school finances situation in your child’s school.

[kafkesque]

Letter received today:

Updating you about school finances
I am sure you will have heard through news and topical radio/television programmes about the crises in school funding and I felt it important to update you about the situation in your child’s school.
Our school is also suffering financially and for a number of reasons. For example, the recent staff pay rises are not centrally funded, meaning we need to find thousands of pounds from this year’s budget. On the horizon, employer’s pension contributions will increase from 14% to 50% by September 2020, resulting in £140,000 to be found (annually) from our school budget. Some centrally funded support for September 2019 is promised, though not from this point onwards.
Schools are now charged for services that used to be free at the point of access. In addition, the needs of our pupils placed at The MSE continue to increase and as such, so do our costs for relevant resources (e.g. reading books, IT equipment and programmes as well as staffing and related training costs.) However, per-pupil funding levels are not keeping pace with the significant extra demands on the school. We know this funding argument is ‘won’ though have no confirmation as to whether any additional finances to support us will actually materialise.
On our doorstep, the cuts to other community services leaves vacuums, for which we find ourselves undertaking crucial pastoral work that would not otherwise be provided for our families.
If only the ‘little extras’ money promised in November’s budget could be for ‘extras’. If we cannot fundraise to meet such additional costs, we will have to make savings in other areas. Fundraising has been very successful at school, but as you can imagine, so many grants, trusts, company and private donors, do not want to spend money on school essentials like staffing, replacing toilets or worn-out flooring.
I am sure you are aware that Teaching Assistants, Teachers, Admin and Leaders at The MSE School regularly undertake unpaid overtime, though you may not be aware that this is often in excess of 30 additional (unpaid) hours per week. This is not just because of the love of the job, but to keep up with the immense demands placed on the school.
I do hope you that won’t find this pessimistic but I wanted to update you about the current situation as I do know you take a keen interest in your child’s education. We remain optimistic - the school continues to innovate and be highly resourceful.
Best wishes,

That reply is horrible. Instead of sarcasm, why don’t you try to help.
Our school is skint too but we spend huge amounts of time fundraising so the school budget can go on salaries & pensions while we cover IT and consumables costs.
Parents with skills, qualified roofers, carpenters etc are keeping buildings watertight, mending fences, repairing furniture. We have a regular volunteer groundsman.
And our teachers are brilliant. Belittling people’s efforts isn’t nice.

I haven't been on Mumsnet for a while - the people seem quite angry it has surprised me.

We do the above too for our school. Maybe my idea of community funding raising was too radical at this point. I can see them all spitting in their tea. Nobody has come up with a better suggestion yet.

So why talk about stopping the clock at 3pm?
Perhaps I was just agreeing with you.

kafkesque
If the school is an Academy the accounts might be here;
beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/

the people seem quite angry it has surprised me
This has nothing to do with MN.
Most people will have an issue with twatty replies/conduct.
The response you sat you gave to the school was awful and quite arsey. It's not surprising so many people have said it's out of order.

Perhaps I was just agreeing with you.
Except you weren't because it was clearly a sarcastic dig after people had already talked about how things get done out of hours on good will and your solution was to get mentors to talk about time management, followed by saying that it should happen however schools manage competency issues.

In other words what many people have already said: schools run on the good will of staff. If all staff worked to rule then schools wouldn't function. Given that some parents complain when voluntary revision sessions aren't ran to suit their schedules, could you imagine if work to rule happened.

Then there was no need to seemingly allude to a concern for SEND children as a minority group or bring up SEND at all.

It is a SEN school.

Clavinova Thank-you it is a Federation

The response you sat you gave to the school was awful and quite arsey. It's not surprising so many people have said it's out of order.

They cut the school hours

On the SEND front that makes sense then. Sorry it wasn't in the earlier posts.

I don't care if they cut the school hours.
I'm not saying heads get it right all the time. But I know I wouldn't want to make the calls they have to and a reply saying 'well basically you should run a charity shop' is really arsey.

MaisyPops
Perhaps a teeny bit sarcastic...I thought your subject was English.

Perhaps a teeny bit sarcastic...I thought your subject was English.
Umm... yes.

So in a nutshell having made a pointless sarcastic comment, then tried to claim that you might have been agreeing with many of us on goodwill (obviously not) it comes back to the fact that you're just being deliberately goady. How bizarre.

I don't care if they cut the school hours.
I'm not saying heads get it right all the time. But I know I wouldn't want to make the calls they have to and a reply saying 'well basically you should run a charity shop' is really arsey.

I am still livid after over a year because the less education/therapy my child is receiving and they cut my freedom. I have already lost my career as the timings won't work. This has affected lives. I could go on.

