Academic scholar potential but where to go?!

[nappyqueen]

My ds 11 is currently at prep school and now we are looking for a senior school. He is very bright and easily academic scholarship material, loves sport and throws himself into it all. Very gentle natured, loved by all, genuine and cheeky character, real personality and loves learning, really making the most of being at a great prep school.

We need the scholarship and will also need bursary top up.

Not fussed by co-ed or all boys, not overly fussed by location as we are used to travelling though prob not looking as far as Dorset/Devon area.

Been to Oundle and due at Uppingham, just from gut instinct but wondering are there any good academic schools we may have overlooked?
Please be nice I am just genuinely wanting advice and info to help give us a clue!
We are unfortunately too late for the likes of Eton, Winchester and Radley as prob felt we were having ideas above our station! Looking at Sept 2017.

Where do you live? The scholars programme at Dulwich is incredible- if he could live at home you can have the boarding school experience without sending him away!

^^ and I agree with what other posters have said about the (quite frankly appalling) lack of guidance from your HM. Not good enough.

Prep HM sounds just like one I know - in fact i am sure he must be same head, By start of Y6 he'd still not had a single conversation with any parent about senior options, and then he just threw Oundle and Uppingham out as options, but only as alternatives to the big name up the road. A couple of us went ahead with applications without involving him and I vividly remember him meeting with us to discuss our application to Eton, where he tried to sell the local big name as a better option for DS, then started reading through my sons details. All the umming and ahhing was a sight to see as he realised DS had CATS of 135, was A team in all sports, doing well on 3 instruments, on school council, and was taking major role in the drama production. And this was a man who had known our son since nursery but had overlooked him because there was a 'star' academic pupil in that year with big name parents who HM doted on. The prep my son was at was considered best in our area with waiting lists, so heaven knows what the other preps were like. You just don't think to ask when your kids are 2 years old how they organise scholarship preparation.

Unfortunately, we had to get HM onside because of need for school reports, etc., so we had to push through and force him to do his job, and you will need to do the same. Which is to ask for a meeting, go through where he is on everything, tell HM that your DS is clearly is going to shine on a big name school and you need his support to get him into the best option possible, with a scholarship. Tell him you are thinking of WinCol, Radley, Christs and maybe Tonbridge (which should be there too if he is v sporty, although more weekly than full boarding), and need him to speak to teachers and come up with recommendatios and a plan. You also need to tell HM you need to get DS a secured (non-scholarship) place at one good school at least, which means HM needs to go through those schools where you haven't missed cut-off already. That's the first meeting and you will probably need to be very clear on getting HM to agree actions at the end of that meeting and then chase him so you end up with a good shortlist. Then once he's done that, you need to work on how to get your DS up to scholarship level on the two or three schools left in the mix (the secured place and one or two others). School should have scholarship streaming in 7/8 so ask about that and where the kids get scholarships to. Some preps are just not up to getting kids through scholarships at the top schools, so you need to be very firm in finding out if our school has ever got a child in as a scholar at a big name school.

I'd also be thinking of two plans alongside this:- firstly can you move him to board at a better prep for two years if need be in order to ensure best scholarship chances? Secondly, what is your plan B if he doesn't win a scholarship (and therefore opportunity for bursary)? If you can't self-fund then you might want to look at potential state boarding options. Cranbrook is obvious one, the new Eton partner school (holyport) might be another. And there are others that might suit wherever you live currently.

Have you looked at Oakham? It's in the same area as Oundle & Uppingham, and I personally would prefer it to either of them. They are very generous with bursaries to scholars. So is Shrewsbury, but that may be too far for you?

We chose his prep as it suited him beautifully, we weren't planning massively ahead just giving him the opportunity to thrive that he needed at the time. Saying that they have very high success rates in scholarships at many schools which doesn't help me fine tune my options!

