Are her hands really tied?

[lolbrador]

Got a bit on an issue with a boy in dd1 class. They are age 8. I'm not the only one with the issue, the majority of parents are at the end of their tether with this.

Dd was crying this morning as she was so scared to go into school as one lad is so out of control. The other day he smashed a window (not the first time), he is violent towards other pupils, throws furniture around and tried to punch dd and a friend yesterday. He wasn't successful in doing this to dd but got her friend.

Friends mum went into school and has been told that the head teachers "hands are tied". Parents, including myself, have flagged this up numerous times and all we are told is that they are aware of the situation,

I'm trying to be empathetic as there are clearly some ongoing and underlying issues here, but surely something has to be done when safety is jeopardised?

What's really bugging me is that they are a bloody "rights respecting school" and one fundamental right is the "right to feel safe"

Anyone been in the same boat??!

We had this (I'm in Scotland). One of the mums followed the complaints procedure all the way to the council but we were told their hands were tied. He had a dedicated support worker and was never meant to be unsupervised but he totally was. It all came to a head when he was going to the bathroom without supervision and started locking boys in the toilets and pulling down their trousers to prod them etc. We only found out when one bou went back to class, the teacher told him off for taking so long and he just said "well X locked me in and pulled down my pants". At that point, one parent called police and social services and he was then removed from the school 2 months later.
It does take a lot to remove a primary aged child.

Thanks for the reply. Sounds like a grin and bear it situation though. He's also meant to have ana support but rarely does. It's getting to the point that I'm wondering if it's worth sending dd as she's learning nothing

The thing is, there is absolutely nowhere for the child to go to.

I had a similar situation to Lulualla. The situation was resolved when a parent phoned the police. SS (who had been involved from the start) suddenly got their act together and the LA found emergency funding from somewhere to pay for a full time 1:1 (including cover at lunchtime). Sadly the child was taken into care some weeks later. The mum who phoned the police did the poor child a huge favour.

I felt really bad about what happened in our school. The wee boy had been removed from his family and had been in care. He was adopted by a family in our town and started at our school. It was start... but he didn't get the support he needed. If his support worked in the school actually did his job then the kid would have had a chance maybe, but the support worker was always being asked to do other things or monitor the whole playground etc, so couldn't give the child the supervision needed.
The kid obviously needed help having been a victim of abuse but I felt that being in the school would be better for him... but only with the right support. The school failed him, and then once the toilet situation came out he simply couldn't stay. It still took months for action to be taken, but I can u understand it. One of my son's was locked in the toilet by him and the police visited us and told me that my son now has a file somewhere calling him a 'vulnerable person' because this happened to him. I'm quite angry.

*it was his fresh start

The head's hands are not really tied. She still has the right to permanent exclude the child as they are failing to conform to the behaviour code and secondly are representing a danger to himself and other pupils.

I wonder whether this child is a looked after child when there will be an immense amount of pressure to keep him in the school. That however does not stop the headteacher from taking action ultimately if there is nothing happening to help in getting this child the help that he clearly needs.

If he is looked after or adopted he will get pp funding. DC would also get a priority place at the school if looked after. The school could urgently get him assessed for SEND and get funding for his needs this way. It’s obviously urgent. This process could recommend a special school and it sounds like a lot of intervention is needed. The Head can permanently exclude. The Heads hands are not tied. If there is no “statement” there is no extra money BUT most LAs have centrally held budgets that are not devolved. This is for SEND children who don’t attend mainstream schools. The Head should be negotiating for some of this.

There is NO excuse for DC not being monitored when staff are allocated on a 1:1 basis. That’s simply poor management and not acceptable. Children like this have severe issues and complex needs. In my view these cannot be addressed without medical and educational interventions. A special school is probably the right place. It’s not fair to demonise DC with these needs. They deserve better.

Ha, I could have written this post op. Having almost the exact same issues at my dds primary school. Due to a policy of inclusion despite the fact that almost every child in p1-4 has been assaulted by this boy he won't be removed from the school. A ft support teacher has just been assigned but that hasn't stopped the violence yet. The P1 class are all scared of what he'll do next. It's absolutely appalling that children are meant to just get on with it when as adults we would not put up with this in the workplace.
Imagine being punched on the way to the toilet by your colleague who was then told to go play candy crush for the rest of the day to calm down and was back sitting next to you the following day! Ludicrous.

Had this when my eldest was eight. Several children, who also happened to be the gentler kind who don't like rough and tumble and don't make trouble (easy targets) were repeated assaulted by a particular boy who even smashed my DDs glasses into her face, cutting her eyebrow.

The school were shit anyway and we didn't stay. But it took several of us going into school together to complain, to get him temporarily removed while they attempted to put something into place. Before then, we complained singly and were fobbed off constantly. I definitely recommend the mob approach. Calm but insistent mob, stronger together. No pitchforks.

Thanks for all your replies, I would say it's reassuring but it's the complete opposite of that. It's horrifying just how many children seem to be experiencing this in school, a place where you automatically trust that they are safe.

The child in question is definitely not LAC, accommodated or adopted. His brother is doing the same to 6 year olds.

I stood next to the mum at a school event, very busy event. She's very nice. However her two boys were lying on the floor wrestling with each other and she just stood there, looking on fondly.

There is a specialist school around 15 minutes from us, but apparently the process to get in is staggering.

I'm really not a judgemental person and I do try to be sympathetic. It's just wearing thin.

we have a couple that have assaulted kids and staff and not been excluded, from what i gather they will do the utmost to keep them in school as they get fined if they are suspended or expelled
and with all this 'keep them in mainstream education' special schools are over whelmed because many have closed

There is a fine if after an IRP has taken place and decided the exclusion was not legal and school still refuse to have the child back. But these cases are few and far between.

There are no fines for exclusions or suspensions adhering to the guidelines.

The decision lies with the Head.

Thanks all. There's a meeting been called with some parents (no teachers) in January so it's obviously not just me who is anxious about the whole situation.

I have asked he ht for a copy of the behaviour policy for the school and a copy of the risk assessments carried out. I understand she may not be able to give me the risk assessments due to confidentiality. I've also been online and downloaded the exclusion policy. I've really got the bit between my teeth on this one, don't know what's come over me!!

I'm usually a very level headed person, but I can't help feeling that something will only be done when someone gets seriously injured.

I always feel so sad in cases like this as it can so easily be the child that gets vilified and excluded when in fact the issue is one of inadequate support and sometimes the child themselves having significant adverse experiences. All children need and deserve to be safe. But the school’s responsibility is to put the support in place and make sure all supervising staff are well trained in the child’s potential triggers, warning signs, and de-escalation measures and restraint if necessary, and that appropriate supervision is in place. All the children deserve better, including the one exhibiting the dangerous behaviour.