IB schools

[Orangesandpears]

I''m currently looking into schooling for my dcs abroad with nothing to go on except the internet for guidance.

I wondered - are IB schools always of a minimum standard? IE if a school is IB does that mean it's likely to be good quality to be able to keep the IB label?

Thanks

No, IB just means that they offer the exams that lead to the International Baccalaureate. It's like a school that offers A levels: there are good and horrendous ones. Where are you moving to? You might find a better choice if you also include local schools that offer the local standard exams.

I think there is an accreditation run by IBO but ime the primary years program is particularly variable. How old are your dc?

My daughter's IB 'school' was regularly inspected and had to keep to a much higher standard than the local standards. I say 'school' because it wasn't the whole school more a department within a local school. The IB part ran to much higher standards than the rest of the school. It was also the course that all the smartest kids applied for.

Depends on the country. The IB is perceived to be easier than e.g. the Swiss Matura or German Abitur, ( as there are fewer subjects to study), so outside UK IB is mainly either for foreign kids temporarily living in Germany or for rich kids who struggle with the national exams. IB results at boarding schools like Salem ( the German Eton in so far as it is for the most wealthy and well connected) are very poor compared to leading English IB schools. They surely have some minimum standard, but if you mean by that academic standard, that can be very low, even if the school might be, like Salem, a beautiful castle filled with the children of European royalty and captains of industry.

Thanks! It’s in the US, but a more obscure state hence why I’m struggling to find good information on schools

Oh if it's the US it might well be of a better standard compared to your local high school. I went to school in the US and high school was very undemanding, only teacher assessment, no final exams, but then the school results didn't really matter as universities were only interested in the cognitive ability tests and university entry tests that were taken in test centres outside of school. So if you would like your dc go to US universities, IB woudn't matter, but would make things easier for returning to UK.

I'm not sure where Nelly has got her info but that's really not right. Your high school results DO matter quite a lot for entrance to college/uni. You have a GPA (grade point average) which is an accumulation of ALL the tests/work along the way. You do sit outside exams like the SATS but not all Univerisites require them. I've never heard of a university that would allow entry without a certain GPA and a high school transcript. That's just absurd.

The quality of state provision varies hugely depending on which State you're in. Massachusetts has filed in the past as its own country in the PISA tests because their results were on par with places in Asia. Other States in Deep South score lower than some developing nations. It's fairly hard to generalise with a split that big. The IB is far closer to the US high school curriculum than A levels.

You want to know what the average point score is of the kids leaving then have a look at what your child would need for the universities they want to go to. It's at least a starting point to judge the calibre of the academics.

DD1 did the IB in an American school in U.K. If you are looking for your DC to go to university in UK, your child will need either APs or the IB diploma. Don’t put your DC through the IB if they are not bright all-rounders, as they will struggle. AP exams are much easier. And an American High School Diploma equates to GCSEs in U.K. - iou can’t get in to a British university with just this (it essentially means you just showed up at school for a few years).

An American high school diploma does not not equal GCSEs especially if the student has taken AP exams. You can go straight to Oxbridge from an American High school. This link might be helpful, OP, as it details the entry requirements including AP scores and IB scores.

http://www.ox.ac.uk/sites/files/oxford/field/fielddocument/USSleaflet2016.pdf

The IB is actually really good. It’s far better than a levels or the equivalent where I grew up (Australia). Not sure how it compares to the American education system. But I will definitely he sending my kids to a school that offers IB. I don’t want them wasting their time on a levels.

If city is right in so far as you won't get accepted by a decent uni without a good GPA, 4.0 normally expected (a average). But this 4.0 GPA on its own doesn't matter if you don't have very good results in the extra university tests (SATS and ATE). A GPA of 4.0 in my experience is way easier to achieve than an A average at A levels or 40plus points at IB.

Not sure why A levels would be a waste of time. Majority of UK based uni candidates will sit them, relatively few UK schools offer IB and those that do are mainly private.

The quality of state provision varies hugely depending on which State you're in.

