Do you actually know an indie family?

[TotallyBS]

We chose to go private because we don't have any grammar schools in our catchment and the local. comps aren't brilliant. Other choose private because their state schools have to work hard just to be not brilliant. Many of us would love to put the fees towards reducing out mortgage or holidays for e.g. if only we had decent state schools to send our kids to.

Of course there are those choose private imply because they have the disposable income such they don't have to carry out a cost benefit analysis. They do it for the same reason you like a nice hotel while on holiday complete with room service, big pool and a kids club ie nothing to do with avoiding less well off families.

As for the parents, away from places like Eton, they tend to be accountants, dentists, estate agents and the like. So not much opportunity for social climbing at most indies

The above is the preamble to the question in the subject because judging from the views expresseb by various anti private posters, very few of you actually know an indie family.

I mean, all they seem to go on about is how indie parents are snobby, social climbing and don't want their kids to mix with less well off kids. Maybe those generalisations are true for places like Eton but most indies that trade on their academic record are full of ordinary albeit well paid people.

So the next time you go on about how some parents think that the state system is full of underachieving DCS born to unsupportive WC parents, have a good look at the mirror. I suspect the person that you see isn't that different from the person you are complaining about.

Incidentally, there is another school gate politics thread going on at the moment. Apparently state school moms can be bitchy and clique-ey. shock horror

... I meant I see little evidence of snobbery.

Being rich does not equate to being 'snobby'- you are perpetuating inaccurate generalisations.

And yet another non sequitur from montmartre.

I was responding to your post of 00:42:18.

Are you being deliberately obtuse or is it your natural state?

I was making the point that anti private school posters make the unfair generalisation that well off parents are all snobs. But yet here you accusing me of equating rich with being a snob???

The problem is OP, that although your overall point is probably right - parents privately educate for a variety of reasons - the structure and substance of your argument is undermined by your own assumptions and prejudices. You have presented a number of points as factual which is confusing and unhelpful to your case.

For example, the conclusion that a social climber is not and cannot be a dentist or an accountant is just strange. Surely people can desire a higher social status whatever your job?

But we get it. You think we should all appreciate that not all people choose private school because they're snobs. Ok. Probably a bit of a truism to be honest but point made.

Moving on...

Sorry - 'whatever their job.' Freudian slip.

i thought this fred was going to be interesting about hippies living an alternative lifestyle thing

Yeah I thought it was about families that were into Sonic Youth and Tame Impala.

A couple of my DSs mates are a bit indie,maybe not though,more hipster than indie.

OP, how many of your friends have children at Eton? If the answer is fewer than five or so, then you seem to be making the sort of generalisations that you are complaining about.

There is definitely a weird crowd here tonight

Yes, and you appear to have been one of them.

I'm gutted , thought I was going to find a school that would teach DD about the genius of The Smiths.

And WTF is an "indie family"? Are they in some way different from other families?

I don't know any "indie" families. I do know a lot of families where some or all of the children go to private school. Is that what you mean?

I know many families who send their DC to independent school. I equally know many families who send their DC to state schools. The beggest difference between them is that most of those who pay for their DC to be educated are able to afford it. Those who do not cannot and no way ever could - so income is the biggest divider (taking out those DC who might get full scholarships that is).

This income gap often ( but not always) means that the DC who are privately educated tend to belong to a particular social grouping.The behaviour of the DC therefore tends to be more compliant and they tend to accept, if not fully buy into ( pardon the pun) the idea that they should dowell in their studies
(as far as ability allows) and if they do not, then they do not disrupt the learning oportunities of others. Hence often it is said behaviour is better in such schoolsor if you prefer the pupils are teachable.

The over riding characteristic of many DC who attend state school is one of disrespect and disdain for education gained from parents who belong to different social groupings. Whilst some of those whose income level prevents them accessing private education do value education ( enter many MNers), by far the biggest issue with DC of state education is the very wide range of social groups and equal social skills and attitudes in such schools.The ethos therefore is morelikely to be one of selfishness and ensuring they get what they want from the system and in doing so ensure no one else has access to anything else. Hence the large number of behavioural issues in classrooms - which largely are nothing more than sheer rudeness and poor manners and culture of those groups. In short,regardless of many things, the underclass rule supreme in the environment ( no mater how few of them there are) and their values and culture are the biggest leveller being often transferred to other DC whose family lives may not always reflect the same values. Dont under estimate the power of peer groups in school dear parents.

Well, Op your username is fairly suggestive that you're not entirely serious?! or are drunk/a shitstirring journo

Different day, same old bullshit, eh, Ronaldo?

Wow Ronaldo. You've actually left me speechless. Must be because of the embedded rudeness and lack of respect which my state school education has saddled me with...

FFS.

Limelight, Ronaldo has "form". I would avoid engaging if I were you. You'll just end up with a massive bruise on your head from bashing it against the brick wall.

Ronaldo: I haven't found that to be the case at all. At DS1's state secondary school, the pupils are well-behaved and hard working. A lot of them either came to Britain within their lifetime or their parents did and there is definitely an ethos of putting education as a very high priority, along with respect and obedience towards their parents. All of the pupils know they are lucky to be going to the school (six applicants per place) and they make the most of the opportunities it has to offer.

Thanks for the heads up Seeker.

As you were Ronaldo.

Ditto.

I think you talk mostly weirdy bollocks. And you have implied people are drunk. I think perhaps you may be drunk and as such are having a rant? And indie family around my area is the definition of Unconditional Parenting, lots of Pj Harvey being listened to , and generally lentil weaving. You are American I take it.

Here's a generalisation for you: posters who start off by making obscure and unfounded comments invariably become rude AND condescending when it's pointed out to them that they are in fact in error