Private schools can't read inflation figures

[roguedad]

Is anyone else getting notices of extortionate fee rises right now? I had been hoping for maybe 1-2% in the light of inflation being zero, but I have just had notices from a Oxfordshire junior and senior of about 5.9% and 6.7% from this year to next. Both letters laden with excuses of course, neither really acceptable.
Those not able to access private ed might well say "serves you right". We have already said that to ourselves so please, no posts stating the obvious.

I work in a private school and staff get a 50% discount.

Fee remission is not an equitable perk at academically selective schools because not all children of teachers pass the entrance exam. They can therefore find themselves ineligible. For that reason and others, it has been cut back at many independent schools in recent years.

In one well known and oversubscribed school, I believe it has been reduced to as little as 15% and even that is subject to a means test.

OP queried fees inflation. This has become quite a major issue for teachers I know who work in independent schools. You get 30% off your DC's fees, your salary goes up by less than 10% over 5 years but the fees go up by well over 30% during the same 5 years. The perk is worth much less than it was when you signed up and the school has become very expensive for you and your colleagues. How are you supposed to find the difference? Private tuition in the evenings and at weekends is often the answer. Not great for family life. No wonder there is growing disillusion amongst teachers at such schools.

The disillusionment is as nothing compared to state school teachers.

Absolutely right, TWF, you tell them.

It's worth noting that fees inflation can have this particular consequence in the staff room even if you are quite happy with it as a parent and are generally in favour of excluding the "nouveau poor".

granola your style of writing gives the impression that you are very knowledgable and informed! I know quite a few teachers who work in boarding schools all have their children either being educated in the school or if they're children aren't the right sex/age in local prep schools or senior schools. I've never been rude enough to ask but as in all cases they're DC's are day children in predominately boarding school I assume they get the place for free or at a very reduced rate because even day fees in boarding schools are outside of the reach of teachers unless they are very senior. It would also appear that if the school they teach at is not suitable because of age, sex, or selectivity that some sort of reciprocal arrangement exists between other local suitable independent schools. I know of a new teacher getting a day place for her DC's at a local prep when other non teaching friends we're told that the school was full. The teacher is question implied that there was an arrangement between the school she worked at and the local prep.
I personally don't see much disillusionment amongst those I know who teach in the independent sector (nearly all boarding school). House master etc work very long hours in boarding schools and they're role is very much more complicated than simply teaching, which I get the impression they very much enjoy, however tedious and demanding some parents must be! Those I know who teach sport love the time thats made available for this, great facilities and level of commitment to sport by pupils and the school in general. A few teachers at DS's school who I've spoken too talk about the pleasure and challenges of teaching the boys, and of course the many on a day to day basis not to "off piste" (as it's described on hear). I'm sure some are disillusioned in the independent sector, some parents I suspect can be very irritating and unreasonable, Hours in boarding schools are much much longer, a work colleagues husband teaches art at a big name coed boarding school, the art dept is open every night bar Sunday so with his tutor commitment in house and being in the art dept she only see's him on Sunday. On the other hand the school rents a nice house for her in a very expensive small market town and 18 weeks of the year he's on holiday. But as word says the few teachers I know in the state sector are like most working in all areas of public sector very disillusioned; struggling under incessant financial constraints, constantly having their goal post and priorities changed by faceless bureaucrats in distant offices, endlessly having their performance measured reviewed and criticised but being told they should count their lucky stars they've got a job!

granola you endlessly berate the super rich (btw who on earth are these people? I'm certainly not) for apparently ruining independent education for the far more deserving; the traditional middle classes and the schools for being out of touch.

Yet, you sound hopelessly out of touch. And hopelessly self absorbed. The assumption that the rest of us should care in the least, that a small group of privileged people can no longer afford one of the huge privileges they'd like...is frankly breathtaking.

Perhaps I should start a thread about how outrageous it is that the rich can no longer afford servants in the UK? After all they used to be able to afford them. And jolly useful they were. I feel an election issue taking shape...

Yes word start a thread about how wealthy middle classes can not longer afford servants. My father in law was brought up with lots of servants and my in laws when they first got married had a life in house keeper but by the 60's they very sadly found they couldn't afford one it's absolutely outrageous. They had to employ non live in staff and my poor father in law had to make their bed time drink and my MIL has to horror or horrors do the ironing, because she was paying the school fees, they struggled like this for over 50 years now it must be terrible for them.