I'm taking it we can still apply to schools who have closed their registration but only if applying for a scholarship (if I have this right I am feeling better). There are a number of heads who visit the school and have meetings with parents afterwards but we are a fair distance away and again have had no clue as to where to start! It is me who is thinking ideas above my station - would be mortified to spout to HM that I'd like to look at XYZ and him to look at me in horror or laugh! It sounds pathetic but I am very new to all this and started this journey to satisfy my ds's appetite for learning. I have learnt a lot but not necessarily confidence!
I have asked for guidance more as to the ethos of schools, eg. academic/sporty etc but feel maybe I should be more blunt with the head and just outright ask what he thinks. He was one that mentioned the scholarship very early on! Just wish I knew for where!!
Thank you very much for all the info and probably more of a confidence boost to get info from the people in the know and who know my ds.

"here are a number of heads who visit the school and have meetings with parents afterwards but we are a fair distance away and again have had no clue as to where to start! It is me who is thinking ideas above my station - would be mortified to spout to HM that I'd like to look at XYZ and him to look at me in horror or laugh"

Do not allow yourself to be intimidated. There will be lots of parents who know the ropes already, but it is the Head's job to guide those who don't. Remember who pays his wages- you wouldn't allow yourself to be intimidated by the person you pay to mend your car- why would you let the person you pay to educate your child intimidate you?

The Head has thrown you a line of empty words! Sadly. It is easy to talk but less easy to "do" now you really need some help. Is there a Deputy Head for Academic Studies who could help. My DDs boarding prep had this post and it was this teacher who was the guru on senior schools. They got umpteen scholarships every year. If your school does, who is actually doing the advising because the head seems lacking and children are getting scholarships?

Also, some preps are very wedded to just a few schools. The only school suggested to my BF's son was Uppingham. They applied to Rugby for a scholarship, and although the school supported that choice, it was not their choice. Also many prep schools work closely with a few senior schools. Many are not big enough to sprinkle children, with scholarships, all over the country. Assuming you are in the midlands, (from the school suggestions above) I would look at the schools that have been suggested to you within 1.5 hours of home. I think you would have done better at a boarding prep with impeccable credentials for scholarships. I would not discount Harrow as they have generous bursary provision, the Beckwith scholars.

Maybe you head suggested a scholarship early on as this is the best way of securing a bursary?
Does your prep have a regular track record of getting scholarships into Eton/Win Coll/Radley etc the fact that he didn't get your DS to register in time for a non scholarship place rather implies they are not familiar with the admission process of these schools and also therefore pupil don't attempt their scholarships exams. If this is the case then your prep could struggle to do the necessary preparation for either the KS (Eton) or the Election (Win Coll) if it's not something they regularly do because it doesn't follow the same syllabus at the ISEB scholarship exams and if your DS is boarding and you live far away then your going to struggle to top up school teachings with a private tutor, this could be necessary if your looking at scholarships into either of these in a prep school not preparing them sufficiently. In fairness for Radley you do have to register virtually at birth although you can sometimes get in off the Wardens List so maybe he thought this wasn't really a goer.
If he's suggesting Oundle/Uppingingham are these schools he's familiar comfortable with? Both are good schools Uppingham sometimes receives a bad press on here but I know parents with DC's there they talk highly of it and Oundle did get a bashing on one thread on here last year but as someone said there's two sides to every story. Exam results are largely similar but Uppingham is smaller and basically full boarding only whereas I believe Oundle has a mixture do day and boarding. Both I'm sure would very much welcome a very bright pupil.
Re this "thinking above your station" forget that stuff no one cares especially the very big names and re talking to you head as I said above most prep school heads contact parents and ask them to make an appointment to discuss the "next step" in year 5 at the very least. Usually an honest conversation takes place on the lines of; "have you thought of anywhere you'd like Henry to go Mrs X?" (Sounding you out) "He's very bright I was thinking he might be a strong candidate for Eton register him before it's too late but of course it's very over subscribed so have a reserve like Oundle we could also try for the KS as well although of course. toning is guaranteed but he's a strong candidate", "Oh you like X do you well why not try it you've nothing to loose but have a back up plan in case he doesn't get in" "I think X is a bit of a stretch frankly why don't you look at Y it's a very good school" and in your case it would be nice to hear "I was only talking to the bursar at X last week. I put in a good word for Henry he's just the sort of boy they're looking for, they are really committed to bursaries now, raising lots of money etc do go and have a look in the near future and have a chat to the bursar, he's such a nice fellow mention I spoke to him won't you". What you don't want is for the head to choke on his coffee and chocolate biscuit and say didn't you get the email I sent you suggesting you register DS for E ton before you miss the deadline?" This is their raison d'être, to advise you on what schools to look at, to stop you wasting your time trudging around hundreds or schools and to make sure you don't miss dead lines for registration!
You say you don't visit the school very often I can fully relate to this but it might be worth bracing yourself and making an effort for a short time. Stand the side of the pitch during at match talk to other parents, chat during match tea, generally the main topic of conversation is where is your DC hoping to go onto next. Parents with a couple of older children at or who have been at the school,will be 1. very familiar with admissions processes for senior schools and 2. the schools is general, try and talk to another parent with a very bright DS where are they looking at? There's frequently gossip about scholarship exams especially next term, try and find out who's trying to get a scholarship into where, how good the preparation is, although actual results will speak for themselves, when preparation start yr 7 or yr 8 do they separate scholars for Win Coll and Eton from those doing the ISEB scholarship exam?

