schools state-indie / move / my options

[olguis]

I am really grateful to anyone sparing any piece of advice for my individual situation.

I live in SE London; DS goes to a 'good' state primary; Y2. I've been having problems with his school since Y1, and it's ongoing. To cut it short, he doesn't learn much at school and all his progress is down to me working with him in the afternoons. I think I have lost faith in state education in England altogether. I don't know much about independent schools, though. I have grown up in another country and find it hard to interpret local schooling culture at times.

So, I am a single parent, full time employment, earning 40+, not eligible for anything. Half of my salary goes on rent+bills, another quater on au pair+music for DS+extra activities for DS, and then I scrape for food. It is really tight. Am I completely mad to think I can try to move him private? In SE, there is St.Dunstan's college, but it's 12.000 annually. If I don't have an au pair but have him in all after school activities (at school), will I manage full time work?

Should I move to some area which has cheaper indie schools? Am I setting myself for disaster?

I know my problem can seem really weird and completely ungrounded to some. I come from a completely different culture and currently am just in panic as I can't accept DS's schooling while failing to see any options. Maybe someone has got a brilliant idea and there are options I don't know about?

I would say scholarships are now very hotly contested and you would have to be very exceptional to get one at an academic school such as CLSB think grade 8 for instruments at 11 yrs old the child I know who got one was operating at least 3 years ahead of his actual age. Also the level of scholarships at CLSB has changed recently and are now 10- 50% of fees dependant on HM discretion.

As you are SE London, it may be worth your having a look at Dulwich College. They have both scholarships and bursaries available from year3.

The new(ish) headmaster has an extremely goi reputation, and the school is riding ever higher.

Winchester does offer very generous bursaries I'm not aware that they would insist you to sell your house unless it is very large with lots if equity in it lets face it we all have to live somewhere and they dont expect you to be homeless to pay the fees and from your OP it would appear you don't own one! Also you may be interested to know that they have links with schools in Lambeth with the aim of enabling bright boys from this borough to attend Win Coll ring and ask youve nothing to loose! St Paul's boys is also very generous with its bursaries although you would need to register very soon. Both these are super selective and Win Coll full boarding only and also don't resolve your current problem. Bursaries at prep level are often harder to find but you could try boarding preps as they are often struggling to fill their vacancies .

It's not the OP that's interested in Win Coll. I just mentioned it as I'd been quite surprised to discover that their scholarships no longer carry any automatic reduction in fees.

A quote from their bursary policy: The School would expect significant capital savings and investments to be used for the payment of school fees, as would equity values in houses.

Eton also offer bursaries currently they only guarantee bursaries of more than 50% to scholars but again it might worth thinking about. You're big problem is that they all start in yr 9.
Perhaps a move to Kent would be better the train links are improving and there are some nice areas with good primaries that are not as expensive as Sevenoaks Westerham between the pretty hideous Medway towns and Canterbury it is just commutable into London.

Surely this is how it should be? Bursaries are meant for people who really don't have the money not those who have it but don't want to free it up for whatever reason and spend it on school fees and I think all who offer decent bursaries will say the same. Friends applied for a bursary at Christs and were turned down flat they were told the same thing! They owned a second property which is their pension the school told them that they needed to decide what they wanted more a pension or their DC being educated at Christs. It's all about priorities.

Yes, I completely agree happygardening. I wasn't arguing against it. My point was that until recently in my mind the very word 'scholarship' implied some kind of financial mitigation. It was news to me that this is no longer the case.

DH and I are both teachers so we are not minted by any stretch of the imagination. We would like DS to benefit from the type of education DH had and expect to pay £30k+ for it. We will not qualify for any financial assistance- nor do we deserve to because we can afford it, just- as long as we never buy a bigger house, new cars or go on holiday! As you say, all about priorities.

