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Original poster

Parents- and particularly private school parents...

65 replies

BertrandRussell · 20/06/2019 15:11

.....because I am pretty sure this could not happen in a state school (although I am prepared to be told I am wrong). How would you feel about a completely unqualified (but very experienced) 18 year old taking a significant part in lessons in a specific subject for your year 7 and 8s? I’m a bit bothered about outing-so I don’t want to be too specific. But it’s a vocational subject that a lot of them will be taking at GCSE, and he is quite often taking a group on his own, like a TA would. He knows what he’s doing and checks back with the teacher but I’m not sure he should be doing this. And neither does he- even though he’s loving it!

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Original poster
BertrandRussell · 21/06/2019 14:41

I’ll mention the union thing to him-and the safeguarding issue. He told me last night that he said he couldn’t do something that he felt went against the safeguarding he had learned as a sports coach and the teacher said that was fine but apparently “looked surprised”.

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monsieurmarius · 21/06/2019 14:50

I think as long as he's good it could work quite well. Our private school employs french and Spanish students aged 18-20 to help and cover some lessons and they've made an enormous difference to some pupils' attainment and engagement with the subject.

I know it's not quite the same thing but parents rave about him.

Hope he enjoys it!

ooooohbetty · 21/06/2019 14:55

I've heard that Academies are starting to employ unqualified teachers. As others have said I'd be okay with it if he was good at it and crb checked etc. I bet the pupils love him.

yoursworried · 21/06/2019 15:18

This is exactly the scenario in my private school right now. I wonder if it's the same place actually because your details are very similar indeed.
Anyway, I think it's entirely inappropriate and while our 19 year old is having a lovely time it's too much pressure for him and there are many aspects in which he needs training.

SilentSister · 21/06/2019 15:19

Private school parent here, and I wouldn't have a problem with it at all, particularly in Drama, and particularly for Years 7 & 8. Young teachers are great, they have the passion and are very able to connect with that age group, also we need more male teachers in the profession. If he is enjoying it, the children will be too. My DD's have done private tutoring with no teaching experience, and have achieved great results, good on him for taking up the challenge.

As an aside, I don't think private schools are very unionised are they?? They certainly never come out on strike.

Dapplegrey · 21/06/2019 16:52

Bertrand you are one of the most outspoken opponents of private schools on mumsnet so I’m very surprised that your ds is working at one.
Good god, he might catch posh.
Isn’t this nearly as bad as your dc going out with a Tory or, omg, a Brexiteer?

Seeline · 21/06/2019 17:01

Both my DCs private schools have gap year students - subjects vary but often music and PE which I would have thought would be far more risky than drama!

JoJoSM2 · 21/06/2019 17:46

I was keen to become a teacher and started tutoring at 17. Many parents found their children were more responsive to me than a middle aged stern teacher. Tbh, I did feel out of my depth in some situations involving behaviour management, though.

As a parent Id be happy with what you're describing as long as there's proper teaching alongside it.

And not to offend some very good TAs, but some can be a waste of space and a keen, smart teenager can definitely do a better job.

Original poster
BertrandRussell · 21/06/2019 18:00

@Dapplegrey- the irony is not lost on me. Grin I think of it as infiltration- he is more than posh enough to pass unnoticed among the scions of the ruling classes. He is being very satisfactorily outraged by some of what he sees- and has already bagged a pile of stuff destined for a skip for his old school. You will, I am sure be amused to know that I’m taking the horse box to collect it next week.......

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CruCru · 21/06/2019 19:03

I am a private school parent and I would be fine with this. I think in one of those shows about Grammar schools earlier this year (channel 4?), one of the sixth form girls taught a class of year 7s. So this could also happen in a Grammar school.

Are the children learning lots and having fun? Sounds brilliant if so.

TSSDNCOP · 21/06/2019 19:03

I can tell you that recruiting drama teachers is very difficult.

Given they are Y7 and 8 I think it's better they are doing any drama than none.

If he's being paid, he'll be insured. In fact if he was volunteering he'd be insured. Schools have insurance to the teeth.

