Areas where state schools are better than private?

[Narrie]

Does anyone live in an area where the state schools are really better than the private ones? I picked this up elsewhere but am afraid to comment there.

I have lived and worked in the Midlands where there are few private schools to choose but the state schools are not very good. I have lived in Nottingham, where again I felt the state schools were poor.

Even in London there were some awful schools and private was best.

I currently live in Cornwall having got here working in Exeter, Plymouth and Barnstaple. None of the state schools were good there.

Just wondered where the good state provision is. Is it just odd schools within a mass of poor provision or are there really whole areas where state schools are better?

Thanks.

(PS I have my own DC in a boarding school partly because of the state schooling and partly because we move around so much)

I would say that in Hampshire, and in particular Winchester the differential between private and state is about as narrow as it gets. The results from the state sector secondaries and in particular the sixth form colleges rival independent schools. I understand our well known sixth form college exceeds our well known boys public school for average points per student at A level!

The FT league tables also include results such as % pupils to 'good' unis. Is a rank 200 school that sends 75% of its pupils to good unis better than/worse than a rank 100 school that sends 60%. ??? It is all so complex and you can't even rely on people's opinions of schools as some people are duped by clever marketing into thinking a mediocre school is great.

What do league tables ultimately show? The playing filed is not level whether your considering the state or independent sector exam many factors contribute to exam results; how selective tehy are is obvioulsy key but also where your school is, tutoring or not paid for by parents etc and lets not forget how happy our DC's are at the individual school so Xenia is right (I dont often agree with her) its how happy we as parents and our children our that actually matters. word is also right being able to pay in the vast majority of cases gives choice freedom to choose the school we hope our DC's will be most suitable for.

All league tables tell you is how many pupils got how many grades.

They don't tell you the board. The resits. The subject. Whether the pupils are thriving and doing lots of other lovely things. I mean...they're just bald figures no?

OP, our 'outstanding' local state school get 90% 5 A* - C at GCSE with 100% of pupils getting 3A levels. Have a guess at the Ebacc %...

...it's 0% .

That matters to me.

"I understand our well known sixth form college exceeds our well known boys public school for average points per student at A level!"
According to Peter symonds Wensite 9.9% achieved As at a level, 50.1% achieved the same grade at the much harder pre U at Win Coll, 26.7% (Im assuming not including the A) achieved an A at PS, 89.1 % (incluidng those who got an A ) at Win Coll and I think a further 28.7% total 65.3% achioeved A - B at PS where as 94.% achieved A* - B at Win Coll. At PS 41% went onto RG universities at Win Coll 37% went onto Oxbridge and the all the rest the ivy League and RG universities. But as I've already said you are not comparing like with like. I drive a super mini I love it it does exactly what I want it to do its particularly fuel efficient, my DH drives a ridiculous sports care he loves it it accelerates at an eye watering rate speed and guzzles up petrol he loves it. You cannot compare the two because they do different animals.

pickled
is that 90% including English and maths?

pickled a family memeber called me yesterday about her DC at an 'outstanding' school. She has DC in the smae school year and wanted to pick my brain.

In year 9 her DD has already started her GCSEs with a view to just getting them done. Resitting 'as many times as necessary'.

She said it was bloody awful for the DC (her eldest has already been through this regime).

It is a completely cynical way to ensure the school emains hih in the league tables and has nothing whatsoever to do with a good education ...

just that sorting by 0% ebacc and then by % getting 5 a-c ince English & maths, the highest percentage is 81% and that's in a Boys Catholic school ....

wordfactory
then your family member needs to check the data from the school because the curriculum has changed to linear - no modules and resits for current year 10 downwards - its all exams at the end of year 11 (or year 10 if they sit a year early)

My daughter's school NLCS did not allow the resitting thing. I remember her being cross about it or not at some of the times.

I think the subjects do matter. My local comp does a lot of mechanics, childcare and tourism GCSEs. It got about 30% A - C GCSE including maths and ENglish. That rises to 52% if they take out maths and English.

I just came off a work callt o someone who mentioned an A level her son was doing somwhere for a potential career and he enjoys the A level. I did not like to tell her the A level is not the one to do for that subject. No one obviously told him it has a low reputation and will affect his career in the subject. Schools should not be doing that to chidlren.

