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Original poster

not so jolly phonics!!!

35 replies

frangipan · 17/09/2007 19:18

OK I'm no expert but DS2 has just started Yr1. He is a late june child so turned 5 just before the end of reception. They used the jolly phonics in reception for the first time at the school last september when DS2 started.

BUT........ he can't read...at all.....despite every effort at home to support him.

AND........while he recognises most letters that are written down ie if we read the alphabet........he only knows their sound not the actual letter.... iyswim. For example he will say 'a' as in apple but doesn't know it as the letter A as in 'Ay'.

Now I don't know if this is age related or teaching related but DS1 was taught the 'old fashioned' way and he is a fab reader and was reading by the end of reception, he is now in YR3 , but then he is an early sept child. He was taught 'Ay' is for apple. 'Bee' is for ball etc etc

I just don't feel like this jolly phonics has done DS1 any favours at all, he doesn't want to read and gets panicky when I am reading him a story if I ask him what any of the letters are let alone the words.

Any advice on how I can help him would be dearly appreciated.
Thanx in anticipation.

OP posts:

PondusLector · 17/09/2007 19:27

I wouldn't be too concerned, I think it is probably down to the July birthday rather than the Jolly Phonics. Jolly Phonics teaches all the 44 phonemes quite effectively. He will probably catch up. Just try not to stress when reading with hime and concentrate on the fun aspects of stories for the minute.

ladymuck · 17/09/2007 19:27

Does he bring reading books home from school? And is he able to sound out any words at all (eg sat, pat etc).

Tbh with jolly phonics they don't teach the name of the letter - and I'm not sure it is that essential in reading, though I have to say that it is more helpful in spelling. It is a phonic system after all. If he knows the sounds of each of the latters then that is a start. But when he comes tot the combination "ai", he will have been taught that that is the long a, so teling him that "a" = "Ay" may confuse him at this stage (uslaly that gets introduced once they are reading mroe confidently.

Before making too many comparisons between your children do bear the difference in age in mind - ds2 is only 5 and a quarter, so is the same age as ds1 would have been at Christmas in his reception year.

PondusLector · 17/09/2007 19:28

him

rantinghousewife · 17/09/2007 19:30

It's worth knowing this but (and not applicable to you), if your child is in speech therapy, they will be taught to speak using phonics, it is quite usual for children who've had speech therapy to have advanced reading ages. I much prefer phonics for the teaching of reading.

Original poster

frangipan · 17/09/2007 19:40

thnax everyone, that puts my mind at ease a bit. He does bring books home which i read to him but he isn't able to read any of the words himself.

I think part of the problem also is that I was taught in the same way as DS1 and despite buying and reading the accompanying jolly phonics books I'm not fluent in the art jolly phonics so possibly not supporting him teh right way. Have got parents evening in a few wees so I'll have a chat to his teacher.

Incidently... at the end of reception at parents evening I was told he wasn't at the expected level in anything!!! [SAD]

HE'S VERY CUTE AND CUDDLY THOUGH [GRIN]

OP posts:

Original poster

frangipan · 17/09/2007 19:41

weeks not wees

OP posts:

cat64 · 17/09/2007 19:42

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

rantinghousewife · 17/09/2007 19:44

I'm sure he'll catch up, ds couldn't talk properly at that age and he's doing really well at Upper school now, above his key stage in all his core subjects. Dd (nearly 5) and in reception is starting phonics and she seems not to be picking it up but, I'm not worried, she'll pick it up when she's ready.

mimsum · 17/09/2007 19:51

Neither of my boys could read at all in the first term of Y1 and they were both relatively old for the year (Jan and Nov birthdays respectively). They just weren't ready to read and that was despite being surrounded by books at home, loving having stories read to them and both dh and me being very early readers ourselves. However, by the summer term in Y1 it 'clicked' and they were away - both love reading and both have reading ages well above their chronological ages. He doesn't need to know the letter names at this stage and it will just confuse him - as long as he associates reading with fun it will click when he's ready

francagoestohollywood · 17/09/2007 19:53

No advice frangipan, but my ds is in the same position as yours. He's a july child anbd started reception in January. He still can't recognize "and" and "the"... Basically he has his head in the clouds. Bless.

Jacanne · 17/09/2007 19:58

I agree with Cat64, I was a Reception teacher - learning the names of the letters will not help him at all if he is struggling. It is good that he knows the sounds, he just has to start trying to put the sounds together to make words. I would get him to practise (if you're not already) puting the sounds of 3 letter words together and breaking 3 letter words down into their sounds.

DD1 has bought home a home-made game from school. There are 2 pieces of card with 3 white squares in a line on them. She has the 26 initial sounds of the alphabet written on white cards the same size as the 3 white squares. The game is to try and make a 3 letter word using the sounds and the other person has to read it. Then you swap round and the other person makes the words. It has really worked well with her - we have started adding "sh" "ch" and "th" and some long vowel sounds such as "ai" and "ee" to make some 4 letter words too.