That school will not be deprived, even though so cross, not on my watch which is why the PTA are thinking outside of the box and very successful.

When schools are small budgets can be really tight but there has been little appetite to federate. It saves money and you can actually afford a non teaching Head! The minimum pay for a Head is now £40,000 outside London. Only Heads of very small schools get less than £50,000.

I tend to agree with admission that schools are poor managers and are trying to do too much with their money. I bought Prit sticks and pencils for my children. The school sourced pens and sold them to parents. This was 20 years ago. My children kept their pencils etc in a pencil case. Why cannot most schools do this?

It’s also not their role to be social workers. 30 hours a week above standard working hours isn’t acceptable either. However most teachers accept there are ups and downs over the year and it is vital that Heads monitor work/life balance. Heads and Governors must look at how a school functions and, at times, make hard decisions but this doesn’t involve exploiting people.

Just to correct one or two things that have been said. No school actually pays business rates. They are money in and money out - 0 effect on the budget. No school is paying 100% of its budget on salaries. If it is anywhere near this, the classes are not organised properly. Again, federating would greatly help with this.

SEND schools do exist. They have not closed everywhere. It’s difficult to get children into them but not impossible.

Budgets have been delegated to schools since the 1990s through schemes of delegation. Services can be purchased from the LA or other providers. Schools have choices to make over this. Academies publish their salaries over a certain level and LA schools usually follow recommended salary ranges for the size of school. Not all schools are on their uppers financially but some have resisted doing more and more down the years and have stuck to their core job - education.

Some parents greatly resist paying for anything and there needs to be a re-evaluation of what schools provide. The most efficient way to run schools should be pursued in every case. There should not be three little schools of 100 pupils with three heads in close proximity of each other. It’s madness!

kafkesque
Then raise concerns about valid concern areas through appropriate channels.

Don't be matey bitching with the head speculating about the SEND status of parents and then send arsey emails telling school to run a charity shop.

It all feels a bit like you've decided you're the expert on how to run and finance schools.

If a person (or PTA) donates £170,000 to a schools general budget, with no conditions attached. Then why does that mean more money is not available to employ 2 or 3 more teachers for a few years?

If a person (or PTA) donates £170,000 to a schools general budget, with no conditions attached. Then why does that mean more money is not available to employ 2 or 3 more teachers for a few years?

Because it impacts on other budgets, such as ongoing pension contribution obligations, potential redundancy pay when the money runs out, SMP/SSP, employers NIC, cover staff to cover when they're not there, etc. If you took out all the potential provisions needed, you'd have barely enough left to pay the wages in the first place. Staffing is a massively complicated area with all kinds of "unforeseen" consequences having to be provided for, otherwise those additional contingency costs would have to come out of other budgets.

Walkingdeadfangirl
A PTA is a separate legal entity with separate accounts etc.
My understanding is PTAs aren't allowed to cover staffing costs or general bills for the school.

But PTA's are allowed to make cash donations to a school with no conditions attached. I have been in a PTA that did just that. Sometimes the head would publish something they bought with thanks for helping to the PTA but often it just got gobbled up in the general budget.

Badbadbunny I dont believe that £170,00 isn't enough to cover all the costs involved in employing at least 2 more staff on short term contracts. And that doesn't even factor in that the OP says they raise that much money every year.

Jesus! PTAs cannot use their fundraising for core expenditure that the school receives funding for! Any school that does that needs reporting, and the PTA which won't be acting within its own constitution.

They can buy computers, pay for visits to the panto, buy playground equipment, pay for a music group to come and perform. But they must not pay Year 2's teacher's salary.

