Grammar School or Private School Scholarship?

[MrsDO88]

Which would you have picked?

Ofsted inspections really are not bout PP funding and outcomes! This is rubbish. Every grammar school, bar one, in Bucks is Outstanding. They have few PP children as you might expect. I wish people would actually read Ofsted reports of grammar schools then they would know what they are talking about.

One of the many strengths of the grammars in Bucks is the Outstanding Teaching! So many of the secondary moderns have had RI or worse in the last 10 years it does appear to be more difficult for them to recruit outstanding teachers.

I would only choose private if it was excellent and offered value above that of the grammar school. We chose private over grammar for that reason and no 50% off. However if it is a weak small private that takes lots of 11 plus "failures" I would be wary. The grammar will challenge more.

I am surprised any private school now offers high value scholarships. Most have moved to bursaries to assist poorer parents. They like the bursary children to be pretty bright though and often select via scholarship together with income. The Charity status of schools now means that schools should not be giving money to wealthy parents just because their child is scholarship standard. Usually the scholarship is of low value or honorary and the money goes to those that need it. As it should!

Mouldy,

I agree that what Ofsted intends to inspect are what you have listed.

However, given the exceptionally strong correlation between %PP and Ofsted rating, it is definitely worth thinking about how the different factors are linked, and why sorting the list of schools in England as I describe comes up with the results it does.

For example, Ofsted looks at progress. If a child has a safe and warm home, decent clothes, is adequately fed, has parents who are literate and in professional employment and value education, then they are more likely to make good progress. To a first approximation, schools with very low %PP have more such children. Schools with the very highest %PP will have fewer such children. Thus schools with very low %PP will tend to find it somewhat easier to make good progress (and thus be Ofsted Outstanding) than those with very high %PP.

That is not to say that an specific individual PP child is badly fed, poorly housed, has unsupportive parents., or that children without PP may not also have difficulties. Just that there is, statistically, a link between deprivation (of which PP is a crude and imperfect measure) and the 'marks of a successful / unsuccessful school' that Ofsted looks at.

It is a disturbingly accurate predictor for my local secondary schools, btw. There is a %PP below which all the schools are Outstanding, then another threshold below which all are Good, and above which all are RI / Inadequate.

But private schools will have even fewer children on pp if any.

So OP might as well discount all of them.

Just to say ensuring bright children who arrive already achieving high scores make excellent progress isn't necessarily a walk in the park. It can be easier to show progress the other way round. It's progress not necessarily attainment that we're discussing. Obviously you want stellar marks but if progress results are excellent on top and every other area has been shown to be Outstanding by Ofsted frankly I wouldn't turn my nose up at it.

Finally re your stats could they by contrast be showing how wealthier families tend to mop up the places in the better schools through buying or renting which is often more expensive and harder for those on pp to access?

Green - I'm agreeing with you here (how nice).
It is indeed hard to show progress in a super selective. And yet we do. The original progress league tables introduced by Blair were meant to knock the grammars off the top. They didn't.
All schools have their own difficulties and issues as well as their strengths. The same holds true for teachers as individuals. I am much better at teaching (it's more effortless) at KS3 and A Level.
Students will suit different schools. In my area, I would definitely go for grammar. Mainly because the nearest decent private/independent is a day school with a commute that would take away the any potential extra curricular benefits. That won't be true everywhere.
Of course, teaching at a grammar, I'm biased!

Neither

I'd only choose private in our area if mine didn't get into the grammar. This is because the grammar seems lovely. I dont doubt the private does more extra curricular but I also feel my child would feel the pressure at that age to have a lifestyle like the others and we don't.

Also the money "saved" not going to private can enrich their life while at school - trips, holidays, instrument lessons, sports classes etc and save a bit towards uni. Several thousand pounds a year can go a long way!

If mine dont get into the grammar I'd be more concerned and more likely to consider private.

Ask yourself why the private school is offering the scholarship. As previous posters have said, most good independents now focus on means-tested bursaries so a financially hefty scholarship that is not needs-based is essentially a bribe to buy your child.
In areas with lots of grammar schools, any but top-flight independents will be filling their places with children who didn't make it to grammar school. This is likely to make for an environment less academically stimulating for a bright child, even though exam outcomes may well be comparable (smaller class sizes etc).
On the other hand, independents almost always offer more in the way of extra-curricular enrichment: staff have lower teaching loads and can give the extra time.
As a former teacher in the independent sector, I would say that a lot of independent schools are barely worth the money compared to grammars if what you are primarily looking for is a solid academic education that will lead to a good university place.

only if the private is in the top 50 and offers a truly outstanding education, and make the children think for themselves as opposed to force feed them information and regurgitate on exam day.

If you are asking the question, I assume it means you could conceive of going either way - grammar or private.

I would take your child to see both school again and let them discuss with you and decide.

No need to involve all of us parents in a decision about schools we don't know and a child we've never met. Have confidence in your child's opinion.