8+ London in January - how do they assess?

[HIJKLMNOP]

Can anyone with 8+ London experience tell me how much importance schools like Colet Court/Westminster Under/Sussex House/Kings/Wetherby place on 8+ exam results versus the interview and activity sessions? Are the schools ever forgiving of a boy having an ?off? or perhaps mediocre day for the exam if the boy does well with the other 'tests', and also has a good report reference from his present school? Or is it all about nailing the exam on the day and the other factors help them narrow down the candidates who had big success on the exam? It would be great to hear others? experiences, thanks !

I dont know the answer to your question, but know the competition is strong for Colet/Westminster/Kings. It is also quite hard for schools to spot who at 8+ has the potential to go all the way through to A level in a very academic setting without feeling pressured. My guess is that they will err on the side of caution, and will want to see evidence on the day that there is real headroom.

This is partly because there are lots of other opportunities to join. We know lots of children who were not ready (DS) at 8+ or who failed the exams who then got places at 10+, 11+, or 13+. Much better from both the school's and the child's perspective to allow a marginal child the chance to mature and find their own level.

Someone recently provided a good link to Eton College's list of recommended prep schools. As far as I could see all the standard London preps were on the list including Wetherby, and so worth looking at. If your son is not the type to sail into Colet or Westminster Under there no harm and some advantage in having him in a prep that only goes to 13+. The ability range is likely to be wider so he can find his level. He is likely to change a lot between 7 and 13 and you will then keep your options open. Maybe he will want to board, maybe he is happier with co-ed, maybe he is the sort of child who does better being in the top third rather than the bottom third of a school, maybe sport, or art, or drama is his passion.

These preps will lose some pupils at 8+ so getting in should not be so tough. The mixed ones also lose girls at 11+ so are often keen to take in boys at 8+ who plan to stay to 13.

Thank you so much, Needmoresleep - very kind of you to reply with such thoughtful detail. DS is down to sit some of these exams in January and I have been feeling extra nervous of late, as he is the type to either go for it completely or rebel entirely - bright-ish but bolshy! Much better in a one-to-one or group situation than in a half hour exam, we fear, hence my curiosity about how they assess. Fortunately he does not have to leave his school this year - I just fear these schools might not be looking for potential, as they say they are, but really for the finished product that the big pre-preps are producing. I hope they look at the whole child!

Any other advice/experiences out there would be gratefully received!

Hello HIJKLMOP. My DS successfully passed the 8+ for 3 of the schools on your list. The most competitive schools are Colet, WUS, and King's - King's being the trickiest one as their primary intake is at 7+, thus only accept a handful at 8+ (6-8 boys). Sussex House has many cross applicants with Colet Court and WUS, and does realize that it will lose many of its top candidates to these other schools. Wetherby Prep is a school which is used by many as a fall-back option, however due to competition dramatically increasing at 7+/8+ to London day schools, it too has become more competitive.

I am not familiar with Wetherby Prep or its admission process, but can speak of the other schools. FOr WUS and Colet, your DS will not get through to the activity/interview stage unless he passes the exam. For both schools, they cull about 2/3 of their candidates at this stage. Only after he has passed the exam will he be asked to come back for the exam/activity. At this stage, it is usually a coin toss in terms of probability of acceptance. They are looking at the boy's ability to work in a group, think for himself, and also looking to weed out heavily tutored children.

King's and Sussex interview all boys - King's on a date prior to the exam and Sussex as a part of the exam. Additionally, King's has an activity morning in December for its 8+ candidates. For both, the exam is the most important. I'd say that the interview and activity morning are more important for King's as they accept so few boys, but this is not a case that a stellar interview and activity date performance will mitigate less stellar exam results, rather the boy needs to nail all 3 parts.

I do agree that there is quite a bit of stress about these early exams, but do keep in mind that boys do change quite a bit during the prep school stage, and many boys do better in a less pressurized environment than some of the schools you have mentioned. There are other intake points, although if your son is coming from a private prep which does not end at 11, the next best intake is at 13+ as 11+ is definitely geared towards state school applicants.

Thank you, Mominatrix - it is a very nervous time this month and great to be armed with as much info and reassurance as possible. Can I ask if your DS went to a pre-prep that had focus on the 8+ success? Or was he a natural exam taker? Thank you for replying!

Colet is (comparatively) focused on Maths -- its English paper is significantly easier than KCJS's English paper, but its Maths paper is significantly harder. Colet I think select from the exam stage twice as many candidates as they have places to go through to the interview stage, so the big winnowing-down is by exam and then they eliminate 50% of the remainder at interview.

Thanks for the info, CaseyShraeger - I do wonder why every school (so far as I hear?) seems to be different in its exams/analysis of quite young boys and what they ought to be able to do? Poor boys!

I am aiming for these schools as well for the next year. Can you pls tell me if anyone has tutored his son for the exams? I am in need of a tutor who worked with some boys for these schools and have succeeded. I do not need someone to teach him any subjects (in means of academically) but a tutor who prepared kids particularly to these exams so can teach my child what to expect in the exams, to teach some test tecniques etc. Experienced moms, help please!

I agree with Casey - Colet's exam is heavily math focused, as the strength of the school (and St. Paul's) is math and science. The English was a tick-the-box exercise. Additionally, Colet has the trickiest non-verbal reasoning section.