A few points

1. Have you actually spoken to the teacher about your concerns? Most schools don't really 'get going' academically with children until Yr3 - the level of readiness for academic learning varies widely and lee-way is given for this in the early years. Whilst in great schools able children are stretched in yrs 1 and 2, it isn't always a given that this will happen and it may be that things only change up a gear at yr 3.
2. What do the other parents at the school think? We can't tell just from a few posts if it is the school that is out of the ordinary, or your own expectations that are out of the ordinary. You'll have to ask other parents and do the legwork on that one.
3. If you discover that the differences are more a reflection of the cultural approach to education then you may not find that perfect school. Are there any cultural groups that can fill the difference? There are probably a huge range of options in London for class-based tuition on Saturdays - this may suit your needs and budget better.
4. Cheaper prep schools can often be cheaper because (a) facilities have been cut to the bone or (b) teacher salaries have been cut to the bone. If you do look at private schools bear in mind that cheaper pre schools have limited budgets so you need to know clearly what they spend it on. You may get an academically worse school than state
5. If you get the good schools guide and start googling you should be able to come up with some options if you are prepared to move. All the boarding websites I've every looked at specify exactly how much scholarships are worth - usually 10-15% only of total fees
6. If you are applying for bursaries and the schools learns that your DS will be going abroad for holidays, be prepared to answer questions on the finances of your extended family - these will be taken into account, even if your family don't/won't/can't contribute a penny to help.
7. Be careful about moving to access better state schools. Lots of parents do this leading to oversubscription for the best schools, and you need to be sure that your DS will get into one of these schools. Moving to somewhere like Sevenoaks where grammar places are so oversubscribed that you struggle to find a place for your child within 20 miles is no help at all. Nor is moving to an 11+ area with a child that won't in all likelihood pass

randomname123 I agree with what your saying I would hope that the point you made
"If you are applying for bursaries and the schools learns that your DS will be going abroad for holidays, be prepared to answer questions on the finances of your extended family - these will be taken into account, even if your family don't/won't/can't contribute a penny to help."*
Hopefully the OP would be ok on this because she's using it as childcare to enable her to carry on paying the fees!
And "All the boarding websites I've every looked at specify exactly how much scholarships are worth - usually 10-15% only of total fees"
scholarships to boarding schools (not scholarships with a bursary top up) even a 10-15% financial award are uncommon I personally don't know of any but i'm sure there are some out there. IME scholarships with largish financial rewards and especially to senior boarding schools, are being significantly reduced if not completely taken away. The only positive the oft quoted "you cant get a bursary if you earn more than £40000 pa obviously doesn't apply to boarding schools when fees are starting at £30 000 pa.
Sadly I believe that in many cases a bursary is a scholarship by a different name!

Sorry to hear you are in this awful dilemma OP!

You have options and these include trusting your own judgement. I know you feel you made a mistake when viewing your DS current school, but I doubt you did. Teachers and Headteachers change a school and our children also change how they learn as they grow.

I have experience of the state and independent sector and the sacrifices needed to afford independent. Both DC received bursaries (30% and 35%) and DH earns over £40k so I guess bursary limits depend on each school. With DD school, we had to fill out a yearly statement detailing. We have only had to do this once with DS school, but we were asked about how much financial support we gain from grandparents and what our mortgage costs are. It is easier to gain a bursary once your DC is in a school and the worry about a cheaper school would be that there's less money to pay bursaries? As our DD school was in deep financial do-do, we know now to check with Companies House or the Charity Commisson's website. Wish we knew back then.

In your shoes, I'd certainly look at some other state schools first and consider tutors. An independent education can be a godsend but not if you never see your child because you have to work constantly.

Good luck and I'm sure you will make the right choice for you and your child.

Thanks to all again. I would very much like to believe that it is possible to get a good state education that you pay tax for - I think each country should have one, not just places like Scandinavia...

And true, what I liked about the school DS goes to when he was little was community spirit, pastoral care, etc. He hasn't had any bulling issues and feels safe and happy to play with other kids. He is a sensitive boy, was more so when 5, so that was of big importance.

