Bursaries - conflicting advice from schools on when to apply for them

[toomuchredwine]

Have nc for this one.....

Applying for 4 indies for dd and bursaries for all of them.

Now, two of the schools have said apply for the bursary BEFORE you 'sit the assessment' and two have said apply only if dd is offered a place.

Can those with dc who've applied for bursaries or any bursars share what they did/procedure?

What concerns me with applying for the bursary before she goes for assessment is that she'll be going in with a metaphorical sign above her head saying 'bursary candidate' and that may impact their decision. I think it's better for her to be given a shot without our financial circumstances being highlighted at this stage, then, if she is successful go from there.

The schools that request you apply before assessment say it's because they need to determine what funds are to be allocated at an early stage. They say if you don't apply for the bursary when applying to school and she gets in, the funds might have already been used by the time we come back and ask for a bursary.

It sounds plausible enough, but I don't know if she'll be fairly assessed compared to everyone else.

Which is the 'right approach' applying before or after assessment?

Hi,
As bursaries are individual to each school, its VERY important to follow each seperate schools rules on how they allocate bursaries. Without wishing to sound harsh, Its no good having ideas of what they may or may not think at assessment. They are potentially investing huge sums of money in your dd and they need to have the conversations early, there is little point your dd sitting assessments and you potentially paying deposits etc if on financial assessment they can't meet your needs. I'm already having lengthy conversations with bursars and my ds doesn't move to senior school until 2015.

Schools will be interested in bagging the best candidates, so don't worry about them labelling your DD prematurely, just go with the procedures for each individual school and hope for the best. Trying to second guess them won't help you.

Agree. Each school will have its own procedures. The one I am familiar with asks for you to apply up front. Places are allocated on merit based on exam performance with bursary funds allocated to those who qualify, starting at the top of the exam ranking until all funds are offered. If you waited to ask for funds until you got offer, you would be very unlikely to get anything.

Or to paraphrase all that, follow the school's instructions please.

Ok thanks very much for the responses. Maybe I am just becoming rather paranoid over the whole process - strange it's so different though for different schools....

Each school will have their own rules (& bursary funds!). At dds school you have to apply for the bursary before or at the same time as applying for the school. I think the bursary form had to be in by November but school applications were taken until beginning of January. Then when results are posted you also get result of bursary application. They state that bursaries can be applied for after the november date but funds might all be allocated.

Another school we applied for, we filled in a preliminary form ie basic income etc but no evidence, and when places were allocated a more detailed form was sent out for completion. We declined this place.

starving - would you mind if I asked why you declined the latter? was it because of the school or because you didn't feel comfortable with their bursary policy?

Its so different because each school is effectively its own manager and will have a different amount available in their bursary funds.

Some schools will be foundations, some charitable trusts, some basically a business owned by a family or a board.

They will allocate bursaries differently - some will state a child has to get a scholarship first, others will have criteria like full boarding only attracting bursaries or in cases of proven 'need' with a list of what the 'need' could be.

The only common thing with some (not all) is that they use a common form to assess your finances. I have applied to different schools who have offered anything from 20% to 80% based on exactly the same figures supplied by me.

At the end of the day, its about how much they want your dd in their school and how many pupils the bursaries have to be divided between.

In one intake they may have (just a broad example) 5 applicants so assign roughly 20% to each one or another year just 2 meeting the criteria so they could hypothetically receive 50% each.

Best to fill in the forms as and when required and hope for the best.

Thanks so much Labro - very helpful. You said about being offered differing amounts by different schools - presumably your child sat the exams before you received notification of what they intended to offer you? So did you apply for him, send off all the details, then he got in to all the schools, then they sent back an offer for your ds and then the bursary offer?

You also said your having conversations with bursars now ahead of 2015 intake - same intake year as dd, is there anything I should be asking that's very important, bar filling the forms out and sending back with relevant documentation and reg fee for school, then just waiting to hear when her assessment is.

Also, when do they visit the house? Our house is awful but I'm sure they won't give a hoot, I hope!

you're not your!!

How old is your dd and what year group are you applying for?

No, he hasn't sat the exams, been offered a place etc.

No offers of places have been made, the bursar at each school has indicated the maximum level of support that might be achieved. A lot of these schools cap individual awards - an example being Brighton College where a maximum bursary and scholarship combined is only £6, 000 regardless of my ability to pay the remainder. I then have to make the decision which schools to go through the application process for. 1 school wants bursary forms with the registration form, closing date end of November 2014. Another wants the bursary forms now, assessment date January 2015 - so cannot stress enough that they are ALL different.

The questions you possibly need to ask would probably be:

what level of award do they typically give (no good forking out registration fees if they never make an award anywhere near the level you require)

Are bursaries linked to academic performance - does your dd need to be scholarship standard.

Are there any other qualifying criteria for bursary assistance that you need to be aware of.

Haven't had a home visit yet, so unable to help there.

