Lower 4th? Upper 5th? What did these historic form/year group names mean?!

[Erebus]

OK, I know about 'lower' and 'upper' 6th (though don't really understand why you now go from Y11 to the lower sixth...)- but I was listening to CE on R2 yesterday a.m. and he was asking about a school reunion of was it the upper fourth in 1965 ish! But the point is, what was the lower fourth? Why were the forms called this, what was the historical reason? Was there an upper fourth? Was movement from lower to upper automatic? I recall being issued with books like an atlas in the first form (yes) of a GS in 1973 whose previous keepers had been in the upper third or lower 5th, too.

I believe my dad told be that you started GS back in the early 1940s straight into the third form for some reason- but at 11, surely, as it was very much the 11+ back then.

And do you now start real public school at 13 into Y9? (disregarding the 'Shells' & 'Remove' year group names at was it Harrow?!)

Anyone know?

Brilliant! I am rather impressed by those.

easy peasy - google is your friend - several of them - Jesuit

I had the whole Upper Third/Lower Fourth thing too, and could more or less get the hang of the Antonia Forest logic (although 'Middle Remove' also got the odd mention, so did the Remove thing carry on as a kind of C stream?)

What really confused me was a book I read by Alec Waugh (Evelyn's brother) set in a public school, where boys seemed to be randomly moved up years or not based on their achievement - and yet all finished school at more or less the expected time? I'm presuming this is some archaic but true system - does anyone know?

Okay what about:
Second form
Third form
Little Erasmus
Upper fourth
Great Erasmus
Deputy grecians
Grecians

A friend of mine went there.

mummytime
but that school gives out masses of scholarships so it can afford to be odd : and another set of historic religious links

My grammar (60s - 70s) used Upper III to Upper VI. It had a prep school (voluntary controlled school so this was possible) with Kindergarten - Lower III.
DS's independent day school operated with 1-Upper 6 in senior school - and the classes were all variations on the letter A (A, Alpha, Akara, Aleph).
The posher boarding/day school in our town just uses Year 7-Year 11 then Lower and Upper 6th.

Junior Part
Middle Part
Fifth Book
Sixth Book Two
Sixth Book One

Is Winchester's opaque take on years 9-13. Note that VIbk2 comes before 1...

Prep schools go from Year 3 to Year 8

My school (all-girls, independent) was:

Pre-kindergarten (rising 4s)
Kindergarten
Transition
Lower first
Upper first
Lower second
Upper second... And so on until upper sixth. The senior school began at upper third I think.

My son's school starts with the Lower First (year 6), then upper first, lower third, upper third, lower fifth, upper fifth, lower sixth, upper sixth. I have no idea why they miss out the twos and fours!

Frogs! My brothers went to that school. Its the jesuit model of academic progress!

Apparently Winchester calls its years
Junior Part
Middle Part
V Book
VI Book 2
VI Book 1

Eton has the rather dull Blocks, F block is the first year and it progresses to B block.

Remove at Harrow is year 10. They start off in year 9 as Shells, then removes in year 11, 5th form for year 12 then the usual lower and upper 6th. No idea why though.

Eton sounds like a prison!

My junior school had lower kindergarten, upper kindergarten and transition before you made it to Form One. I think that was the equivalent of Year 3, looking back.

Well my school was slightly different
Upper IV (year 8)
Lower V
Middle V
Upper V
Lower VI
Upper VI

Re pre-prep prep etc

In private world In normal world
Nursery/lower kindergarten. 2-3 year olds play group
Upper kindergarten. 3-4 year olds pre-school
Pre-prep reception to year 2
Preprartory. Year 3-8
Senior Year 9-11
Sixth form. Sixth form

Mine was the same as celestialsquirrels and CallMeNancy.

Y7: Lower IV
Y8: Upper IV
Y9: Lower V
Y10: Middle V
Y11: Upper V
Y12: Lower VI
Y13: Upper VI

If the school began with H and was separated from the neighbouring boys' school with a big gate, then perhaps it was the same one!

Apologies for waking the zombie thread but what does it all mean?!

Lots of examples here of odd naming systems but the logic evades me.

At DS' school: yr 7, yr 8, 5th form, lower shell, upper shell, 6th form, remove.

I have no idea why.

AKAIK 'shell' was nicked from Westminster, where it was named after the shell-shaped area pupils were taught. We had Lower and Upper 'Remove' at school, but buggered if I know what this stems from and what it means.

Thanks bobthebuddha, shell bit if the mystery solved.

You do wonder if it is all deliberately absurd in a nobby "we do things differently here, hem hem" kind of way...

My private school was like this.
Upper 3 entry at 11+ (age 11/12)
lower 4
upper four
lower five
upper five ( age 15/16 O level year)
lower sixth
upper sixth

My sons' current private school has moved to the state school numbering but they still have lower and upper sixth for the sixth form.

Remember state schools were the same for a lot of this too. I remember because I am old enough when state schools brought in year 1 year 2 etc.

They didn't have that numbering before either.

All stuff designed to make sure you can spot those who don't belong. Like most rules. Lots of code words and behaviours- if you slip up on one of the rules you're exposed as "not one of us".

Really rather unpleasant- and still much more prevalent than you think. Remember the broadsheet mockery of David Beckham when he wore his MBE (I think) on the wrong side?

Is it any different though to text speak, slang, horse racing jargon, words used at Brownie and Guides etc ? I've just had to look up the meaning of AKAIK used on this thread. My state grammar was the same as Jilly's private school; Upper III, Lower IV etc.

Yes. There are technical words for things that need names. And there are traps for the unwary.