My son's school went on to 13, so although they did support (very well) 7+/8+ candidates, we did have the reassurance that he did have a place until CE. Not sure about natural exam-taker, but his school did prep them on exam technique and did additional sessions for the exams.

My son did the 7+ exams to Colet and Kings last year and his school didn't do any prep since they preferred the boys to stay on with the girls until 11. We didn't have a tutor either. All we did was some bond assessment papers available from bookshops on and off from about Nov before Jan exams and tried to learn more timetables not yet covered at his previous school . He got into both (to my but not my DH surprise ) . I think they need some preparation in the form of doing these practice papers not to be completely lost if the material is unfamiliar like some would have definitely been to my DS since his school didn't prep. It was hard not to get sucked into the panicky competition . My DH was much more confident and relaxed but he went to a very academic school ( and didn't find it hard) and I wasn't educated in this country. All I can say is I can't believe we are now on the other side alive and DS is so very happy at his new school and doing great. Now we have a little 8m daughter and I already think( worry) about the future which is a bit crazy since she's just a baby... Good luck and try to relax and breathe :)!

Hi SuGrace, my DS did the Colet Court exam two years ago and is really enjoying it there now. I was slightly uncertain about putting him through an exam when he was so young but in the end thought it was worth it to save him having to take the exam later on! We went with Phoenix Tutors www.phoenixtutors.co.uk through a friend's recommendation - I was looking for someone who could help DS concentrate without stressing him out (tough call!), and Tom and DS got on really well, I think more than anything it made him feel enthusiastic and on the day he didn't seem nervous at all, which was great. Good luck, agree with Nordicmom although it seems impossible at times!

Dear LivBailey, may i ask - did you son sit 7+ or 8+? We live in North London and aiming for 8+ exams next January. I totally agree with your comments regarding stressing the kids out; we would like to avoid overtutoring, what would be yr advice - when is it the best to start tutoring and how many lessons with the mentioned tutors to have per week? thank you

Our DS got into CC this Spring, from the reserve list. He had no formal tutoring, but I had him on the Bond books (as well as Schofield and Sims (harder) and Cambridge (easier)) for approaching a year before. Taken a little at a time, on a regular basis (minimum 3x per week, more often 4/5), they move slowly and set achievable goals. It kept the stress levels pretty low. So 20-40 mins per time. Longer on weekends. As a result, there wasn't anything, academically, that he felt under pressure about. Also, the CC reading list is excellent - they really push for an enjoyment of narrative rather than trying to be over-worthy too early on. DS whipped through many of those and continues to enjoy them. Very difficult in final analysis to know what makes for a successful application. The child can do well in the exam and interview and still not meet some unseen criteria. The head and staff were always kind and considerate, though. It was appreciated.

Thank you very much Westerly Dad, I am personally against tutoring and at the moment we are doing exactly the same as you did; what age level of books should it be for 8+ exams? apart from reading dow did you prep for english part of exams? thank you

The 7+ nor the 8+ require tutors if you're happy to put in the time yourself. What a tutor might help you achieve is a plan and give you some structure. Bond books are a great place to start. Times tables are a must, problem solving, some idea of fractions and division but not too detailed.

Comprehension answers in full sentences using the question within the answer, story writing you could try using a story hill (check out 3+4+5+7+ thread on primary Ed).

Have a plan - by XXX we need to have tried to learn YYY but be flexible next Jan is still some time away.

Don't worry about exam tech now do that in oct/nov. Right should be about content.

DS's school had them on times tables by 6, which is younger than some places.

As far as the Bond, start age appropriate. With the others, early Key Stage 2 books are pretty manageable. As they progress, the difficulty increases. By the time the exam rolled around, DS was several years ahead on all of them (i.e. doing 10-11 or 11+ books rather than the 7-8 books he'd started with). The trick was being consistent with the work, make it such a regular part of his schedule until he didn't even think about it anymore. In the last few months, he would wake on a Sat and Sun morning and race downstairs to do his homework so he could get to the important business of watching cartoons afterwards.

For him, the maths and non-verbal books were manageable, but the English comprehension was more of a struggle. It's better to get a sense of this early on so you'll know how to direct the work.

What mumteacher suggests above is pretty much exactly what we did for 7+ and 8+ with no tutor. We just used Bond (1-2 years above the actual age) for reasoning and maths, but for English did some slightly longer comprehensions with more writing and more "write what happens next" and similar questions. As far as I recall the Bond english is very factual and they will often also be asked in school tests to do a bit of extended writing at the end.

Thank you all for your very helpful answers! Happy Mothers Day!

Mddlesquuzed what exactly have you used for the English comprehension test practice? My daughter seems to be struggling with these (Y3). We did a term at Kip McGrath and she improved lots but would rather do tests with her myself than carry on Kipping till the end of Y6... Thanks

I was passed some by a friend who had used a tutor, then did my own after that. They were all a passage (various formats inc 1st person story, 3rd person story, play, letter etc), then a bunch of questions some of which required slightly longer answers. We did some orally so that it was a bit more fun and we could discuss the answers, and some more formally written down. Have just realised that some of them may actually have been copied from Bond Comprehension (as opposed to English) books as these do ask for longer answers, but they were from a variety of sources. There are other 'How to do comprehension' books available from Amazon too.

Thank you middlesqueezed will have a look at Amazon very helpful of you.