Happy .

When ex-pats first come to London, or come home after time abroad, their first shock is often the cost of house elves!

Both, OP was raising an issue relating to fees inflation in independent schools. I was pointing out that this can have an effect on teachers as well as parents.

Different schools treat their customers and their parents in different ways. I know some teachers who have been disappointed by changes to the fees remission regime at their schools and who have felt the effects of fees increases too.

I thought that was a point worth adding into the discussion here. It is important to maintain a sense of perspective.

My views on fees inflation were shared by The Times a couple of weeks ago and by Eric Anderson, former head of Eton, in last week's Spectator. Your reactions are entertaining but there are many on MN, like OP, who are concerned by the direction many independent schools are heading in.

sorry: "teachers", not "customers"

Why are parents surprised fees are rising? It seems common knowledge to me. Many of here who enquire about fees/affording private ed are quickly warned that fees rise higher than inflation on a yearly basis, when you look at a school enquire if this is likely to be an issue for you.
Schools are expensive to run, the sort of education that the top schools offer definitely doesn't come cheap, and the moment you start employing younger teachers, unqualified teacher, etc people are quick to highlight this, there are numerous threads on here where it's stated that independent school employ ?cheaper unqualified teachers. Up thread I pointed out that my DS's school is not covering it's running costs despite it's high fees and being full, if this applies to them it must equally apply to most others, schools who don't cover the running costs somehow will simply close as many have is this what parents want? Before committing to fees maybe parents should do research, future building plans are often well publicised by schools, no school wacks up a new science block over night, planning applications are readily available to be read.
The up shot is of course that MC Parents are being increasingly priced out of the market but would they happily pay for a cheaper but significantly watered down independent school I personally am not convinced they would.

happyg - Yes, they do have reciprocal arrangement. For example, the OP school has an arrangement with the local girl indi where staffs' daughters get 20% off (if sons, the OP school gives 50% off as mentioned above).

granolamuncher - I think another as important question here is whether those inflation++ fees rise actually make that much differences to the attainment (academic and non academic) of the children. For example, will we see 5% more A* for 5% more fees?

granola I don't think people are concerned with anything other than the fact that they personally cannot afford it.

And I don't see the Times piece as especially importnat; standard fodder on a wet Tuesday in February (readership 26.5). It wasn't the spearhead of a blistering campaign, just a gentle chime with its constant reader; the traditional middle class metropolitan professional.

The fact is the Times and the Sunday Times are increasingly less about factual news reporting and more an aspirational blueprint for MC life. A How-To Manual for the Cath Kidson generstion.

A list of things their readers would like to be able to do and buy, believe they deserve to be able to do and buy, but simply can't.

Reviews to restaurants they can't afford to eat in.
Photographs of interior designed homes they can't afford to live in.
Tips for holidays in places they can't afford to travel to.

And between all this aspirational shizzle are the angst pieces. Pieces that focus on the MC anxiety du jour.

topsy No, there's no direct correlation between fee rises and exam results. The rises are generally fed into new staff and new buildings, both of which may help pupils' performance but the long term impact of fee rises on the school community as a whole should be weighed against those choices as well.

There are some schools at the top of the league tables where it would be almost impossible to squeeze out more A*s but which carry on imposing inflation busting rises. The market can bear it. Up to them.

Some statistic that might be of some interest (2014 Budget data)

Median Gross income of household of 1 adult+1 child in top 10% of all such families = £77k

Median Gross income of household of 2 adult+1 child in top 10% = £115k

Median Gross income of household of 2 adult+2 child in top 10% = £150k

Vs the 'Middle Class' (70th Percentile)

Median Gross Income of Household with at 70th decile 1 adult 1 child - £30900

Median Gross Income of Household with at 70th decile 2 adult 1 child - £49200

Median Gross Income of Household with at 70th decile 2 adult 2 child - £59900

Experienced (upper pay range)Teachers salary outside London : c £36k

I'm not a "Times" reader myself, TWF, and I'm inclined to share your views on where Murdoch has taken it and its Sunday sister paper. If I may, I think a comparison may be drawn with independent schools, which, in some cases, have tended to prioritise lifestyle related initiatives as requested by wealthier parents and almost regardless of price.