Just an idea that might help - it's always much easier if it's a game

islandofsodor · 17/09/2007 20:26

I used JP with great success with my dd and they do teach letter names (or should anyway) but in the context that this is the sound a but its letter name is A. Then when you move on to ai you learn that when 2 vowels go walking the first does the talking.

I agree with the others thart maybe it just hasn't clikced yet, it took dd ages to blend though I did start when she was 3. Buying the DVD helped and also one of the animal characters in the DVD has trouble at first and gets frustrated compared to another charcter who gets it easily. They make a big point of it taking longer sometimes which might help his confidence.

Budababe · 17/09/2007 20:29

DS learnt that "Ay" is the name of the letter and 'ah' is the sound. Seemed to work although he is sometimes to lazy to sound out a word!

Boco · 17/09/2007 20:31

It's hard for those june babies - my dd is one too, and the september children are so much further ahead, but they've had an extra 2 terms of reading, which is a long time.

Just go at his pace - he'll get there.

tortoiseSHELL · 17/09/2007 20:34

We've got some Magic Key dvds, which the children love, which have a little bit of phonics in them - might help approach it in a different way? Or there are those Jolly Phonics workbooks which have lots of colouring.

Blu · 17/09/2007 20:35

I don't think it is unusual for children not to be able to read at the start of Yr1!

I think DS only started on blended sounds in Yr1

But stick to the sounds the letters make, not the name. As one MN child said after being taught the letter names "but double-yew starts with a 'duh'"...v confusing for them!

jennifersofia · 17/09/2007 20:48

Thank goodness he knows the letter sounds and not the names! I teach Y1 (Jolly Phonics) and I often have children get really really stuck because they are trying to sound out words by using the letter names instead of the sounds. Give it time. I am sure that the main reason that it hasn't 'clicked' is his age. Many of my 'young' boys only start getting how to read words about mid-way through the year.
I would ask the teacher for a copy of the jolly phonics brochure that tells you how to pronounce each sound, and ideally, the action that goes with the sound. These could be practiced with your son (not in a demanding way, more like 'can we remember the actions for the sounds of different fruits in the supermarket while we are doing the shopping' type of thing) and you can also play little games like 'can you touch your 'luh ehhh gg'? (leg).
It is fantastic that he has got your support!

Original poster

frangipan · 17/09/2007 21:14

thanks again for your words of wisdom!!
I'm not putting any pressure on him to read, we have a sticker chart going for reading the alphabet and a seperate one for 'sounding out'.

The only guide I've got to go on is DS1, so while i'm not comparing DS1 an 2 as children I guess I do look at which stage they did what to make sure that DS2 isn't struggling IYSWIM.

He loves stories and I read 2-3 stories each night, unless its late when its only 1!

I know it will click eventually with him, but we have parents evenings 3 times a year and when thay tell you your child isn't at the expected level in anything yet I think I heard "do something about it at home", rather than , "he's not yet achieved the expected level but all children develop at different rates and he will catch up, here are some ways to encourage his literacy etc etc..."

Maybe if I'd been a teacher rather than a dentist I'd have sussed it by now.....

DS has lovely teeth though......

OP posts:

francagoestohollywood · 17/09/2007 21:30

lol frangipan, I feel the same at parents evening. I feel they are making me feel guilty for not coaching ds enough. Have to admit I don't really do much about it...

rantinghousewife · 17/09/2007 21:33

Well, me neither. I do have an acquantance who spends all of her time making sure her two dcs do 'lessons' at home. She even used to make the eldest colour in within all the lines at the age of two. Not really my scene, I'd much rather my two were in the garden getting mucky.

Reallytired · 17/09/2007 21:36

I would stick with the Jolly phonics. Try and do five to ten minutes a day of practicing the letter sounds and blending simple three letter words (Constant-vowel-Constant) words like cat, dog or son.

If your son can't blend then model the blending to him. It helps to say the first sound loudly and then whispher the others quickly. See if your son can "hear" the word. Games like saying where is the b-o-x or find me a p-e-n help phonic awareness if your son has had enough of print.

The website www.starfall.com is also good.

tissy · 17/09/2007 21:39

can I make a suggestion?

Try spelling rude words with him, to give him the idea:

p +oo = poo

w +ee = wee

b + u +m =bum.......

this approach really inspitred dd!

tissy · 17/09/2007 21:40

inspired

stealthsquiggle · 17/09/2007 21:41

Your OP says he gets panicky if you press him at home - which sounds to me like he is just plain not ready. It doesn't matter what the school do or don't want you to do, if you were to push it you would risk just putting him off more.

As for the letter sounds - DS learnt by phonics and is now quite happily spelling by letter name (He learnt by "it's name is 'ay' and it says 'a'") - funnily enough he knows the alphabet largely thanks to the intensely annoying leapfrog caterpillar he was given as a baby and which I really really hated at the time - but when he is struggling to remember a letter name he still sings the song to himself!

francagoestohollywood · 17/09/2007 21:45

I think I'll try the "poo" spelling tomorrow

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