Advice needed!! Private / state

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We have started looking at schools for DD to start next year in reception. Also have nearly 2yo DS.

We've looked around local state schools and apart from 1 small village school that is lovely, not that impressed.

So now we are going to see a couple of private schools. I'm really struggling to weigh up the pros and cons and understand what will be best for our family!!!

We have a fairly high income but also big mortgage etc. for them both to be at private school we would have to cut back quite a lot OR I could work more (currently 3 days), we'd still need to cut back but probably just need to be more careful.

Do you think private is that beneficial for very small children? I don't know if we should try and get into the small village school and then go private at high school or before if we feel the village school gets a bit limited?

Anyone gone private and regretted it? Or wish they had gone private from the start?

My DS2 didn’t start school to yr 1,at a fairly uninspiring mediocre at best tiny village primary (he’d also never been to nursery and couldnt read a word and could barely write when he went this was my choice). We moved him to to a prep school at the end of yr 2 his math was outstanding but his reading and writing were only good, in yr 6 he successfully got a place at 2 very big name and very oversubscribed super selectives independent schools one is unbelievably competitive to get into, so starting in primary and saving your money till later may not do any harm. Others of course may disagree!

Moved ours from parochial, rural, village primary (4 year groups to one classroom/one teacher) to prep at year 5. Academically were on par with prep kids save for exposure to languages.
My DCs are bright/sporty so were awarded prep scholarships based on ability rather than current achievements.
Have since gone on to do very well and fulfilling potential.
So I do not think you gain much by attending fee paying early years/primary education as bright children will catch up (probably wherever they go to school). Extra curricular and sport only really gets going around y4/y5 so I do struggle to see what advantages private primary education brings.

What didn't you like about the state schools you visited? If you've never seen a school in action before it can easily come over as chaotic (guessing this might be your concern as you're happier about the smaller school). If you're looking for a primary school (as opposed to infants) you also need to be aware that you are looking for a school for the next 7 years - your child won't always be a small 4 year old!

Our DS went to KS1 at the state village and we had a look initially at the indie with a view for it to be secondary ie. Yr 7 on. However we realised if we did that he would be behind in some subjects especially languages for example and would not have participated in the sports so he went from year 3 on. However we were financially comfortable enough for us not to have to cut back in other areas.

I know some people who go in at year 5 or 6 if spaces available to avoid the "rush" at a group entrance stage.

This is a perennial question on MN.
The answer is that there are so many variables - you, your finances, your particular DC's intelligence and aptitude, your other DC's ditto, the state schools near you, the private schools near you, the Headteacher (who may move next year), the cohort, etc, etc - that nobody can say. Also add in "where else could I usefully spend all that money?"

Actually, I can tell you the answer. Come back in 20 years time ...

It's so hard!!

We didn't like the local ones because they were a bit grim!

At one the teachers and stuff seemed nice but the actual premises were absolutely tiny. It was very cramped, you walked from one tiny classroom, through a curtain into the next classroom. It was just not a nice environment plus the head is leaving this year.

At the other it was chaotic, it's quite big and over subscribed. The teachers didn't seem to really want to answer questions etc. On the open day and their were 40 in reception. I just didn't like it.

The one I like is lovely but is very limited in terms of outdoor space and with it being so small I'm worried it will be limiting when they get a bit older, with friendships, sports etc.

Maybe we'll be a bit clearer tomorrow when we've been to see the private schools.

Also, hard to really tell DCs intelligence and aptitude at 1 and 3!? They are no G&T candidates but seem relatively bright.

Fees in the early years are much more affordable than later on, so I would argue to send them private as soon as possible and to look for better state opportunities (e.g. grammar) later on. I also believe that the early years have the greatest return on investment potential, so I would take the best possible nursery school over Eton, if I had to choose between the two for financial reasons.

Also the difference in facilities and provisions is more pronounced between a very good prep, especially if a boarding prep, and a state primary. It becomes harder to spot the differences between state and private later on, especially in 6 form. All decent state 6 forms have school orchestras and choirs, DofE, debating club, sports teams and Young Enterprise. But which village primary school has orchestras, swing band, rock band, debating, a theatre space, swimming pool, playing fields, special provision for G and T, specialist sports, music and drama coaching, and specialist teachers for all academic subjects? So I think a very good pre-prep and prep is value for money and a great investment. At secondary level, I am not too sure whether state schools are that much better than state to justify the expense.

Thanks Nelly. I have thought that, seems daft to miss out the bit that actually affordable!!