In the good old days of the broadsheet Times, you wouldn't have heard a head of a London day school declare that Tatler magazine's schools guide was "important", as Andrew Halls did on a BBC documentary a few months ago. That was an MC aspirational statement par excellence.

It's just a question of what your priorities and perspectives are. As I said up thread, I hardly think we've got a national crisis on the horizon, as The Times would have us believe, but I do think it's worthwhile questioning schools' decisions on costs and pricing, as OP suggested.

happygardening I believe it is generally the case that independent schools employ unqualified teachers on the same terms as those with QTS. They aren't usually looking for savings when they employ such teachers; they're just looking for the best candidate for the role.

There's no doubt schools are expensive to run. I agree that parents should be aware of that and of particular projects that might impact on fees. The question here is whether schools could be making more efforts themselves to keep fee rises lower. It's not necessarily a question of "watering down". Different schools could take different steps but what is certainly noticeable is that some don't really bother. Current and prospective parents are entitled to query the schools' decisions, just as they are their own ability to cope with the rises.

Yes we can quietly rises just a much as we can query the cost of a holiday or car but as generally the parents don't own the school the school is free to do what ever it pleases. If parents don't like it they can either vote with their feet especially if they feel the rises are either unreasonable or beyond their purses or accept it and stump up the money as you do with anything else in life you have to pay for.

You're absolutely right, happygardening, but heads and governors don't usually own schools either: they're custodians of them and should listen to their stakeholders as well as paying attention to the institution's founders' ideas and its traditions, whatever others might think of those.

@happygardening - If we are going to go free market then perhaps we should go full free market?

For example, the school should be treated as businesses and then charity commission will not be able to put pressure on these schools to hand out bursaries (the end of scholarships but the dishing out of bursaries has a lot to do with the non free market social engineering).

topsy I think you'll find that the charities commission has taken pressure of schools to fund a certain % of bursaries.

If were being logical about fees rises it's pretty obvious that apart from schools in London/Home Counties and a handful of super selectives most are struggling to fill their vacancies so why would you raise fees unnecessarily and deliberately price parents out? Secondly if these schools are running as charities they are non profit organisations so they don't have share holders hoping for dividends.
Therefore the only assumption is that schools feel that these rises in fees are essential if they are going to continue.
As parents we might not like it but I suspect many realise that the individual schools have no choice if they are to continue offering what parents expect.

@happygardening,

Yes, that is actually my point. In the absence of meddling by the charity commission, the schools should be allowed to hand out as many (or as little, or zero) bursaries as they please. Number of available bursaries have increased to a large extend due to pressure by a non free market force called the Charity Commission.

So, if we want the free market approach where schools charge what they please to the extend of what the market will bear and if some 'self-entitled' MC family cannot afford the inflation++ increase, then goes elsewhere, then we should also allow the school to hand out as few bursaries (or zero) as it pleases. A business should be seen, treats and runs as a business.

This was what the article actually says:

"New guidance from the Charity Commission says that organisations will be required to provide benefits to “people of modest means” that are “more than minimal or token”.

It also warns that “luxury” institutions would be required to do the most to justify their charitable status.

But new guidelines make it clear that schools will be given complete freedom to decide how to open up to the poor, suggesting they can run A-level master-classes for deprived pupils, second teachers to state schools and share their playing fields to meet the requirements."

So, if they want to hand out zero bursaries then they have to do something else for free (or minimal fee) AND handling out token bursaries will no longer allow them to fulfil the criteria.

I think topsy you'll find that most independent schools gave a sigh of relief at this decision. They find it easier and a dam sight cheaper to run A level master classes for "poor" children, share playing fields and second teachers than dish out lots of large bursaries from money they don't have.
I know of someone desperately looking for a substantial bursary she's not having any joy despite the promises the schools she's approached are making on their websites.
I'm not completely sure what a "luxury" institution is but if it means the big names Eton et al them they more than anyone else are trying to broaden their intake and have the money to do it. It's actually the smaller unknown independent schools who have and are struggling to offer out any bursaries.