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Home-School Transport Problems. prh47bridge, can you help please?

23 replies

DoorToDoor · 18/09/2014 10:46

The wise people tell me that you might be able to, prh47bridge. I'll be grateful for anyone else's input too.

My question is this - what responsibility does a local authority have to get a student to school or college on time?

To set the scene:

We live in a village to the south of the city. DD attends F/T post 16 college two bus rides away on the north edge of the city. The college is the nearest suitable one offering DD's course or any course of its kind. The LA have confirmed by email that they'll provide her with a bus pass to college so I take that as acknowledgement of this fact (I'm waiting for the pass to be sent out to us).

If the two buses ran to timetable DD would get to college on time. Invariably they don't.

There is only one bus serving our village (bus 1). It's timetabled to leave here at 7.30am and arrive in the city centre in time for DD to walk to another stop and transfer to another bus to college. Invariably bus 1 arrives late to the village, gets caught in traffic and arrives too late for DD to transfer onto bus 2. Very often it's so late that DD misses both the timetabled connection and the following connection fifteen minutes later.

The college have her on two weeks trial and won't enroll her unless her timekeeping improves. They don't seem to be able to accept that this is out of her control. She's been instructed to "take an earlier bus" although we've both told the college that there is no earlier bus! There is nothing she or I can do about bus timetables or volumes of traffic!

We'll be grateful for the bus pass when it arrives. We really will! But that doesn't help much if the bus isn't getting DD into college on time and the college are indicating that she won't be enrolled unless the buses speed up and the traffic jams disappear!

I don't know where to turn to or where to start. DD has had major issues about education (bullying, leading to self-exclusion and ill health) and her just getting up and getting on the bus willingly and happily is a major milestone. Last term she was dreadful but this, a new and far more appropriate course, is seeing a great change in her confidence and outlook. This course is perfect for her. She's got real talent in the subject and the last thing I want is for her to have her confidence destroyed again or for her to be refused the place because the bus is late despite that she's leaving on time.

So far DD's found in the bottom of her bag a couple of last week's number 1 bus tickets to prove that it got into our village late to start with and as she disembarked from bus 1 this morning she got a printed ticket (with the time and date on it) from the driver to prove that it was considerably late getting to the city terminus from where she has a walk to bus 2's stop. She plans to continue to get proof of bus 1's persistent late arrival at destination next week.

I don't know what else we can do. Who do I speak to? The LA because they're basing their transport provision on the timetable and not on the actual service? The college?

Is there anything I can refer to, to remind the LA of any responsibility they may have (if they have any at all) to provide transport which will get students in on time? All I can find online is this badly worded (deliberately ambiguous?) quote from their post-16 education transport guide.

"What are the normal travel arrangements?
A. The LA undertakes to provide a return journey for entitled students to and from school or college, for travel at the beginning and end of each school / college day during official termtime at the most economical cost to the LA."

Travelling "at the beginning of each college day" is not what's needed. DD needs to travel before the beginning of the college day so that she gets there in time for when the college day starts!

I'm all done in with the worry and would be very appreciative of some advice. Thank you.

OP posts:
prh47bridge · 18/09/2014 13:17

As your daughter is over 16 she is no longer of compulsory school age. The LA therefore has no responsibility to provide transport at all.

Having said that, they are providing transport so I think you need to be fighting this on three fronts:

  • The bus company. They are ultimately responsible for the fact that the buses are persistently late and frequently miss the connection. Make sure they are aware of the fact that their inability to run buses on time is threatening your daughter's education. Whilst they are not directly liable for the consequences of buses running late, I'm sure they wouldn't like to see headlines in the local press saying that your daughter has been deprived of an education due to their poor timekeeping.
  • The college. It is not your daughter's fault that she is persistently late. She should not be penalised for the shortcomings of the bus company. If they come up with the line about catching an earlier bus again send them a copy of the timetable to show that there is no earlier bus. If they do decide not to enrol your daughter find out how you appeal against that decision.
  • The LA. They are providing transport but the provision is inadequate and could result in your daughter losing her place at college. I would argue that, whilst provision of transport is not compulsory, once they have decided to provide transport the provision must be adequate. This clearly is not.