The annoying thing is that if the HM had encouraged you to apply in the normal prep school way (registration /pretest) to the most well known school on your "out of your league" list you could have been assessed for bursary help even without a scholarship. I suspect only the "grandest" schools have the funds to do this in a meaningful way.

It's not helpful to you OP but I wonder if some HMs are simply not explaining well enough exactly what the purpose of their preparatory institution is. When you say:

There are a number of heads who visit the school and have meetings with parents afterwards ...

I can see exactly how your mind was working. I'll bet you anything you imagined those visits were for some inner circle of old boy parents and billionaires and you weren't invited? Whereas the whole reason both the prep and the public school visitors exist is to meet you.

It is not a HM's place to laugh at your senior school aspirations. (Not to your face anyway.) He should have made likely destination schools clear at the beginning and not accepted your son if you wanted something different. If a parent has no clue he should put more effort into guiding them. The criteria for choosing a senior school concern your DC's capabilities - not whether you keep a tiara in a bank vault.

Milly Beckwith scholars I think you'll find have to be in the state sector up until yr 6 I linked in the bursary info it would appear bursaries are generally only available to scholars which I find surprising.
I fascinated Halk you on this thread I have never had you down as a scholarship expert or an advisor on how to manage you prep school head is there something you're hiding from us?

It is worth going these meeting with senior school heads. Our old prep used to get heads or HM's in the case of the very big names to come and give a sermon in chapel and the he/she would meet parents afterwards, often children who were interested in the school would read the lesson or perform a solo etc. thinking about it I never went as we'd been advised in year 4 at and had our own ideas (there's a surprise) where we should look which is a relief because I'm a died in the wool atheist but friends did go are their decisions about which schools was significantly influenced by these meeting.
As zero said you do need you head to support your choice. Our head openly didn't support one of our choices (he started after we'd arrived) just because he personally didn't like the school he was actually obstructive at one time and when DS got offered a place because my husband pushed hard for him to be interviewed he didn't exactly celebrate it and was very negative about the school to my DS, this slightly back fired as my DS didn't like him much so made him think he should definitely go there! In the end we turned the place down for other reasons which was a relief because I'm not sure how helpful he would have been in the CE preparation where a very high mark was required.

Your HM sounds awful OP.

I know for WinColl you can register after 11 but just can't apply to a specific house. He'll then be interviewed/tested and can still get a spot on the general list if he does really well.

