Corporal punishment - should it be considered?

[Bambiraptor]

After spending some time teaching in a comprehensive in a deprived area of this country, I have been asking myself what will help the children who are so difficult in school. With the best of a teacher's intentions some children are just not interested in learning, and teaching becomes a battle. It is more about classroom management than anything else.
There are no consequences for poor behaviour and alot of the time no parental back up at all.
I totally disagree with corporal punishment. Full stop. My dad was is a retired headmaster of a private school in Kent and he is an advocate of corporal punishment as it worked in the school.
By brain is addled.
WHat do you think? DO you think teachers and schools should be given more power to deal with problem students?

I would fully support my child being given the cane if he stopped you teaching and others learning.

And from what I can remember, caning & slippering was done by the head or head of year. So no, you would not have to do it.

I have been an assistant head of year so yes I may have had to do it.

You still want me to refer kids for a good whack though!

From most of my pupils I do get respect their is a small minority who do not and I genuinely do not think that the cane, slipper, strap will help, that is what they are getting at home with little or no effect.

Kids need good teachers and a strong discipline policy that is adhered to not being hit.

From most of my pupils I do get respect their is a small minority who do not and I genuinely do not think that the cane, slipper, strap will help, that is what they are getting at home with little or no effect.

Kids need good teachers and a strong discipline policy that is adhered to not being hit.

Twinset, you & I am never going to agree on this.

I think that the job you do is amazing and I am so glad there there are STILL people out there that want to do this.

You are doing an immensly important job, you are teaching children things of interest but also teaching them social skills.

Yes I want you to whack the kids who don't behave, really hard as they are priviledged to be taught by you

I know we are not going to agree and I can see where you are coming from and I get pissed of when kids don't behave as I want them to do well. I get even more annoyed when "good" kids start to play the system, but I tend to see this as a weakness in my own teaching and something I need to work on.

I work with teachers that I respect who want to See CP return as they are fed up with seeing a few kids ruin the educational chances of others.

I am very anti smacking/CP though,by parents and teachers as I am very influnced by my own experinces as a child.

Lots of people I know still want to teach, my school is packed with fantastic teachers working in very difficult conditions who do the job for one reason only they love it.

A friend of a friend was raped by a 15 year old pupil some years back. Inner city school, kids allowed to run riot. I wonder if discipline had been enforced to start with, would this have happened?

Another friend gave up teaching to become a train driver, what a shame and he was a Maths teacher (not suggesting that they are more important, but I understand that there are many vacancies for this subject).

He taught as well in inner city and got fed up with being assaulted and not being able to retaliate.

Just so long as you know that I have the utmost respect for teachers as you are giving your time to share something. Many of us are so selfish these days, so something about your profession is very 'high up' in my book.

I just want you all to be able to teach.x

THankyou,

I now need to go to bed, am so behind that I have to be in work in five hours!

Night

Greensleeves, I do not want to come across as whinging, but I certainly have felt like it.
I do not actually think the cane should be brought back as I would not like my children to be caned.
I honestly think exclusion from school and some hard physical work in a special centre would be a good solution.

This may sound whingy, but I am 5'3, and all the training in the world is not going to help me restrain at 6 foot 16 year old.
When I say it is a disgrace i mean it is a disgrace that teachers are expected to be so many different roles - and then get blamed for not managing to do everything.
It is really really tough.
I am not teaching at the moment as I am having a break to be with my young dc's, but I am seriously considering my future in the profession.

It is very rare in most schools I have had experience of for a chair to be thrown at the teacher. Most behaviour problems are low level disruption. ie. Kids talking when the teacher is talking, children calling out instead of putting their hand up.

One school I was at used a system of consequencies. For example if a child kept talking in class, or they forgot their books,pens etc or were rude they were given a "C1". For continued defiance they were given a "C2" and then a "C3". Once they got a "C3" they got an after school detention. If the child continuted to misbehave then they were taken out of the classroom and dealt by the senior management team. Another interesting thing of this system were that all the "C1"s and "C2"s were added up by computer and if the children got enough of them in a term they were given an after school detention. There were no lunch time detentions as it was felt that a child who was hyperactive needed their lunchtime break. The teachers had a rota and all the children who were in detention sat at desks in the hall for an hour doing nothing.

One of the schools I'm working in at the moment has a very weak SMT. I'm just relieved that I am only doing exam invigilation. A boy called an exam invigilator a "C*~T" (Word that rhymes with punt) and senior management weren't interested.

WTF is a senior manaegment team? It sounds more like a call centre than a school

It's the heads of year, deputies and head teacher. The ones who are supposed to do the leadership stuff and sort out problems, basically.

I had sort of assumed that really, I'm just unable to resist registering a mild revulsion for the "giant American supermarket" ethos of modern state schools. I think it contributes quite heavily to the general aura of disenfranchisement and mutual hostility of state secondary education. It's difficult to imagine children feeling proud to belong, or even fond of a school that has a reception lobby like a Travelodge and a Senior Management Team - cold, impersonal and a damn shame, IMO.

I remember corporal punishment at school being very rarely used and generally the threat of it was enough. I do think there is merit in bringing it back but other factors also need to change. It cannot be the only solution. FWIW I think being able to choose schools has polarised them into being good and bad so pupils in the bad ones have nothing to aspire to. I think there has been too much emphasis on academic careers to the detriment of pupils who are not naturally academical. There needs to be more focus on vocational qualifications. I could go on forever but these are the areas where most significant change could be made

Senior management team is just a term. And not one used by the children. Children have heads of year, deputy heads, heads, just as they always have. And if they are any good at their job, and many, many are, then they are very far from being 'cold and impersonal'. Don't let the words used mislead as to the role these teachersplay in the lives of their pupils. Pastoral care is the hardest role in school IMO.

Totaly agree. Good pastoral care is the core of good behaviour and attainment, since no-one can learn if they are unghappy or stressed.

A good SMT and good behaviour policy= good behaviour +happy kids= good school

It doesnt matter what you call the senior teachers of a school. They are there to support staff in doing their job well. A large school needs a management structure otherwise its chaos.

A good whole behaviour policy helps everyone. Teachers spend less time doing crowd control and more time teaching.

For example the school I work in has 1300 children in it. There are over 80 teachers, there re also over 40 other members of staff in supportive roles, LSWs, technicians, secretartial staff etc etc

you need a well organised managment structure to run all that efficiently