If a parent complains, and frankly I wouldn't if my child was coming home raving about how great drama is, it's on the school not him.

It is surprising that he's not had safeguarding training. Did the school run the DBS or have they ported it or has he got a certificate registered with the DBS update service? They could have a problem there.

Dapplegrey · 21/06/2019 19:06

Ah, he’s gone there undercover.
Has he stirred up insurrection amongst the students against the wicked system of private education or is he filing his observations for use in the future?

jennymanara · 21/06/2019 19:19

I did this many years ago. I was very good at it, but did eventually resent how little I was paid for the job in comparison to qualified teachers.

Danglingmod · 21/06/2019 19:31

Absolutely standard for private schools to use gap year students as TAs and as boarding assistants.

Equally, both the state school and work in and the one I went to decades ago has/had year 12s who were interested in teaching acting as TAs in all subject areas, building up to teaching whole lessons (usually year 7).

Not an issue at all and he should be insured - he also should have up to date safeguarding training on school's individual safeguarding policies...

dairymilkmonster · 21/06/2019 20:56

@bertrandrussell I would certainly want qualified specialist teachers for core subjects. For pre gcse drama I would be quite happy with your ds as you describe him. I am a private school parent. Our preprep had a gap year student as an extra TA type person a couple of years sgo: she was BRILLIANT. She went on to do medicine at Oxford - clearly clever but no teaching experience.

The teacher who 'taught' drama gcse at my comp (90s) was a qualified teacher, but really taught PE. He took over when a 'real' drama teacher left when I was in yr8. I had him yr8-11 and he was utterly useless.

sendsummer · 22/06/2019 08:21

Sixth formers in most schools do lunchtime and after school clubs for younger pupils, including performing arts. So similar and no big deal apart from the CRB / checks needed as he is from outside the school.

Original poster
BertrandRussell · 22/06/2019 10:41

“Ah, he’s gone there undercover.
Has he stirred up insurrection amongst the students against the wicked system of private education or is he filing his observations for use in the future?”
He’s biding his time, @Dapplegrey. All grist to the mill.......

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Original poster
BertrandRussell · 22/06/2019 10:45

“Sixth formers in most schools do lunchtime and after school clubs for younger pupils,”

I don’t think this is quite the same- he is actually employed. As far as I can see, he is being asked to do anything a TA would- but without the training! We had a chat just now, and he’s going to ask about safeguarding training.

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NataliaOsipova · 22/06/2019 10:50

Drama? If he’s doing a good job and is ultimately under a teacher’s supervision, I wouldn’t have a problem with that. If it were Physics, I’d probably demur.

sendsummer · 22/06/2019 10:52

Which is in fact what sixth formers end up by doing, supplementing what paid unqualified and qualified staff can offer, especially pre GCSE syllabus. The difference is that in the private sector they are more likely to reimburse gap year students for doing the same. One of my friend’s DSs did equivalent in a UK state school (with boarding) and taught maths as well as PE to the younger years.

MaybeitsMaybelline · 22/06/2019 10:52

I couldn’t get upset about this for drama.

AlaskanOilBaron · 23/06/2019 11:55

I'd be happy with it.

Bookishandblondish · 23/06/2019 12:48

It’s interesting that so many people seem to be Ok with this because it’s drama and not math or physics.

With practical exercises, I’d have thought drama was a topic where boundaries can easily be blurred....

WhyAmIPayingFees · 23/06/2019 12:51

Interesting situation. My own view is that if the person knows the stuff and has passed the safeguarding checks then there should not be an issue. At the risk of being flamed I think that having the knowledge and a good attitude including lots of enthusiasm counts for a lot more than a PGCE.

ladygracie · 23/06/2019 12:52

He should have had safeguarding training at his school. And our new staff have health & safety training too.
I think it’s fine as long as he’s happy and doesn’t feel uncomfortable with anything he’s asked to do. My 18 year old works st my school and is far more competent than some much older staff. She works with younger children so wouldn’t be left alone because of ratios.