Worth bearing in mind though that at this point the competition is going to be really tough as lots of preps will have streamed their boys into day/boarding/scholarship groups so they can specifically prepare them for the entrance tests for the schools they are going for.

Scholarship candidates at DS' prep (who are identified by head) get lots of extra tuition in yrs 7 and 8. If your DS isn't getting similar, it is going to require a lot of extra help from you to get him ready.

You are still in time for a non scholarship registration for Harrow

"for entry in 2017 At age 13 Non-scholarship applications from boys at UK schools must be received by 1 June 2015." www.harrowschool.org.uk/1851/admissions/key-dates/

I would speak to them about bursaries and stick your name down. You can then see if getting a scholarship would help with the bursary application (it ususally does).

julieh1 Win Coll actually says on it's website that they cannot accept any more applicants for 2017.
Chaz I've already linked in Harrow I don't know what you know/think but I quickly skimmed their bursaries scholarship page on their website I didn't think they looked overly generous with bursaries to non scholars apart from a very narrow group including those applying for the Bechwith scholarship. Maybe you know differently.

Oh ok, I guess they already have a bumper reserve list this time around.

Apparently Win Col is more over subscribed than ever before.

happy
The only people I know who've gone there have either been full fees or a scholar so you may well be right.

Looking at their accounts to Aug 2013 there were 89 pupils receiving bursaries worth a total of 1.89m. There were also 205 boys receiving scholarships totalling 391K
apps.charitycommission.gov.uk/Showcharity/RegisterOfCharities/DocumentList.aspx?RegisteredCharityNumber=310033&SubsidiaryNumber=0&DocType=AccountList

So it may well be that the vast majority of bursaries are given to scholarship boys.

My DS is starting at Oundle in Sept 2017 so happy to talk to you and have Pmd you too! He is bright (not as bright as your DS!) but also very sporty. Oundle have been fabulous the whole way through. As soon as we took the boys to have a look they loved it! If your DS like rugby they have 2 ex Eng Internationals as coaches and have just got through to the semis of theNational Schools Cup!!

Re scholarships at Harrow - if you are in Derbys, Lincs; Leics; Notts,(which you might be going by the schools you've named) there is one Sherwood Scholarship per year which is very generous with bursaries. See their website

Chaz I was frankly surprised thar Harrow isn't more generous, schools in the same category Eton Win Coll and SPS are definitely trying to offer more bursaries to non scholars. I wonder why they're slower to do this? I struggle to believe it's lack of money.
Waves at Pepperpot hope it's all going well

Don't know why you're surprised, HG- I always try to help if I have knowledge that might be useful to the OP.

And I agree with your advise; the OP's head appears not to be doing his job very well.

Big waves back to you HG lovely to see you helping someone else like you helped me!! xxxx

Does sound a bit strange of OPs HM although IME HMs def have their fav schools to put forward, our HM can be funny like that too. We had to push for the school we wanted when our HM was trying really hard to steer us to somewhere else. OP of your choices Oundle sounds like a good fit as it is very academic but has lots of sport and activities going on too, i think they have a scholars programme too for the high achievers. Uppingham is a good fit too. Kings Canterbury is popular for the academic and sporting side, depends where you are based. Midlands is so easy for travel! Most schools will have bursary funds for scholarships but you will need to speak to them fairly quickly as funds are allocated (for the bigger schools) quite early on!
Has anyone else had this problem with HM and future schools?

I think I have probably been unfair about our HM as I have not been very forthcoming in asking openly about future schools, probably out of fear as to what we've got ahead of us. He has been a fabulous head and I will endeavour to pin him down this half term with my own shortlist, I left it very open ended to him and he probably felt it wasn't his position to steer me completely just to help finalise my options.

Thank you all for the help it has been very helpful and put me in touch with others who can help greatly. Here's to a fun filled half term and lots of phone calls emails and visits, actually feeling a bit more energised and excited for him now (he's always been hyper about the prospect of these schools, as I say he LOVES school!!)