Get as much evidence as possible to show that the problem is down to late running buses. Send copies to everyone but make sure you keep the originals.

Make sure you get everything in writing. Email will do. If you have a telephone conversation with someone send them an email immediately to confirm what was discussed and what they said.

DoorToDoor · 18/09/2014 14:54

Thank you so much.

I've just written an email explaining the circumstances and the dilemma and was pondering on who to send it all (and whether I was right to send it at all!). You've given me the issues I need to address, helped me make sense of what I need to put over and now I know I'm not unreasonable to be looking to both the college and the LA to help me find a way round this.

You've given me the confidence to press 'send' too! Thank you again!

I'm now about to contact the bus company. Wish me luck!

OP posts:
Middleagedmotheroftwo · 18/09/2014 15:04

I'm sorry OP, but I think you've chosen a college for your DD that isn't suitable. Yes, it offers the courses she wants, but there's no guarantee that she can get there in time for lessons. I understand it's not her fault, but the liklihood is that buses will always be late.

I would look for a compromise college that DD can get to without being late, but which might not offer the combination of subjects that she wants.

eatyourveg · 18/09/2014 15:19

Check out wheels to work - various websites depending where you are in the country ( a quick google should show you one near you) - they are specifically for people who have problems getting to work or college on time due to transport problems

DoorToDoor · 18/09/2014 15:29

Middleaged there isn't a compromise college. This is the nearest vocational college. The 2 nearer colleges are highly academic and consistently over-subscribed. They admit on the basis of exam results and proximity to the college. DD is dyslexic and is not wanting to follow an academic path nor is she able to due to missed schooling as a result of previous bullying. She wouldn't stand a chance of admittance into either one of them even if she wanted to go there.

eatyourveg, thank you but the scheme doesn't apply to this area and wouldn't in any case be appropriate for DD, for various reasons.

OP posts:
ChillySundays · 18/09/2014 18:20

prh47bridge - pupils have to stopped on until 18 if no apprenticeship? Surely the LA do have responsibility nowadays although they can't control the timekeeping element?

YesIDidMeanToBeSoRudeActually · 18/09/2014 18:34

I don't know about the legalities with your LEA, but is cycling an option? Our LEA provides a cycle grant of £90 for eligible students (but don't know if this post 16).

How far is the actual college from home?

DoorToDoor · 18/09/2014 19:34

I wondered about that Chilly but I assumed I was wrong when I read prh's reply. Confused

Yes, it's about 14 or 15 miles from home to college. Cycling's out of the question on much of the roadway between here and there.

OP posts:
ChillySundays · 18/09/2014 19:53

Have to say Prh's is very knowledgeable so it could be a technical point that although you have to stop on you are over 16 and don't qualify.
MY son had an offer from a college out of county and when I spoke to my LA about transport they said they do not pay for transport out of county. As far as they are concerned there will be a course (doesn't have to be the same just similar) somewhere in the county

DoorToDoor · 18/09/2014 20:45

The 'don't pay for transport if the college is out of county' thing is the rule here too Chilly.

DD's course is within the county, it's just that we're in a semi rural location so quite a distance from any college.

OP posts:
SlowlorisIncognito · 18/09/2014 20:56

Would she be able to travel on a 50cc scooter? Possibly on a safer, if longer, alternative route? I know this isn't something that everyone is comfortable with, but it was what I chose to do as a rural teenager needing to get to work and sixth-form with inadequate busses.

I do think a lot of people are unaware just how poor public transport can be in rural areas :(

Middleagedmotheroftwo · 18/09/2014 21:48

Could she go by taxi, or moped. Or could she board near the college during the week? Some kids who !live in remote regions have to do that.
Or can you pay someone (relative/friend) to take her?
Do you have a local car share scheme?

ChillySundays · 18/09/2014 21:51

DoortoDoor - Slow has come up with a good idea. Is it something that your DD could do? Wonder if after everything that has happen it might make her feel a bit more in control and independent.
Saying that though my DS wants a scooter - over my dead body! I would have let my DD at that age though as she is far more sensible!

