Schools should 'provide sleepovers' to help parents with cost of childcare

[Itchyandscratchy]

Here

Speechless.

I have never met one who wasn't- not after about a month anyway.

'all 4 and 5 year olds'. I assume you mean the ones you know? I know plenty who definitely aren't tired at the end of a school day nor at the end of an extended day.

As the stock of grandparents and other relatives runs out for free and flexible childcare (in the future, grandparents will either still be working, or too decrepit because the parents didn't produce children until they were in their 40s, as per their parents...), something has to be done to plug the gap. The options for childcare do not become more palatable over time - more and more people requiring childcare for less and less cost=more and more crap provision to choose from. Obviously, however, it's fine for the minority wealthy enough to avoid the crap. Even more interesting when the grandparents who are too elderly to help look after the kids start to need care: plenty of crap provision out there for them, already. I can see lots of jolly parents, putting their parents in homes where they can be neglected by poorly trained staff and then dropping their kids in school for the odd sleepover and thinking what fantastic lives they lead, isn't it great now men and women are equal and nobody has to care for anyone unless they are unlucky enough not to get a better paid job? Caring, after all, isn't women's work or men's work, it's menial work. So who cares?

exotic

When I started school (not in this country), it started at 7am and finished at 4pm, after which I had piano lessons. Yep... I was about 4-5 years old. Recently, former classmates put up pictures on FB. None of us looked unhappy or tired!!!

We moved to another country afterwards, I was about 7 years old. School started at 8am, and ended at 1pm... after which I walked (with a friend - sometimes alone) about a mile to the local after school club for lunch, homework and play. Mum picked me up afterwards.

No big deal!!!!

I have been a supply teacher and taught hundreds of 4and5yr olds. They need to get out of school by 3pm. Maybe a few are fresh at the start of term- but not a few weeks in!

Tasmania - you sound like you had quite a privileged upbringing. Would you have fancied school from 7am to 6pm being bored, mixing with badly behaved, fractious children who didn't have your staying power, followed by practising banging a tambourine, because it's cheaper than a piano and more easily replaced if a kid bashes it about too much?

This extended day won't be staffed by teachers or school,likely be external staff
It isn't extending the teaching day,it's extended use of premises to provide on site provision
There is absolutely no mention of this being staffed by existing school staff

The whole thing is ridiculous - no one could afford it- if they could they would be using boarding schools and they have been proved to be emotionally damaging for 4/5 yr olds. They also have huge long holidays with no child care.

Those who think 4/5 yr olds can cope with it I would absolutely love you to have 30 of them for a day!

It won't happen. Teachers are already leaving in droves. No way would I stay over night.

Maybe ds and his cohort are different. At 4 he and several of his friends were in school from 7.30am to 6.30pm. At that age it is easy as they only have reading to do after school. It is harder doing those hours when they get older unless they can do their homework at school. Ds's school day (when he isn't boarding) starts at 7.30am and he doesn't get home until 7pm and then has homework to do. I still find it hard to get him to go to bed before 9pm and he's 9.

No, heaven forbid it would be staffed by people so well qualified and paid. That wouldn't be affordable.

rabbitstew - I agree with most of what you wrote there except that I think the majority will be outsourcing caring and feeling nothing but anxiety - they will be doing it simply to keep afloat. I don't think they'll even be thinking that they are pretty cool, and that caring is menial.

I also reckon caring, the caring we pay for, will be increasingly stratified: you really will know about it if you are going to pay for "good" care. And I think that is going to be interesting, because at the moment, what constitutes "care", and what differentiates qualities of care, is not completely "visible".

But I find your post really interesting. I think you are spot on about the sources of affectional and relational care are going to dry up, especially because retirement is going to disappear.

The impact of all this on care for the elderly hasn't even begun to be thought about yet by the majority of people.

I think this is a really interesting area, to be honest.

Though a bit grim.

And where are the external staff coming from and who is paying them at unsociable hourly rate?

I doubt the 'sleepover' provision would be aimed at 4 and 5 year olds

Where has all the money come from for all the academies that have sprouted up everywhere?

Good question.

I was under the impression that the budgets weren't quite balancing.

Certainly in London there has been huge increase in demand for school places in past decade, and many schools have struggled to find space for classrooms and lunch, nevermind additional services.

Doh,there's a recession numerous applicants seeking posts. Who'll pay?parents
Working from 3pm isn't unsocial hours.
The boarding thing is option in few school not the norm.thats not jist of article

bico

Could your experience with these 4-5 years old be due to the diet??? Plenty of kids get very sugary food that makes them hyper for 2-3 hours, following which they are tired.

Protein early in the morning, etc. is a lot better than jam or sugary Kelloggs, etc.

exotic - If this ever happened (and, frankly, i don't think it will happen on a large scale yet - people just aren't desperate enough - there are enough decent childminders - women [it is mainly women] can still, just about, cut back on hours of paid work) it would be agencies supplying low-skilled workers, from poorer countries, or from a strata of the UK under-qualified. And there would be the occasional scandal.

But I don;t see it happening yet because people just aren't that desperate.

That's complete speculation.there are more than enough folk here to fill such posts
And it's hard to get oversea worker sponsored in uk for unskilled work
There are existing applicants who could and would fill such posts

thecatfromjapan - I was being sarcastic about people being jolly. I have absolutely no doubt the situation will make most people miserable and anxious (except for those who can afford the sort of care for their children that it apparently makes their children cry when they see mummy and daddy at picking up time, because they are just SO happy in after school club...).

The DfE has overspent hugely on free schools and academies. So it will have to cut school budgets to make up for its overspend - so maintained schools suffer for something they had nothing to do with.

I can't comment on ds's friends' diets but ds definitely didn't and doesn't get sugary food. He and his friends are just typical children with loads of energy. Even now if I manage to get him to go to bed at 7.30pm he is up before 6am.

Mind you, it might well say more about mummy and daddy than after school club...

In this debate we need to treat the physical school buildings separately from the educational work of the school staff.

Fair enough to treat the school as a community asset and encourage the use of the buildings and grounds outside teaching times. Allow the buildings to be used as a base by commercial after school clubs, who come in and use the premises before and after school or during the holidays. Allow adult education classes to run in the evenings etc. (although there are safeguarding issues about allowing children and adults to share the space at the same time).

But I see no reason why any of this should be the responsibility of the head teacher and their staff to organise, or why their hours or responsibilities should change - they would just become another organisation that uses the premises (with the first priority).

If there is someone out there who wants to set up a "kidshotel" service providing overnight childcare and they want to use existing buildings (schools/nurseries/purpose build their own) to do that - then OK, let them knock themselves out working through how to make it happen, so that everyone is kept safe and happy. Just don't make it something that the school (as an educational organisation rather than a building) is responsible for.

Oooops - I did not mean you, bico

I means exotic

meant