Interested in your opinions on funding of school trips

[AtiaoftheJulii]

I agree that teachers shouldn't pay for themselves!

And it doesn't make a lot of difference when it's a large group. But my dc is in y12 and a teacher is taking a group of 5 pupils to see a play near the end of term. This is just a jolly - the play has no relevance to their course. Looking at the amount we're being asked to pay for the ticket, it's clear that the cost of 6 theatre tickets is being shared between the 5 pupils. They will buy train tickets on the day (no advantage to early booking for this journey) and again, the guide amount given looks like the students are covering the teacher's ticket. This means that the cost of the whole trip is going to be nearly £7 more than if they went independently (becoming an almost 40 quid day out rather than a bit more than £30) which feels like a lot for a nice day out.

Is this fair? How small a group would it be fair to ask to split the teacher's costs? Should school pay for the teacher?

DC was somewhat indignant - I pointed out that actually they've done pretty well from school this year in terms of getting stuff for free, and that to moan now would be churlish. So this isn't a "should I complain to the school?" rant, hoping for a bit of discussion on how schools handle these things.

I don't know! Clearly she thinks the mammoth effort involved is worth it.

Sorry I thought my question was obviously rhetorical, my bad.

She thinks it's worth it, to end their course well. To bookend a positive experience. They as an AS group will have had ups and downs and scary experiences together this year, it is not equivalent to the experience of say, a maths class. She wants them to go out on a high, to consolidate their experience of drama education and potentially set them up for a lifetime of theatrical experiences.

She also knows, that as they are 17 the chances of them, as a group organising themselves to go on a Saturday with no involvement from her is actually bloody unlikely. Some of the group (not nec. Yours!) won't have the kind of parents who would encourage them to go without school involvement either.

I'm obviously pro theatre, and pro school trips that goes without saying. However, I dont think general school budgets should be used to fund a trip that benefits 5 out of a (potential) 1000? pupils. It's only fair that the parents whose children are benefiting pay (except in cases of genuine hardship, and then hardship funds should be used).

I imagine that the theartre would not allow a large group of sixth formers into the theatre without supervision. I think its only fair for the parents to pay towards the teachers' ticket.

Trust me, your child's teacher does not want to socialise with your child. I am sure that she is not billy no mates and if she wanted to go to the theartre she could find a friend. Or shock horror! The evening might be more enjoyable without her sixth formers.

I work as a peripatetic teacher. This year I have taken my kids to a ballet, a matinee orchestral concert, out for tea three times (before their own concerts) and a weekend in Wales. Last year we went to two shows, Europe for a week and out for tea three times (before their own concerts again). Next year we are going to China for a week, plus the usual teas out and a couple of shows. I don't get paid for any of this time and believe me when I say that although I like my students, it is not jolly time. I am in a position of responsibility and loco parentis for many.
As far as my maths goes, that is two weeks, two weekends and about eleven evenings of unpaid work. I do it because the benefits to my students are huge, we do (as you can see) lots of culturally enriching things and they love to socialise in a group.
The mammoth effort is worth it. For my students. And wanting the best for the kids you work with is part and parcel of what teaching is about, although I don't think anyone ever gets that. Most people on here just seem to think I do my job for the holidays.

I imagine that the theartre would not allow a large group of sixth formers into the theatre without supervision.

Lol - sorry, but that's ridiculous. Clearly you haven't read the thread (5 students; about ten of them went unaccompanied by an adult to the same theatre last summer), but just using common sense, teenagers can't go to the theatre without an adult? Of course they can.

TheGonnagle I don't think anything I've said contradicts anything you've just said. I'm interested in how said trips are funded, not in how selfless teachers are (all those I know and see seem to work incredibly long hours, and those in the performing arts especially so). A trip to China sounds expensive (I highly doubt any of my kids would ever get to go on a school trip like that, just not affordable or justifiable for us) - how many are going? Is your cost spread between them? How few could you take without thinking that adding on a bigger and bigger chunk to the student's cost was going to be too much?

When I reread your op I realise that I have just had a rant that didn't in fact address any of your original points - sorry. I just get so used to all the teacher bashing I automatically go on the defensive these days.

If your dd wanted to go just with her friends then perhaps that should have been the best course of action. But the thing is, most things don't happen unless we organise them. If your dd is really proactive in her interests then that is excellent and she should be commended for it, but it's not particularly normal!
We do a hell of a lot of behind the scenes work for any trip, it's not just a case of turn up and go, believe me! I wish we could get schools to cover our costs, but with budgets being what they are at the moment there is just no money in any pot anywhere to cover such things. So yes, teachers costs are spread between the students when arranging trips. Otherwise they wouldn't happen because no one is going to give up time and income to run extracurricular activities.
If I think back to my school days it's the extras, trips, holidays and the like which stand out. In fact they define what I remember about school. So that's what I want to give to my students in these days of rigour, core subjects and endless exams. Because education is about getting out there and seeing the world, and learning who we are and what we like, not teaching to test for thirteen years.

Rant over. Sorry!

Schools and teachers put all the extra work and effort into organising trips and experiences for their pupils and get these types of comments in return.

These types?? What types? I'm undecided whether it's fair to only split the cost between 5 people (who didn't have a choice as to whether they go or not - by the time the request for money got to me the theatre tickets (but not the train tickets) had been bought already) - with such a small group the extra cost is very noticeable. Would it be acceptable for just one student to pay for themselves and the teacher?

Because education is about getting out there and seeing the world, and learning who we are and what we like - yup, and seven quid that I spend on enabling a teacher to go on a trip is seven quid less that I have to spend on enabling my other children to go on similar trips - because education doesn't only happen through school!

I don't really get your problem, OP. If you don't want to pay for the teacher's ticket, then surely you just don't send them on the trip.

I don't see where else the money is going to come from. A handful of students are going to benefit from this trip, which isn't linked to the curriculum, so no, it's not appropriate for school funds to be used. The teacher is clearly working, and will be taking responsibility for the students, so it would not be appropriate for the teacher to pay. Consequently, it seems fair that the costs are shared between the five students who will benefit from the trip.

Obviously, if you feel that it's too expensive, or if you resent paying for the teacher because you think it's a jolly, then you aren't under no obligation to send your dc on the trip. However, why you'd expect the trip to be subsidised by anyone else, I don't really know.

Who'd be a teacher, eh?!

No doubt the teacher believes that she is enabling your dc to go on the trip, rather than you enabling her.

Teachers don't go on trips, they run trips that wouldn't take place if they didn't go. The cost of a trip is the cost of a trip, and that includes sending staff to act in loco parentis.
Just don't send your kids on any extra curricular if it bothers you that much. Spend your seven quid doing it yourself.