MisForMumNotMaid · 18/09/2014 22:01

Could she cycle the city bit instead of the second bus if that would give her a time advantage? Either using a portable bike or locking one up at the bus depot?

prh47bridge · 18/09/2014 23:14

Surely the LA do have responsibility nowadays

Legally they only have to supply free transport for pupils who are of compulsory school age. Whilst the last government changed the law so that students now have to stay on at school, enter an apprenticeship or receive some other kind of training they did not change the school leaving age. So once a child reaches the end of Y11 the LA is no longer required to provide free transport.

There are provisions in the Education Act 1996 that are relevant. These require an LA to specify the arrangements for transport and/or financial assistance for transport that they consider necessary for sixth formers. That leaves it open for the LA to decide that no arrangements are necessary. That is in contrast to the law relating to younger pupils where free transport must be provided they meet certain conditions laid down by law.

So the law in this area is somewhat vague, which makes it difficult to define the LA's precise responsibilities. The LA in this case may well be able to argue that providing a bus pass goes above and beyond the legal requirement and it isn't their problem that the bus is always late. And given the vagueness of the law it is hard to argue that they necessarily have to provide transport for the OP's daughter at all.

DoorToDoor · 19/09/2014 09:52

Sorry, I got called out to work so missed a lot of the questions.

A scooter/moped is absolutely out of the question. Part of that's cost, part of that's DD's lack of care for personal safety.

There's no-one at all who can take her.

She cannot board near college. It's completely unaffordable for me and definitely not in her own interests.

We have no local car share scheme.

Taxis would cost £85 a week just for that one way journey. I'm sorry to say that's not affordable either.

Cycling the city part of the journey would actually take longer than taking the 2nd bus. The city part isn't so much of a problem.

It's the first, rural then motorway/A road bus journey which is the problem. For example, DD took the first bus out of the village again today. It arrived half an hour late.

prh47bridge, if the council tell me "we don't have to provide DD with transport assistance at all" I would argue that while they do provide it they need, as you said, to make sure it's adequate.

Would I be able to argue that the college is state funded and supposed to work in partnership with the LA (is it?!) and so it's not unreasonable for me to expect the two to communicate and come to some form of compromise here, if not to improve the transport provision then to accept its failings and make allowances for the fact that DD is going to be late through circumstances beyond her control, if not beyond that of the LA.

The irony is that our village bus service is subsidised by the County Council. They write the terms of the contract. They control the timetable.

They've been useless for years and they aren't getting any better!

OP posts:
prh47bridge · 19/09/2014 14:37

I would make that argument and not worry too much about whether or not it is accurate, to be honest. You are an ordinary person. You are dealing with a public sector college, a County Council and a subsidised bus service. It is not unreasonable of you to expect that they should be able to work together to resolve issues. And yes, I would stick to the argument that as they are providing transport it needs to be adequate. If you want to get all legal with them, tell them that they need to provide transport for your child of sixth form age under Education Act 1996 S509AA. Having arrived at that decision the courts would probably view it as unreasonable if the transport provided did not actually meet the needs of the pupils concerned.

prh47bridge · 19/09/2014 14:38

tell them that they need to provide transport

Skipped a few words there. Tell them that they have clearly decided that they need to provide transport...

DoorToDoor · 19/09/2014 14:39

prh47bridge, you're a star. Thank you!

OP posts:
DoorToDoor · 19/09/2014 17:48

I might be getting somewhere. The bus company have emailed me to confirm that the service from our village is normally very late, so I've sent that on to the college.

I'm in touch with the college's student welfare officer who is of the belief that the college are now accepting of the fact that on many occasions DD is going to be unavoidably delayed. I've emailed to ask for confirmation of that.

The hold on enrolment is to be reviewed on 1st October. I think this is reasonable, as long as they don't hold DD responsible for the bus delays.

Thank you all very much.

OP posts:
ChillySundays · 19/09/2014 19:09

Glad you are managing to sort things out.

prh47bridge · 19/09/2014 20:06

That sounds like good news. I hope it all works out for your daughter.

Middleagedmotheroftwo · 20/09/2014 00:13

The point still remains though that DD will be late often and will presumably miss chunks of her lessons. Is she going to be able to catch up on the work she's missed? Are you still going to persue trying to find some way of getting there on time?
Could you advertise locally for a car share

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