Education superclass?

[Amber2]

blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/iainmartin1/100245274/it-is-much-worse-than-sir-john-major-says-a-new-superclass-is-being-created-in-london/

This is interesting coming from John Major ...sounds like more lobbying along the lines of the Sutton Trust but do people really think it's much worse than it ever has been..? and this is do with with the inexorable rise of London...and the global money flowing in there...and so to creating an elite superclass of private schools also ...not just any old private school but a small handful of elite ones, applications to which have reached record numbers, presumably more and more from London and from overseas with over inflation rises in fees pricing out the traditional middle classes that used to be able to afford these schools.

BSC: no, Mediterranean country. Though very interested in the Baltic state and Moscow uni parallels...

On cultural stuff, we do take DCs to theatre, ballet and museums. No opera yet as they are too small (both under 4) but I am delighted that our eldest now asks to listen to Papageno- he was rubbish at naps when little so I used to sing bits of the Magic Flute to him (atrociously, I am sure) and he still likes the tunes.

On the alienness of schoolchildren at operas on school nights: a few years ago we went to see Rigoletto with some friends and their 11-year-old daughter. Due to timing she came straight from school, in uniform, and apparently there was a lot of gossip from parents at her very traditional school the following day (some other school parents were at the theatre and recognised her).

Only worth learning Danish or Dutch if you live somewhere that the language is spoken.

Oh, it's just one of the 13 languages my children speak. They polished it off for fun.

Ah... it was Estonia I was thinking of

And Danish is one language that the English can justifiably say is difficult to learn, I think!

Hate to depress issue further but london state schools better too

www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-19151471

plus if parents from another country then maybe languages and curriculum ply part in school choice and not many state schools offer

international bacc or igcse as many parents may move a few times so international schools be very popular.

Agree modern languges at primary and seniors are rubbish unless the schools bilngual ie welsh meduims and childs properly immersed in 2nd language its hard hence why my french will never be fluent.

imagine parents who use private schools in london need to be on good salary as living costs too.

here in southwest day place is 10-11k a year.

yeah, but can you imagine the English trying to speak Danish or Dutch to them, they'll say, don't torture me anymore, just speak in English...all the ones I know speak English almost like a native (even down to slang) and they have never even lived outside their countries.

Nah. Simples!

It does seem to me that parental anxiety means that children can become a bit of a project. I am often struck by parents saying they intend their children to study in the US or overseas for example. What if they don't want to?

dotmania - you're merely summing up why the English don't bother with ANY other languages.

I mean my eldest were raised globally but they chose not to apply to the US, despite attending a school which offered practical support for this.

Every child is a project - a separate one. When the project goes wrong it is nearly always because the interests of the child, the mother and the father are not aligned behind the same project.

My sister is English and speaks fluent Dutch!

Slipshodsibyl - what those pesky "don't want to" children need to understand is that if they don't join the treadmill of language learning, theatre visiting, US university studying, they will end up in the provincial underclass. They will then find it hard to be able to afford to heat their own homes, and their children's children will suffer malnutrition and get no education at all.

The whole country does seem to be revolving round London. More than it ever did before. It does get a bit wearying.

rabbitstew - yup something like that and I do actually believe that is what is going to happen

And when Armageddon comes, Bonsoir, you would rather your children's children were murdered by angry, starving mobs than that they had themselves starved with dignity, or that your children's children implemented the final solution on the starving masses before they could vent their anger on those who took more than their fair share of the earth's resources.

Rabbit

not ANY other...just the ones where we shouldn't really even try...there will be those who are Swiss, those from Luxembourg and others who will look down on you as "uneducated" if you can't converse in at least three languages fluently like they can ....and try speaking to the French in English ...the point is, certain languages are not exactly in demand compared to others when it comes to enhancing employability in the Uk or elsewhere. Of course if you are relocating to those countries like Denmark or Holland, it may be a different issue.

Slip...studying in the US is not a parental push...it is increasingly common in certain schools for sixth formers to look there...and those top schools cater for it with SAT courses and specialist Ivy League advisers etc. and more interest as many of the students at those top London schools or places like Winchester also come from overseas. Plus for certain places like Harvard which is needs blind in terms of applications and financing, really bright state students who cannot afford uni here may even be better off financially to apply there.

It is a global economy - the world is a smaller place in that respect ...much better to aim for a good uni overseas than a second rate one here if given those options. You only have to look at Uni world rankings to see that.

Rabbitstew goes away to cross "Danish" off her children's CVs and insist they learn Chinese, instead...

I've been raised in a very international manner, and would like DC to have a similar experience. Unfortunately, that would only be achieved by paying and sending DC private.

But you guys do know that elsewhere in the world, you can have kids that are international and multilingual without going to private schools? In Germany, many send their kids abroad for a year around the age of 16 (typically USA). A whole year would cost about the same as a term in Eton.

But those programs are non-existent in the UK...

Hmm. We have family living overseas. Maybe we could swap children for a year!

the thing about the global elite, rabbit, if things get too uncomfortable in one country, they can usually move elsewhere pretty quickly (in fact they already have few homes (and bank accounts) dotted around the world) and take their money with them...come the revolution that is...this 0.001% (perhaps it's even smaller than that) is the new ruling class.

dotmania - the thing about the global elite is, they don't seem to realise you can actually shit on a whole planet and then where will you go? They'll need to start investing more in Space programmes again.

interesting thread
rabbit I dont think these guys have any interest in making things better for everyone else, from what I see it is self self self all the way

interesting in my field whilst the extra curricular has increasing emphasis and increasing importance it is also to a low level and increasingly accessible to those coming through
the other interesting thing is that social engineering has made the successful applicants less educated/polished/cultured etc etc call it what you will (yes I was involved in uni admissions for a very academic course but perhaps not the same calibre as mine)

Languages is where the UK really falls down IMHO it is increasingly apparent to me that we will have to address that ourselves.
(dc1 by the age of 8 had done greeting/colours/numbers in French about 6 times!!) although i do find the Dutch speak accented English just as many others, I know a secretary, policewoman, welder/fitter type level of qualifications who speak 4 or 5 EU languages very proficiently yet in the UK similar level of qualifications would struggle to say Bonjour!

London is having a major effect but what to do about it? should 'we' do anything? (I know nothing will be done BTW)

I mean, let's face it, if 99.9% of the world population is THAT pissed off with 0.1%, it's not so much fun being the 0.1% any more. They do actually need servicing by someone who isn't out to kill them, which means they need to maintain a certain standard of living for their minions.

Tasmania. those types of programs are exactly what my European friends DCs use ...it could be exchanges with similar schools in US or Australia, or Berlin or Russia for a few weeks .on end or a whole term or summer..usually arranged by their schools and they immerse themselves in the language and yes, virtually non-existent here .