Do private schools have better teachers?

[hercules1]

Read this on a different thread and it has peed me off a bit. I know lots of really good teachers who don't and won't teach in private schools. I've also known some teachers leave the state system to go to the private as they could no longer cope within the state.

Private doesn't equate with better teachers Of course it means lots of other things and I am sure there are lots of excellent teachers in the private system but no more so than the state.

Buy by the same token, not all people in Oxbridge are dim, or rich or should be despised.

I'm neither, but I did go there

And I've councelled kids in the sixth form along just those lines. But you cannot damn all of oxbridge because of some of the students. Any more than you can damn all state school for some of their teachers or pupils. Or for that matter damn all private schools because some are poor.

i am afraid i stopped reading this thread after dominiconnor's post........

good and bad everywhere inme
private schools pay less
the private school my sister works at is takin gthe mick
she is a qualified teacher but is doing is getting nursery nurse pay as she doesnt have her own class but takes groups out and supports SN kids on a 1 to 1 basis

they give her the hours she wants so feels unable to rock the boat (she is a single parent which complicaes matters further)/ she has done it for 2 years and if they will not give her teacher's pay this year she is leaving

ph and now i have read xenia's post

The two thickest blokes in my year at my Oxford college were the two Etonians.

Back to teachers - 'course they vary.

What makes a good teacher? Someone who is brilliant at his or her subject? Someone who is brilliant at maintaining discipline? Someone who has a good sense of humour and is brilliant at IT? All of these? Really it's as subjective as what makes a good school. Some people will value one thing more than another. And with teaching it's horses for courses. A teacher who might be able to get the best academically out of a class in a private school might struggle with discipline and inclusive learning at a state school and vice versa. I could never teach in a private school but send my dds to one. I too value the fact that they get a specialist teacher for music, langauges, IT, swimming and PE which would be rare at primary level in the state sector but it wouldn't surprise me if later on if many of the teachers at secondary school haven't got my skill at managing the class, making the curriculum accessible etc etc that I have. But then they don't need these skills to the same extent. It does make sense that teachers in private schools are attracted to their ethos as are those in the state sector and this ethos will inform their teaching and make the schools what they are IYSWIM. Neither sort necessariyl better jsut different.

And as if to prove that people vary, the brightest person in our year was an Etonian. He is a consultant eye surgeon now.

Thickest that I knew was a northern chemist.

Worst degree was dh, who got a pass degree, not even a third, but he considerably brighter than I am. He just discovered flying, dtinking and shagging a;l in the first year, and it rather went to his head!

I think that private schools tend to put more emphasis on Masters Degrees and Oxbridge qualifications. And having met many, many teachers in my time, believe me, some of the very worst were very well qualified, although they could equally be excellent.

The worst teachers I ever had in my life were the two Oxford dons at university. They stood out a mile - were hopeless at teaching, although practically genuises in their own right.

Of course you can't generalise. Many state school teachers are top notch, and I'm sure there are private school teachers who are not up to scratch. Some private schools pay less, and I know of several teachers in the private sector who have joined good state schools because of the pay.

It is my belief that the parents don't really care about the teaching, as long as their kids perform reasonably near to their potential. They care about getting their kids away from the lower classes, and ensuring a good accent, useful contacts and high aspirations.

Also, I don't think i could work in a private school
prefer the state school challenges than the private school ones (as both are challenging in different ways)
oh and, according to xenia, i don;t have the accent (but do have the killer heels and first class honours degree...)

Or perhaps hem hem to other organs...

Well, quite!

good times though!

Don't know tbh. It's a bit like asking do private school have 'better' pupils than state schools.

Bit of a chicken and egg situation imo.

Also depends what is meant by 'better' I suppose. More high;y qualified, more motivated, more specialised, more experienced?

