Schools should 'provide sleepovers' to help parents with cost of childcare

[Itchyandscratchy]

Here

Speechless.

I'd expect the parents to flag up concerns with the provider and OFSTED. I'm not sure what business it is of the HT, it would be a bit like complaining about the preschool staff to the lady who runs Weightwatchers in our local community centre - just because they happen to share a building.

I'd expect any competent adult (staff or parent) to flag up any concern
Staff have professional registration and duty to report anything untoward
Your calorie counting analogy makes no sense

So are you expecting the HT to stay onsite after hours to check up on the commerical providers? After all they are only sharing a building? Or are you in fact saying that the HT does have some additional responsibility for manner in which out of hours care is provided?

You're completely off at tangent.i did not say that.you did to try expand your point
Maybe stick to weight watchers

You said that there was no credible suggestion that school staff would be involved in the scheme. You said that there was no suggestion that the school or school staff would be engaged in the role.

But you then say that the HT will be responsible for approving the quality of care and imply that school staff will be responsible for some sort of monitoring so that they can report any issues to OFSTED.

So either they are involved, or they aren't - which is it?

I simply said a ht could comment if required on after school(as can any competent adult)
That doesn't convert to having managerial or professional responsibility for an external provider
This is not extending school day,it's school as a base for childcare if needed

The only point on which I disagree with you was when you said
"As goes on now,ht has role in approving after school quality,if it is lacking ht can intervene".

Because I don't think that the HT does have a role approving after school care quality. They don't approve childminders, nurseries, afterschool clubs held on other sites, there is no need for them to have any sort of role in approving what happens in the school building out of school hours.

Maybe not formally,that's ofsted but if ht heard of something untoward I'm sure they can intervene
I'm not suggesting the ht vets afterschool,I am saying ht can legitimately comment if need be
In fact any parent user of an after school can comment to ht or ofsted

On a very simple level- where are the beds going? Is there to be massive building schemes with extensions? Sounds unworkable when many schools are waiting for refurbishment- and have been for years.

Are they taking away the playing fields for the extensions?

The boarding thing is a complete red herring. No one is suggesting all schools are going to do this.

Existing rooms are not really viable either. A lot of setting up of classrooms and hall/PE etc is done after school for the following day. It's not practical to put everything away in a classroom at the end of the day. So a dedicated space would need to be built with toilets and cooking facilities. That's before finding quality staff. And caretakers willing to work the extra. And the space to build. And the money. A lotHow can the demand be forecast? They can't even forecast the amount of school places needed in most boroughs let alone the need of wraparound care.

Why have children when your life is so busy you need to farm them out on a 24 hour basis?

They ought to come with a warning- 'children are inconvenient and will change your life'.
It isn't possible to have them cared for by others and just pay a bit of attention to them when you can fit them in.
Reading it through of course it is possible but you have to pay for it, and if you want good quality care you have to pay a lot. It can't be done on the cheap.
School are not, and were never intended, to be about childcare. They have child friendly hours and it is up to the parent to sort out childcare around them. Breakfast club and after school club are not the best way for the child, especially the young child-they need to get away from the institutional setting.
I dare say that you can staff them- whether you can get high quality staff is a other matter.

Looking back to the title it says 'schools should have sleepovers to help parents with the cost of childcare'. I can't see how it helps with the cost- I wouldn't provide it for less than £42 an night, with meals extra. I'm not even sure that I would do that because anti social hours should mean more than normal CM rates.

There is also the cost of lighting and heating to factor in + more work for the caretaker. There are all the CRB issues when the school hall is hired out to exercise classes etc.

rabbitstew - great post at 23:18

The government's plan seems to be fixated around both parents working all the hours God sends and very rarely having to see their own children.

How about the parents do the childcare, and the government subsidises people to be able to afford homes, or whatever it is that both parents are having to work for.

Oh - baby farming. Bingo.

How many threads do you read on here where women WANT to work and cannot afford to, or are restricted by school hours/holidays?

The article says clearly that the govt plans to change the rules to allow schools to be more flexible about opening hours and will offer help to let them provide more afterschool care - amongst other proposed changes. The sleepovers were offered by ONE school mentioned in the article and the headline is just goady toss.

This does not equal everyone being forced to send their kids to school for 24 hours a day. It offers more flexibility to working parents. That is all.

I mentioned early on in this thread that I am in Belgium and ALL schools offer this. Building is open from 7.30 to 6pm and a LA controlled holiday club is offered. They employ staff who work on a rota basis and perform other tasks within the school. So they do the lunchtime supervision, help with gym and swimming classes, provide homework supervision and afterschool care. In the holidays, they run the holiday club, assisted by university students. All of this is done within LA premises. My LA holiday club is 8 euros per day to include a cooked lunch.

In addition here, a huge number of other providers also use school buildings during the holidays. [[
www.tobogganasbl.be/programmes/ Example]]

The system works fabulously well. I am totally shocked at the horror and outrage this seems to cause here. My colleagues would think you were all barking mad.

Exactly tiggytape.

I have no problem with proper childcare provision. However this is just the government pretending that improvements can be made by 'cutting red tape' rather than spending money. Holiday clubs and extended hours already exist. Meanwhile the government has been very quiet about lack of actual school places.

See also how cuts can apparently be made to legal aid because so much money is wasted on paper, but contrast and compare with admin costs of all this faffing around with the national curriculum.

Plus ca change.

And piprabbit, I completely see your point. The article specifically says that parents will trust this childcare more because it is on school premises.

Either the head teacher is responsible and providing childcare really is part of their job description and they really will be on site, doing spot checks and briefing staff, or they have no more to do with it than handing over a key and these parents would have been misled.

(Wonder if this logic also applies to schools being used as polling stations? Can I complain to head re: Michael gove?)

I think that's a ridiculous idea. Yes offer before and after school clubs which wilk help parents. However having children sleep at school wll take away family life which is very important. Children are not just things that need to fit in with thier parents needs they also have needs and need to spend time at home with thier family. It will also cause already over worked teachers more work.

Well, I for one don't want school buildings used for holiday clubs etc Long holidays are the only time they can get all the furniture out to deep clean the rooms, carry our essential maintenance, building work and decoration.

Children have been at school from 9-3 for a very long time-it works just fine for them. If people's childcare is an issue, a solution needs to be found but I don't think having it on school grounds is it.

As for the Poster who had a common room with sofas? Really? My sixth form block had a common room with two sofas in, but I've never heard of a (state) primary with a common room?!