WHO CHECKS to see if schools apply their own entrance criteria FAIRLY?????????

[drosophila]

I live near a very sought after school (200 applicants for 200 places. I was having a chat with one of DS's friends mum and found out that she used to teach at said school. we had a chat about how good it was and why it was so good. I then asked her what would she do if DD didn't get into said school. Well she said that she could return to teaching there which would guarantee her a place (unofficially).

According to their criteria it is x number who pass exam, x number siblings and x locals. Nothing about teaching staff children. I was very suspicious of the number of siblings that were awarded places last year (135).

If schools bend the rules like this then how do we know how they don't bend the rules for a host of reasons? Who check it? Anyone know?

Er... siblings is usually one of the official criteria. I think it's after SN statement and before catchment in priority. Anyway...

In Norfolk there is a bloke at the County Hall who decides admissions, I imagine the school can make representations for exceptional circumstances outside of the usual criteria (SN statement, siblings, catchment, etc.), but mostly it has to go thru the LEA office; there will be paperwork for everything.

I think I will ask the council. The thing about the siblings is that I think it is an unusually high figure - 135 out of approx 200 places are awarded to siblings. This is where any rule bending admissions could be hidden.

She also told me that several of the teachers had children there. I can see the reasons why a school would want this but still any system should be transparent.

A different teacher from a different school once told me that when places become available mid term these places would not be filled strictly according to the school's criteria. It was seen as an opportunity to cherry pick from the waiting list. Afterall how can you appeal against non selection when you never knew a vacancy had occured.

Can't you appeal to the school if you don't get in? Do they have to demonstrate then how the criteria was adhered to? Gosh, this is worrying. Getting into school is so competitive, I would be very unhappy to not get in cause some other kid's mum got a job there. Although, what if you do appeal and it turns out you should have gotten in. But, if they've already awarded your place to someone else, what are they going to do? Surely they can't unaward the other kid's place.

Is this a church aided school? If so, I believe they can set there own entrance criteria.

I know a school in Twickenham that recently change the entrance criteria. Basically they bumped up the sybling one because a few years ago 2 twins applied, and one got in. The other one did end up getting in too because he was first on the waiting list and someone who was offered a place didn't take it so they both were in but it made them rethink the entrance criteria.

In our borough all admissions for the state primaries are made by the LEA under strict criteria - so the school has nothing to do with any jiggery pokery! Although they have taken away the sibling priority so it's based solely on catchment and distance from the school.

Church schools are different though. For having to fund a 'huge' 10% themselves, they get the ability to set their own criteria and admit whoever they like - fair huh?!

10% of the capital costs iirc
0% of the running costs

GDG, it's not really whoever they like. They have an established set of criteria which they publish and then follow (at least I hope they do!). And it is usually much like the LEA criteria except it adds foundation places (for regular church attenders)

I don't know where 10% comes from. I thought the arrangement is that they own and maintain the buildings. Perhaps that equates to 10%?

Haven't some MP's requested that when pupils apply to schools the school should not know what their Post Code or Surname is. I think is to do with the new White Paper. There is a clear implication that schools choose pupils for reasons other than those laid down in the criteria.

It's not a church school. Thankfully not too many of them round my way.

But if the school doesn't know the postcode of the child, how do they know who to choose? I think it is inappropriate for children to be travelling all over the city to school. It would be nice if children could go to their local school, or do I live in cloud cuckoo land.

I know people buy houses close to schools to get their kids in, but I don't know how the govt can legislate against it.

I have heard this teacher thing before - it is amazing how many selective schools select their teachers' children

Teachers childfren deffo get priority and it is put into the criteria

Put it another way if you were a teacher would you want to drop off in one school and then drive over to another different one

And then parents are complaining that the teachers don't stay around after school to chat to them or are late arriving in the morning

If you worked in an accountancy firm and your DS or DD wanted to be an accountant would you not use your contacts to get them a job?

IMHO It is fair enough

All the local schools round here give the children of teachers priority

But it's not in the published criteria of this school. I understand the logic but why not have it out in the open. It makes you suspect the school could select on other criteria other than what is published.

yes sorry went off on a tangent in my post

Weird that it is not published in criteria, have you looked on website of the school?

I vaguely recall reading that there had been a ruling in our local area that giving priority to the children of staff was unfair. I'm not sure how binding that decision was. Is it possible that something similar happened for the school in the OP and that's why they are hiding the fact that this criteria is still being used?

Just looked at the admissions criteria and there is no mention of parents teaching at the school unless it is included in 'medical or social reasons'.

I think it is against the DfES Code of Practice on admissions for places to be awarded to children of teachers . if you think the places are being allocated other than in accordance with the published criteria you could ask the local governement ombudsman to investigate if it is a VC/VA/foundation or community school. I think you have to make an application first , appeal and lose the appeal iyswim. best of luck!

Is it senior or infant school?

Drop, I would consider it a 'social' reason. Personally I think teaxhers children SHOULD get priority. It would make sure that they teach to their best ability as that is what they want for thier kids.

Interesting point. When I was at school (a loongg time ago) teacher's children did not usually go to the school where their parents taught. Got the impression it was about keeping their work and home lives separate, i.e. not wanting their children to bring friends home and them be the naughty ones! Is it quite common now for this to happen??

I only know of one (church-aided) school in my area that has teacher's children on the admissions policy. As a school governor, I am given the breakdown of places at my school. this will be available to all schools.

I think those schools which set their own criteria (ie those opted out of direct LEA control) can prioritise children of staff although, iirc, those which I had noticed, did so after SEN, siblings and religion , where applicable. It should be published as such though.