Ooh, such generalisations about private schools. Not all private schools are £10,000 a year and in the south you know. Dd1's teacher was born and bred in the North West and has the accent to match. She wears track suits to work. Anyone who chooses a school because of what the teachers wear and their dress sense is totally superficial.

martianbishop - me too!! i am ashamed to anounce my pass!!! PASS its not good but then i never went to my 4 hours of lectures a week and rarely got out of bed before 3!
I am bloody bright though - happens to the best of us mb!

I think they requie different kinds of teachers, I have to admit that with one exception all the teachers I have known who ahve left the stste sector and gone into the private just could not cope in the state sector, mainly beacuse they could not cop discipline wise.

I have always taught in the state sector, I did apply for a postin a private school a few years ago as posts in my subject are really rare and I did not want to travel. I was offered it but turned it down as I could not have taught at that school with a clear conscience, not just because it was a private school but also because of the way it is run.

I also think that I am too good atmy job to levae the state sector, particulalry the school I am in, which needs good dedicated teachers like myself.

I am also a very well dressed state school teacher! No sesible cardigans and falt shoes here!

Exactly, pointless, pointless discussion. We all decide what we think is a good teacher, a good school and a good pupil and make our decisions accordingly. One person's good is another's dire.

Can only go by my own experiences here of course - but I attended a private secondary school (which had excellent results) and although there were some good teachers, there were also some astoundingly bad ones. Yes, they were well spoken, well educated (often badly dressed though!) but essentially they were poor teachers because they simply didn't have to try hard to engage us or inspire us...so they didn't really try at all. They mostly lectured us.

In contrast, when I became a secondary school teacher, I worked alongside many inspiring and inventive teachers (state sector) who encouraged their pupils to really take part in the learning process and think critically etc. There was no relying on the fact that the kids would already be motivated to learn and have parental pressure to achieve.

Got distracted mid post onmy first post, I was going to say that as far as I know most of te tecahers who ahve gone on to work in the private seotor after leaving the state have gone on to have successful careers in the private/public sector, which reinforces the idea that different schools need different kinds of teachers.

WeaselMum I work in a very tough secondary school and I have to say I work with some of the most inspirational teachers I have ever met. I would say that out of 35 teachers, about half are amazing inspriartional teachers, I would say that about five are useless a waste of tax payers money and the rest very good.

I bet sadly in most schools whatever the sector who will find thathalf dozen who are useless.

LOL at the snobbery factor sobernow. I worked in a very exclusive Scottish boarding school with royal connections. It was a source of great amusement to me that the kitchen staff (of whom I was one)were routinely better educated and qualified than the teaching staff, but as 'colonials' and 'menials' we were constantly looked down on. I took over from the religious studies teacher for a week while he was sick. At least I actually had a degree in the subject, and the Economics teacher stopped talking to me after, when trying to find some common ground with him, I casually mentioned some postgraduate papers I had taken in economics. I later found out he had an HND and no teaching qualification. But hey, the fees were massive and the school was very prestiegous, so the parents must have been getting value for money.

Personally I much prefer my rough and ready students from a high deprivation area than those spoilt rich kids who thought that because their parents were paying for their education that that meant they had some power over you.

I was only joking about the clothes. Teachers in private and state schools are not very well paid and most can't afford expensive but understated clothes. I do think men look better in ties however.

On balance unless fairly left wing (as many teachers are) on the whole you're likely to get better cleverer teachers wanting to teach in a more pleasant environment with well behaved children if you love your subject and don't want to be a policeman. Thus they may be more likely to attract those teachers in the private sector.

So overall I think tyhere will be more better teachers in private schools if you take number of teachers in state schools (94% of children or whatever it is, 90% I think in London) and 6% in private schools - I bet there are more than 6% of the better teachers in private schools so overall better. One my daughters had the lead examiner in her A level subject as one of her teachers and he was pretty good (as well as young and sexy which can help with teenage girls or not as the case may be - no beards in sight of course)

That Scottish schools is pretty much for thickos though (like our royal family) and doesn't exactly get very good A level results so you wouldn't expect the teachers to be any good really.