My daughter is the kind of person who will find it hard to switch schools, she takes a long time to settle to a new environment, so I'm not that keen to be switching her around if I can help it.

I think private education is a bit like when you buy your next house which is a step up. You worry how you will pay but you always do manage!

Yeah. It's a bit like nursery is not exactly cheap but you manage!

I don't think anyone can give you a categorically answer about whether private is better than state because it will depend totally on the specific schools. In general private schools have more flexible after school care, tend to have better facilities (not always though), more flexibility and more on offer in terms of extra curricular. Some can be very pushy and only interested in the schools reputation others are the opposite. Class sizes of course tend to be smaller. However you can't guarantee better teaching - that is definitely school dependent.

Another general considerations is that private schools tend to have a wider catchment so less walking to school together, popping in after school etc. Kids also tend to be away or committed a lot so more difficult to arrange playdates over the holidays.

Thanks. I know it all depends on schools / kids / parents in question but it's good to get other people's thoughts and experiences.

We live rurally so not that near to any of the schools. I'm conscious of practicality though.

What is the entry to senior? Round here it's two years tutoring for the 11+, so if you can get into a through school that goes to 18, avoiding the 11+ is a real reason to do private primary.

We were only considering very oversubscribed super selective 13+ schools all who pretrested in yr 6. The general advise we were given by various heads was that it was fine to stay state till yr 4 then move. So when your hoping to move to senior schoo may impact on your decision. I personally don’t like through schools what seems right for a 4 yr old may not be right for an 11/13 yr old and the school often won’t help or prepare for entrance exams for a different school at yr 7/9.

I think you need to be clear about what you’re after. A few people have said their kids moved later and achieved the same so early years is a waste of time academically . To be honest that argument could be used to discount private schools completely - lots of state kids get A* etc so is private therefore a waste of money?

My daughter joined a very selective independent from state primary at 11 and you wouldn’t know which girls at her school went to prep and which didn’t now - there’s no difference in achievement. However I’m sure those prep parents don’t feel they wasted their money - they got lots more extra curricular, small classes, nice grounds, specialist teachers. You need to decide whether you want to pay for that. If a prep isn’t providing these things it’s almost certainly not worth paying for.

Of course there are some subtleties - if your state option turns out to be really sub standard and you have no other options you might feel you have to pay, just to get a decent basic education. But generally speaking state primaries provide the basics.

Also consider the ‘peer group’ issue - size of year group, background, where they live. There’s no right answer but you might have a preference as to who you want your children to mix with! Some prefer a broad mix, others are a bit anxious about state schools! I have to confess that independent secondary has been a bit too much of a bubble at times for dd! So you should think about the social side as much as everything else.

Been to see 2 private schools today. I think we are sold! Luckily we liked the cheaper, more conveniently located one.

That's interesting, crazycrofter. We're just considering a similar move, and it's the social side that worries me most. I love love love the school, but I'm a bit anxious about DS being surrounded by nobody except very rich, very clever kids. (DS is pretty clever but not very rich!). Did you continue activities outside school? I hoping that might help keep him grounded. But I'm still worried.

Hi Brisklady, yes, we’ve kept up other contacts outside of school. I think that’s essential otherwise she would have started to think the standard of living her schoolfriends enjoy was ‘normal’. We’ve had to keep reminding her it’s not!

She’s got lovely friends and one or two are also bursary girls like her, which helps. It’s sometimes a bit of a challenge keeping up with birthday presents for friends when they spend £20-30 each but I doubt that would be such an issue with boys!

The boarding schools my DDs went to did, of course, have proviledged children but they also had a strong charitable ethos and were reminded not to think of themselves all the time. Well off people can be pleasant and you don’t have to deny who you are at any school. Near me, there are some pretty rich parents at the grammar schools and even the secondary moderns. It’s up to them how they spend their money. Just because you are well off doesn’t mean you cannot be a decent and caring human being!

Thanks both. It's not that I think they're all going to be horrible and morally bankrupt - and I know the school we're looking at has a fantastic service ethos, much more so than the local grammar options - I guess it's more wanting DS to still have a reasonably local group of friends who still think that a kick-around in the park is a desirable way to spend a Sunday afternoon, and who might even be around to meet up in half term because they're not off skiing.

Check out the private
Schools entry options at y4+.

At our local indie which is a well thought of boarding school the waiting list for y4 + is huge. Lots of local parents think they'll do state till 8 but then find they can't get in.

I think you can get in this school we like at a later date but they have entrance exams etc. Plus the infant part was probably the most impressive bit, they'd recently had a new building which was huge and immaculate. So kinda makes sense to go from day one.