I think where chidlren go after is a good indicator whatever theg rades. If you want tyhem to get jobs then mnay employers recruit from the better universities so if they get lots into those that's a good sign. If they don't however good the A levels are then that matters.

happygardening in 2011 PS average points score per student was 1041 compared to 1019 at Win Coll. I was simply using these statistics to illustrate my point that in my home town the gap between state and private education is perhaps narrower than in some other areas.

talkin they already started the courses early so 'jumped in' for the tail end of modular IYSWIM. Another cynical move IMHO.

The scores on the doors for this school are 97% 5 GCSEs. Hoorah.
Except many of these GCSEs will have been dragged out of the poor kids by resitting ad infinitum.

If you include English and Maths it's only 57%.

And no stats for EBAC...so I'll make my own assumptions.

Oh and the number of A*s is not big. No one got more than six last year. Probably because they were all sitting them Too Bloody Early...

Xenia pupils receiving crap advice on subject choice is a huge bugbear of mine!!!!

Many a bright student has scuppered their chances thorugh poor subject choice.

no mention of eng and maths TalkinPeace, 'tis a catholic school in Bury St Edmunds

having just worked out which school you are talking about (I love mining data sets!) nothing surprises me any more

"2011 PS average points score per student was 1041 compared to 1019 at Win Coll'
I dont fully understand points or what you get them for; A levels, AS levels, how many subjects you do? As far as I understand the boys at Win Coll only do three subjects as the Pre U is so much harder although each grade carries more points that the A level equivalent. They also don't do AS levels but ultimately points are irrelevant their university entrance figures and % of each grade are what most parents look at if looking at how successful a selective school is. The results should be significantly better than PS which I am aware is highly regarded not because its an independent school but because its highly selective school.

yes, 81% inc. eng and maths but still, zero for ebacc - how can that be considered a great or even good school

Yes, it was't law but it could have been. Her son adored the A level (not one of the real academic ones really but a subject he wants to study at university and perversely by taking it at A level he will have diminished his chances of studying it anywhere good which means he won't have the career he wants.

I don't entirely blame schools. Any parent with a brain or teenager can do a web search of university websites to see what A levels they like. If I at 15 before the itnernet could write to lots of universities with questions off my own bat I don't see why today's teenagers cannot do their research.

That's one reason I like league tables. Before they came out only those parents in the know knew that say Manchester Grammar was betetr than a local school with a nice shiny front. At least the tables give some raw data so parents without much knowledge can look things up.

Actually a quick look at the website of the school in question (another RC one) shows that the early taking of exams really impacted on the high ability students IMVHO.

The number of A *s is definitely low.

English - 6 students.
English Lit - 3
German - 0
Japanese - 0
History - 5

This is a massive cohort of kids. About 250 in the year. It is a faith school and has highly supportive parents...honestly it makes me so bloody cross.

TBH comparing Winchester and Peter Symonds is like comparing sandwiches with cars.
Incomparably different intake, scale and intention.

The interesting bit is that PSC gets really rather good point scores with an intake criteria of 5 A-C inc E&M
whereas WC and St Swithuns (to give the skirts a chance) do not have as significant an advantage as one would expect given the level of academic and financial selection they have undertaken in the years leading up to the exams.

pickled
tracking their data across, they appear not to be doing languages .... it is the one I thought :-)

"pickled a family memeber called me yesterday about her DC at an 'outstanding' school. She has DC in the smae school year and wanted to pick my brain.

In year 9 her DD has already started her GCSEs with a view to just getting them done. Resitting 'as many times as necessary'.

Wordfqctoy- you really need to call her back. Unless I have got it very wrong, what the school is doing does not fit the new GcSE criteria. I really don't think, unless I have misunderstood, that this is doable for this year's year 9s

TBH comparing Winchester and Peter Symonds is like comparing sandwiches with cars.
Incomparably different intake, scale and intention.

I realise that. I wasn't actually trying to compare the two, just to illustrate the point that based purely on results in Winchester the gap between state and independent schools is quite narrow.

ah, that explains it somewhat TiP

Wonder what the rationale was behind that particular decision .

it's a mixed school though, TiP, not boys