to worry about the maths/science teaching standards

[etiennemama]

I'm a foreign national who completed my PGCE in England. One major cultural shock for me when I started my teaching was the lack of subject specialists in the state schools.

I'm from a country where schools only employ subject specialists to teach pupils from primary to sixth form. We have no problem with recruiting STEAM teachers, partly because maths is a mandatory subject at A levels. It is hard to believe that not only are there very few maths/sciences specialists in primary schools, the government here even allows teachers who only achieved a C grade in GCSE to teach maths ( One can get a C or 4 in GCSE maths, if they manage to get 21% of the answers right.).

There's also a lot of obsession with the Finnish education system in the British media. Yes, they have very little homework and more play time; yes, their schools can decide their own curriculum. But how many of the British children are educated by highly qualified teachers? In Finland, nursery teachers are all required to hold Bachelor's degrees. Teachers of reception and above are required to hold Master's degrees. Are we able to match these?

I hope I didn't offend someone. The above is just my observation from my teaching experience here. I think our maths/science education is in a vicious circle at the moment.

I thought German schools were highly stratified starting age 7, so a lot of vocational training and most wouldn't have done equivalent of maths A-level. I get impression the British system has more equity in it, allows for late bloomers, etc.

Macaroni46 - I totally agree. OP I think your emotive post is written without any real understanding of the education system. I would suggest you have simply gathered together bits of information from the Internet and posted on Education because you think everyone will support your thinking around poor teaching of 'STEAM' subjects.

I wonder if in "your country" a nursery teacher is paid a salary that reflects the qualifications held? To demand a degree, which here in the UK now costs around £30,000 to then be paid minimum wage, which is the standard pay for a nursery nurse is just wrong.
That is the problem with education in this country, the pay does not match the qualifications held. That is why there is such a lack of specialist teachers - because they can earn so so much more elsewhere. Why would a science or maths grad, people in high demand, go straight for a job paying a starting salary of just £23700 when they have to work 60 hours a week, including weekends? Most graduate schemes pay more for that for just training, then rising to £40k+ when qualified.

There should be more specialists. 100% agree. But they wont get them until the pay increases and the workload (specifically paperwork and reports) decreases.

I think the issue about qualified maths and science teachers is a secondary problem. We can’t expect all primary teachers to have degrees in those subjects. That said, I do think a higher level of unederatNding than a C at GCSE is probably needed to really grasp a lot of the concepts underpinning what has to be taught in primary maths - those with an A level in maths will be better placed than those with a C at GCSE.

It’s shocking though in Secpndary when non-specialists teach GCSE and A Level. Some of them might be fab teachers and can get anything across well but without the underpinning of actual knowledge themselves, it’s a very different teaching and learning experience.

Here the independent sector tends to win - attracting those with good degrees (not always I know) and these days the unqualified teacher is far rarer so often you’ve got highly qualified subject specialists with great teChing skills.

Teacher turnover and problems recruiting are blighting the experience and outcomes of many children. And it’s getting worse.

@Macaroni46 I'm sorry that my post offended you. I'm sure you are running a successful primary school and dedicated to your role. I also respect that you value the child centred approach. :)

Perhaps I didn't make myself clear - I'm not suggesting that all primary school maths/sciences teachers have to be subject specialists. However, we will definitely benefit from having specialists for Year 4+. My biggest concern is with the current requirement of GCSE maths: for a primary school teacher is a C grade. Personally I find it very low. On the other hand, subject specialists can be equally nurturing and helpful in developing children's soft skills.

Some of my colleagues have left teaching altogether. Salary is one big problem. The constant stress from the profession has caused a lot of damage to our mental health.

Thank you all for your responses and I'm really sorry if my post causes any upsets which was not my intention.

@duckling84 a university course in education/teaching is free in my country. Maybe the UK government should do the same If only!

etiennemama I suspected as much (free university) That is why I hate the UK/Scandi comparisons, there is no fair comparison really.

STEAM is a thing actually, bringing art into STEM

I agree you cannot compare the qualification requirements between countries where in one higher education is free and one where it costs a small fortune.
Also your point about only needing 20-odd% for a grade c - that is for the higher paper. For the foundation paper, 50% is the required pass mark

Well if you don’t earn much, you don’t pay much off from a student loan. No degree should be free. Where would that end? Who is worthy and who is not?

Teachers repeatedly say they don’t like thier jobs. Heads and SLT can be poor and rarely have any management training. As a result no one much wants to be a teacher. Badly led and working with miserable people! Why would you do it?