full. She was originally number 9, as 8 people lived closer. She then moved up to number 1, as her sister was offered a place in a different year group (as siblings come over distance). She was then admitted to the school on appeal, as the Appeal board felt the circumstances warranted her being given a place regardless of the year being full. So waiting lists can really vary.

If the school has space normally, I'm predicting no or very short waiting list.

You'll either be added automatically or contacted asking if you want to be added, it will happen as a response to your application being rejected. You'll also be given the opportunity to appeal the decision - do you mind sharing why you're looking at moving her?

I think some schools hold their own waiting list (because they will know sooner than the council when a space opens up). It really does depend on how things are done in your LA and the schools.

As she is year 3, you are much more likely to win an appeal.

Infant appeals only win when the admissions team or school have made an error in the process as there is a strict limit on the number of children allowed in the class.

Her current school despite being brilliant some years ago is dreadful.
Poor communication, kids marking their own work, it's a tiny school with lots of children having left. It's causing issues with friendship groups and bullying.
To get them to move reading bands it's a five email conversation. It's just poor. People have complained to the board but unfortunately the chair has been best friends with the head. It's really just not great.

We're lucky that we have at least 10 primary schools in the area. The one she goes to now wasn't catchment.

I have no idea how I'd appeal though if we are rejected. I assume we will just have to wait.

The reason I picked her current primary is that it's a feeder for the better secondary school in the area.
First choice to move to means we end up bottom criteria but they have an awesome feeder secondary.
Second choice is the other feeder for the secondary I'd like.
School one is better for primary though.
Schools are all faith schools.

When you get your rejection letter, you'll get the form to fill in to go to appeal. You need to write your argument, and then you'll get your chance to put these points across to the appeals board. It's a formal process but the people involved want to best for your child, but they also need to access the impact on the class.

Thank you so much again.

I really appreciate your help.

I will be back when the rejection letter comes in. :) they seem an incredibly lovely school.

My worry is they would argue that most schools in the area could offer what I want. So what makes my appeal to that school special if that makes sense. But one bridge at a time. I've done the application formally to get the ball rolling.

So...
Current school - feeder for better secondary (let's call it secondary school A)
First choice - feeder for awesome secondary (let's call it secondary school B)
Second choice - is this a feeder for secondary A or B or something different?

I think you need to look at the likelihood of getting into the secondaries, too. Does attending a feeder school mean you're higher on the priority list?

And is there any guarantee these other primaries have better communication?

And is your daughter experiencing any bullying? That could well sway the appeals board, rather than just saying that you no longer like the school IYSWIM.

It's worth bearing in mind that you'll still be on the waiting list regardless of if you decide to go to appeal. And even if you lose the appeal, you will still be able to be in the waiting list.

Also... if your second favourite option appeal is first, and you win that, you won't also win the second appeal as your reasons for leaving are covered by winning the first appeal.

If we appeal and fail can we still go on the waiting list? Are they likely to be annoyed we appealed so we never move up the list and get offered a place?

Thank you again for your help.

Good luck! It's so hard to know what to do sometimes

I think we are having some cross posts and no they won't be annoyed, you'll be treated no differently.

Waiting lists and appeals are seperate. Waiting list is order of how well you meet entrance criteria. Appeal is saying the normal criteria should be ignored.

So

Current school - feeder for really good secondary school.( school A) Literally on doorstep. Can see it from my house. Priority for feeder comes immediately after looked after children. Will get into school A no questions.

Primary option 1- decent secondary feeder (school B). Miles away. Would still apply for school A and even though last on list we should make it in on crow flies, worst case school B is still a really decent option.

Primary option 2 - feeder school for school A - will get a place without question as comes immediately after looked after children.

Comms are much better at both schools. Have had a friend move her child from our current school to option 1 and the difference is incredible. School 2 also know children who go there. Slightly more run down but still got very good feedback from parents.

Exclusive reasons to appeal for option one. Continuation of faith school - but we aren't church goers and it's going from CofE to catholic.
Piano which she does through school is ran at both current school and option 1 school but doesn't seem like a positive reason to appeal.
Ongoing friendship issues is definitely a problem. She needs a much bigger school than where she is. Some lower level elements of bullying have happened and there are a couple of pupils who aren't managed well that have hurt her and I haven't been happy with schools response.
Poor ofsted recently too. Which pulled them up on not pushing achieving children.
Do any of those count at all for appeal?

I really appreciate your time with me on this.

Current school put nothing in writing. You send an email. Head catches you in the playground to feedback. Or it's done over the phone. So haven't got anything to document the issues. As they have been verbal conversations and calls.

So I would say your main point for arguing is the fact it's a small school and she has no real friends and that she's being bullied, including being physically hurt. A fresh start at a bigger primary school will give her the opportunity to mix with lots of children to make a good friendship group before going to secondary. How has the bullying affected her? Sleep issues? Wetting herself? Lack of confidence? Not wanting to go to school? Say you've tackled this with the head but the situation isn't improving.

I wouldn't mention the word Ofsted, but would say you don't feel your child is being pushed to the best of their ability, and that the communication is poor. Try to come up with some evidence for this too, like the reading book example, and say you've tried working with the school to address your concerns.

Praise the new school and explain how this school can better suit the needs of your daughter.

I would start writing this now, so when your seemingly inevitable rejection letter arrives you can return the appeal form straight away.

Also, the in school piano lessons I wouldn't mention per se although you could say she's musical and they have a good music programme or something. There might be a waiting list for lessons at the new school so she might not be able to start straight away.

My experience with school appeals is moving into a new LA and being allocated a school far away for my child (also yr3) who suffered with anxiety and wetting issues, & we wanted her to go to a primary school to make friends with children before heading to secondary, so a bit different from you We appealed 3 schools, but had already found out we had won a space at the 1st before the 2nd and 3rd appeals. Obviously you don't choose the order they are heard in, so if you really want one over the other, I'd only appeal for that one, for now. (Unless you have to appeal within a certain length of time after being refused a place)

Thank you so much.

You've given me so much to go on. :)

She's upset about school and saying she has no friends, mainly when she falls out with her main friend. So I can build on that. She was in the keyworker bubble and enjoyed it. Now we are back to full schooling. The tears and frustration and comments about no one playing with her are coming back in.

It's a mixed year class and the boy who has previously hurt her is in year 4 so now they're back together.

I mentioned piano as the teacher who teaches it as my daughters school also teaches it at the new school I want so we'd get continuation.

I've emailed the class teacher asking how she's settling in and about the work for this term. Yet again. Nothing.

In fact. I'm thinking the fact they refuse to put anything in email may now actually stand me in good stead for the appeal.

Bless her, poor little thing.

When you write it your case, wait a few days before reading through it and hopefully you'll see where you need to add bits. Definitely something to write over a few days than rushing it!

Where do you live? And are you on state school waiting lists? If so, have you thought about independent education?