The most important thing you need to find out is generally how large their individual bursaries are. The reality is that despite grandiose claims on many school websites few schools offer very large bursaries e.g over 50% (day) 35% (boarding). If you're want more than then before you go to far in the application process speak to the bursar say "I'm realistically going to need say 75%" have you/do you give bursaries of this size. Explain your not asking him to agree to give you this amount now but you're asking because you don't want to raise your DS's hopes and then have then dashed due to finances and also avoid wasting your time and the schools time.
Some schools (like my DS's) will actually give you a ball park figure before you even register this is obviously the best way to do it.
We've been in receipt of generous bursaries for nearly 9 years we've never had a home visit. I'm not really sure what the point of one is you can always hide the Monet in the loft, bursars can look up you house on google earth and also easily find out average house prices/ rents for your area. Most bursar IME aren't interested in what make of washing machine you own or how much the antique porcelain you've just inherited from Auntie Flo is worth.

We've applied four times for bursaries & never had a home visit, even though it was stated on the paperwork this was something that would happen. Maybe we have honest faces or maybe it was easy to google our address & see we didnt live in Millionaires Row. I've spoken to a few people who've had home visits & they wondered why they were stressing beforehand! In the end, the home visits very informal & nothing to worry about, with no trick questions.

We've applied for bursaries at different times. Each school had its own way of doing things, with yearly financial updates/reapplications expected at all bar one which awarded its bursary for the full period DS was to attend the school. That one was also given before DS had taken his exams/scholarship papers. One school offered 10% with the other three substantially more. Just shows they're all different doesn't it?

If you're honest all the way through with your bursary application, (not implying you would be anything but honest!) you will have nothing to worry about.

The schools that ask for bursary applications before the assessment may well label your dd as 'bursary candidate' but they will only be comparing her to the other 'bursary candidates'; the schools will have earmarked a certain amount of funds they can give away and will want to make offers to the most suitable children according to their own criteria. Some schools receive a huge number of bursary applications eg,The Whitgift Foundation schools (hundreds a year I think for the 3 schools) and they need to sort out the paperwork well in advance of making offers otherwise it would be chaos!Other schools will only receive a handful of applications and can comfortably wait until after offers have been made.

I'm interested that you state you've applied to for bursaries from 4 schools especially as you imply you are going to need a substantial bursary. Schools giving substantial bursaries are few and far between so to be applying to four is unusual especially if there day schools; that means you've got four schools with actual generous bursary policies in travelling distance in your area. I'd struggle to name four admittedly boarding schools in the south east that offer a generous bursary unrelated to a scholarship. Have you done your research properly into these schools bursary policies or are you just taking a punt? Or perhaps your hoping for a scholarship with an attached bursary.
MN has frequent posting from people who've applied for a substantial bursary an are disappointed that they haven't got one.

With regard to the pre assessment application and the label "bursary candidate". If you were a school offering bursaries you're going to have some sort of criteria as to whom you offer financial support too. The reality is that in many schools bursaries are just another word for scholarship and they are at the very least going to be looking for a child who is going to give them some sort of return for their investment and high achieving academic performance is certainly viewed by many schools as a good return. The reality is that sadly Johnny Also Ran is going to struggle to get a substantial bursary in fact any bursary at all.

Labro - DD will be going into year 7 in Sept 15 intake so will be 11. Two of the schools you need to be scholarship standard, the other two not, but obviously still be in top % of results to be awarded the bursary.

One of the schools (the most transparent one which dd and I love) broke down for us what % of students receive bursaries. I'm not going to repeat it all just in case they read this, but bursar was very open and explained XX% of pupils are on a full bursary. (I looked at how many pupils at the school and converted % into actual numbers.)

One pupil this year is on 110% to cover extras and then the bursar told me the rest of the range starting from 10%. I would say the majority receive between 30-50% of fees paid. Over 30% of the students at that school are on some sort of bursary.

The other two schools (waiting for a call back from the bursar at last school) wouldn't give breakdowns but said their bursaries range from 10% to 100%. They weren't too specific when I asked how much it would be possible for us to get with our income, just kept saying it's all means tested and impossible to say until all documentation returned and assessed.

middleclass - we live in London so maybe we are just lucky being slap in the middle of 4 day schools (not boarding) that do give bursaries. the furthest one would be a 45 mins commute for dd (each way.)

The fact you've been in receipt of generous bursaries for 9 years is amazing - you must be thrilled. Is that because your dc is super bright and at scholarship level? Would you mind sharing whether that's at the same school or at different schools and a little bit more about how you managed to get the bursary and amount? You can PM if you'd prefer not to post here. It's so helpful to speak to others who've been through this.

I know it's super competitive and many, as you say, end up disappointed and don't getting any bursary at all, but there are success stories - yours being an excellent example of this.

We're going to give it our best shot and hope for the best.

Oh and re:home visit, DH wants them to come round and see our 10 year old banger parked outside alongside our antiques, swimming pool and 10 bedrooms of course!!!!!

Do PM me I'm always happy to discuss bursaries in more detail privately rather than on an open forum.

Of course - I completely understand, I will PM you later when I have a quiet moment! Thank you.

Best of luck. Ds is older than your dd, going for yr 9 entry in 2015.

toomuchredwine we declined the second school because dd also got a place (and a bursary) at her first choice school, the second was plan B!