Non teaching roles can include

The caretaker who fixes holes in the roof, opens up the site at 6.30am and locks it up again at 8.30pm, having spent the day dealing with leaks, breakages, vomiting, repairs, maintenance, putting chairs out, moving heavy equipment, then comes in every weekend to allow access and supervise private lettings and comes into a dark site at 3.30am alone because the intruder alarms have gone off.
The cleaners who wipe the urine off the floor of the boys' toilets and pick up the used sanitary towels in the girls', clean the floors every night, empty the bins, clean windows & ensure buildings are properly secured.
The catering staff who make sure the kids get one meal a day that doesn't come in a box dripping grease.
Finance - nobody gets paid without them. Nothing gets bought, nobody is employed, no dinner money can be taken, no trips, no books, nothing.
The secretary who is also the First Aider, admissions co-ordinator, dispenser of essential medications and answerer of all queries from Staff, Visitors, callers, emails, phone calls, letters, irate parents that are shouting the odds, reprographics, Fire Officer, Security for the door and providing the tea at evening events - like the expected school plays, concerts
The technician that runs the network, teaches staff and students, manages the AV equipment, the fire and intruder alarms, monitors and ensures internet security
The Pastoral Care who deal with discipline, hold detentions, help the distressed SEN kids, make safeguarding referrals, monitor and follow up safeguarding/welfare/liaise with parents/medical teams, monitor attendance and liaise with the Educational Welfare Officer and Safeguarding Leads, provide admin for Safeguarding Meetings, plus anything else that crops up during the day
The technicians who order, maintain and set up equipment so it's ready for each lesson, plan ways to deliver lessons, provide 1-2-1 tuition, supervise intervention, revision and co-curricular clubs, uses their specialist knowledge beyond what is required of a teacher and stay until long after the rest of the school have gone to get things ready for the morning
Cover Supervisors who teach lessons rather than cost much, much more in private agency supply fees
The TA who takes the disabled child to the toilet, cleans them, gets them changed for PE, stays with them, calms them down if they're having a meltdown and has to get them down the stairs in a hoist if the alarm goes off.

Pretty much all of the above also have requirements to maintain discipline, challenge unacceptable behaviour, spot issues that teachers might not have time to, work with kids on a completely different basis - but all are still important, even if they aren't technically teaching.

With the exception of the IT manager/tech, Finance and Caretaker, the rest are on term time only contracts and get paid significantly less than teachers whilst covering a huge amount of jobs that a teacher could be paid to do - but you'd need to employ far more of them to get those jobs done as well.

Get rid of non teaching roles and you just wouldn't have a school. You'd have a locked building with no resources, no heat, no light, no food and no staff or students.

Staffing, all staffing, is core to the activity of the school. For the umpteenth time PTA funds cannot be spent on salaried staff. And before you suggest employ everyone on a self employed basis I doubt the average school could stomach the HMRC fine.

Get rid of non teaching roles and you just wouldn't have a school

Hang on. You suggested copying the developing world and having kids taught in mud huts a few posts ago? Are you getting a bit confused about what to argue?

the rest are on term time only contracts and get paid significantly less than teachers whilst covering a huge amount of jobs that a teacher could be paid to do

WTAF are you on about?

Then raise concerns about valid concern areas through appropriate channels.

Will do with the help of Mumsnet once we have finished debating. I can't do it on my own. I will present my defense once I am summoned over my response.

It all feels a bit like you've decided you're the expert on how to run and finance schools.

Not at all otherwise I would not be mulling it over on Mumsnet. The only expertise I have is through my career. I am sure people start threads for all sorts of reasons. I just bring out the worst in people. Maybe I have SEN myself I don't know but life has not been a walk in the park.

Are you getting a bit confused about what to argue?

I am not arguing. I am extracting information out of you.

WTAF are you on about?

I don't understand this.

Just wanted to add this government cut my dc s school budget by a huge amount. Lots of staff were made redundant.
Spending per child has decreased nationally.
Before the general election dp went on line to see exactly how much the Tories would reducing each schools budget in our area.
Our area is not Tory and was subsequently punished for it.
They do however increase funding for grammar schools in the home counties.
Just saying.

kafkesque

I don't understand this.

You've just written about the support staff in school being important, something that no-one has argued or said, then seemingly out of no-where suggest that teachers should be paid to do their work and they should loose their jobs.

Its a nonsense post, when would teachers do these jobs?
Does the food tech teacher and his class provide lunch for the school?
When the teacher leaves the class to take the child to the toilet who looks after the class?
When the Teacher is taking the SEND kids who takes the rest of the class?
Teachers are first aiders but when would they have time to run the first aid room?

So on the one hand you say that the support staff are essential then you say that teachers could be doing this instead.

makes you wonder when the teachers will plan prepare and assess the work that the kids have done. Or even teach.

I am not arguing. I am extracting information out of you.

Whaaaaaaat? Nothing you post is making sense. You've sent an outrageous email to your head, and seem to think that you will now be summonsed to see them.

If you want some information about how schools are funded, where information can be found from, and what has led to the funding crisis many schools are having, why didn't you just ask?

Other than the nasty little email, you've stated that third world countries have schools in mud huts with no facilities so why can't we, then stated that schools need all their support staff. You've indicated a lot of your fellow-parents have SN, apparently your Head told you this, but that somehow these disinterested parents who don't understand basic implications regularly raise in excess of £170k a year. You've said teachers are lazy and overpaid, have no understanding, but despite full internet access and links on this thread, you haven't bothered to find how much your school's teachers are actually paid.

You are one massively GF.