But then, and I guess that is the core of my problem, I am unsatisfied with what other parents (nice ppl) don't seem to care much about. As I think they're nice people, I don't understand if that is my problem, or their low expectations.

I've told this story here a few times. R was ok; then Y1 had a change of teachers - 2/3 were done by a maternity leave cover, a very young nice teacher, but quite inexperienced. I often felt she weren't able to cover the material with all kids: I had a constant feeling that what DS learned and the termly plan we were presented with had nothing in common. Then, there was a change of teacher. I thought DS was quite behind in spelling, yet it seems the main business of parent evenings was to make parents feel good. Everything was/is always good.
Y1 new teacher disliked DS - and when I tried talking to her about the fact that he is both bored and not doing well, she bullied both me and him (in class, ripping pages out of his notebook, telling him sardonically 'ah, so, you're bored').

Sorry it is getting long. Y2 was not better. Planned teacher got ill last day before the start of year and we had supply till Christmas. She was awful. That's when I really started doing lots of work with DS. I realized in October Y2 he doesn't have mental recall for 9-2; and his spelling was atrocious. I even got him tested for dyslexia as I felt so weird; he is bright and not doing well; all parents are happy, not me. Dyslexia centre said he has no dyslexia, and of "extra superior intelligence" as they call it. So it got even weirder. He is bright but hasn't learned much in school. He can do very well, still it took me to teach him math and writing for him into top groups.

So, overall, thanks to all who got through such a long post. I guess I am generally just confused. I think I make other parents feel uncomfortable with my worry and I never got a sense it was shared. To be honest, though, one other parent told me that the school get good results because parents hire tutors later on. The teaching is not academically very rigourous.

I do supplement school a lot, but would love to imagine he could actually learn smth in school too. (To be fair, they taught him to read, I didn't have to do that). But he is rarely excited by school. He has good friends, and socialy it's ok; but whenever I ask you what they've done, he always tells me it's revision. His opinion they always revise.

Sorry for long post!

The financial side is scary. I have no property or assets, but still by the time DS goes to secondary I can be earning around 48-50 k. It would mean 2.800-3.000 after tax, and if you pay 1.500 for rent and bills, and 1.500 school fees, what do you eat?

"Holidays abroad" are 200 pounds worth of a flight and staying with my parents, it's not a resort type holiday.

Boarding, from how I understand it, wouldn't be good for DS. He is not sporty, physically not very strong, hates football; his best friend is a girl. And he does need me a lot.

Sadly your comments and concerns above are not uncommon and the reason so many turn to indie ed. although I would be the first to admit that this can often be far from perfect.
I suspect you should look at other schools both state and indie if he's that bright you should seriously consider a scholarship with a bursary top up as another poster has suggested Dulwich Prep (are there two with similar names i cant remember it was a long time ago when we lived there) or Alleyns Prep is worth considering. Oakfield Prep was (13 yrs ago!) unbelievably pushy don't know what its like now but many like it!

Mutterloo do you mean you first get a place and start school and then apply for a bursary? Thanks for advice!

Re: boarding not boarding schools are cold showers, lots of team sports and boys only and you are looking at a 7 yr old they do change enormously. All our children do need us but they are also growing up physically and mentally and boarding is probably not what you think it is!!

Re: bursaries some schools will give you an indication of how much of a bursary they will offer before you sit their entrance exams. It varies but its definitely worth speaking honestly to the bursar before you take the admission process to far to save a lot of wasted time and emotion on you and your DS's part.

There are also good State schools out there. I really don't recognise your description of school from anything my kids have encountered in their years at school. The worst teacher we ever had, was far superior to those you have encountered (and I came close to withdrawing my son and sending him private when he had her).
I would suggest you look at all the factors, where you work, where you can live, and what schools are available.

I would beware, as actually what might suit him is a less obviously "rigorous" school but one which gets the best out of all pupils.

Have pm'd you in case it helps.