The quality of US public schools can vary even more depending on which town you are in, and the specific school in large cities. If you must consider public schools from a distance, start by looking at which AP courses they offer, the average SAT/ACT scores and, perhaps most important, the median income of the catchment area. Be aware that most public schools outside major cities have strict catchment areas.

an American High School Diploma equates to GCSEs in U.K.

An American high school diploma does not not equal GCSEs especially if the student has taken AP exams.

Both these statements are correct. An American high school diploma in itself, or a GED, is roughly equivalent to "passing" GCSEs. AP tests are roughly equivalent to A Levels; both types of exams cover roughly the content in typical first year American college courses. Bear in mind that most UK university courses are 3 years while the most US college courses are 4 years.

The IB is far closer to the US high school curriculum than A levels.

The IB is closer to the curriculum at a good US high school. Poor US high schools will not mandate (and may not provide) the breadth (or depth) of an IB course.

A GPA of 4.0 in my experience is way easier to achieve than an A average at A levels or 40plus points at IB.

Different high schools will have different GPA distributions. Some schools will have median GPAs below 2.5 (on of a 4.0 scale). Some schools may have median GPAs above 3.5. There is no standardization of grades between different schools. That is one of the reasons why the SAT and ACT are so important. Top American colleges generally look at class ranks rather than raw GPAs.

State secondary education in the US is very different than in the UK. The vast majority of funding is provided at a state or local level and, in most states, the majority of funding is provided locally, typically from property taxes. This often leads to immense disparities in funding between schools in well-to-do neighborhoods and poor neighborhoods. Even within the same state, around the same city, one school might have three times the per-student funding of a school just a few miles distant.

Some American high schools don't offer even the Calculus AB AP course (effectively a subset of the Maths A Level) and cannot educate students to either A Level or IB standards. Other high schools offer 20+ AP courses and will have top cohorts who take 6+ AP exams. The tremendous inequality in the US public school system results in some very poor schools but also some schools which quite possibly provide better opportunities for high achievers than any UK state school.

American here, expat96 is correct that US schools vary incredibly widely from place to place and often within cities too. I wouldn't trust that offering the IB or any other particular curriculum meant that a given school actually offered a good quality education.

That said, the IB is still an uncommon enough qualification here (Universities all know what it is and respect it, but the average person on the street might not.) that I would guess that schools offering it would tend to be relatively good, just because they would need to be relatively on top of things in order to implement an entire non-standard (vs "regular" US high school classes) curriculum.

Thanks again everyone.

Are the Americans here able to advise somewhere I could look to read more about school quality? I’m looking at private schools.

We’re relocating for DH’s Work and the logistics are killing me

The resources available will really depend on where you are looking.

There are various regionally-based accreditation bodies for private schools (My school in California was accredited by WASC - the Western Association of Schools and Colleges). Many states allow schools to operate without accreditation from these bodies if they meet certain, usually lower, standards, though. Getting accredited by these bodies doesn't tell you all that much about a school, but it's a place to start.

If you share the state we can all be a lot more helpful.

State and city would allow us to be more specific. However, if you prefer to wade through the morass yourself, googling 'best private high schools america' gives lots of lists. I would take each of the lists with a grain of salt, but any schools mentioned are unlikely to be total duds.

Do keep in mind that, depending on the area, the best public high schools can be even "better" than the best private options. You can do a lot with $25,000 per student when you have a thousand students in a year group, and a school with an excellent reputation often attracts a disproportionate number of ambitious parents to its catchment area.

Also, with public schools you don't have to worry about passing the ISEE or otherwise jumping through hoops to get a place as you would at most good private schools. You just have to buy/rent in the appropriate catchment area.

Oh, one more tip, since you're looking at private schools: a "prep school" in the US is a private secondary school that aims to send all or almost all of its graduates to college (which is what we call university) and is therefore at least somewhat academically selective. It's not a term we use with reference to primary level education at all. I remember being confused by this difference when I first encountered it.